HTC slaps phone firmware site with cease and desist letter
By Chris Ziegler 
posted June 17th 2010 9:47PM
posted June 17th 2010 9:47PM
You might be familiar with firmware impresario Conflipper by now, a man who's earned a reputation tearing apart ROMs -- often for unreleased devices -- and pulling out the juicy bits for everyone to see. Turns out the dude runs a site called Shipped ROMs with... yes, you guessed it, a bunch of shipped ROMs for a wide variety of phones on it, and it seems HTC's legal cats in Taiwan have taken issue, saying they've got "very strong reasons to believe that the HTC Intellectual Property was illegally obtained by fraudulent means" in a strongly-worded cease and desist letter sent to him earlier today. We reached out to HTC's US branch for comment and got back the following:In other words, these guys are just really against hosting official ROMs on unofficial servers. Anyone can dump a ROM from a phone and flesh it out, so we can't imagine there's any competitive concern -- and no first-party site makes so many firmware builds available for so many devices in such a concise, well-organized way as Shipped ROMs is doing. Ultimately, it's HTC's property -- it seems like they're probably in the legal right here -- but the unsavory PR effect with some of the company's staunchest enthusiasts makes the endeavor more trouble than it's worth, we'd argue. Tread carefully, HTC."While HTC tries to take a hands off [approach] about the modder / ROM chef community, this site's sole purpose [is] to make HTC's content available for download from a source other than HTC. That content is not just the open source parts and kernels of Android but all of the software that HTC itself has developed. This is a clear violation of our copyrights and HTC needs to defend itself in these cases."
It's a legal post and Nilay didn't write it?
Chris, come on man.
In hindsight, my comment seems unduly and unintentionally harsh, so I'd like to elaborate: I would've preferred Nilay do this post because Nilay happens to be a lawyer with valuable insight into these matters, which would've allowed for an interestingly informative reading.
As much as I like Chris (Chris, if I recall correctly, we met at CES this year during Press Day, along with Nilay, Josh, etc.), this post just would've made more sense with Nilay as the author.
Apple didn't pay nilay to do so.
How is that "strongly-worded". It sounds like a "nice, job there. You're doing a great job and we don't usually annoy you guys, but legally a few too many people are starting to notice, so yea stop and such."
Yea, always walking a fine line with this open source modding stuff.
@Templarian Who are you replying to?
@Bryant It's not really a nuanced case. To think Nilay would've brought much more, if anything to the table, is over-rating him a bit and as I've seen here before when he clearly is as vague as a lawyer who doesn't want to give bad advice/interpretation on the web without getting a consulting fee (I like you went with an overly harsh critic).
Perhaps there's a reason this came out of Chris's mouth, conferring with Nilay and Nilay being too busy, or whatever. It's Engadget, I don't think Chris just saw this and ran with it, let them do their thing.
@Bryant
Congrats. You're the latest victim of post-jacking.
You can thank Templarian later. Or right now, it's entirely up to you.
@Templarian
... what they showed was not the "strongly worded" cease and desist letter. (Notice, there's no actual cease or desist).
What they showed was the HTC's official quote on the matter that Engadget requested.
@Bryant
Sending a Cease and Desist letter is just a company's way of putting it on record that they are protecting their intellectual property. Nothing new here. Surprised it took them this long. And yes, they have to, or before you know it I will be claiming it as mine.
@Roger Moore
I'm fully aware of what a C&D is.
@Bryant
Shut up Apple Hater....go to another website if you hate Engadgets writers so so much.
@BrookLynnsFinest
Someone likes another brand than the almighty Apple? APPLE HATER I SAY!
Seriously, your world must be an interesting one. Such a black and white view of the world.
@BrookLynnsFinest
What does Apple have to do with anything? He admitted to being too harsh and said nothing about Apple at all.
But you seem to live in this world where everyone that doesn't like or own every Apple product ever made is an "Apple Hater."
@Bryant Er, the article. It says HTC's letter was "strongly worded".
@Bryant I was podcasting! Chris and I talked it over though, he's got it down -- it's just a letter, after all.
@Nilay Patel
Serves me right for not hearing the podcast.
How come you guys are filming The Engadget Show during Pepcom!? I'll have to miss it because of this :( (meh, I'll peg you guys for a media ticket tomorrow)
@potretr
Funny that you mention Apple in a post about HTC being all closed and stuff. I wonder why um u know HTC is you know like other companies. Who'd of thought
@Cy Starkman
sorry personal pet peeve. "Who would have thought" Who'd have thought. not "of" that word makes no sense.
@Cy Starkman
err...
did you read the comment HTC gave, they dont mind a lotof their stuff being used:
'That content is not just the open source parts and kernels of Android but all of the software that HTC itself has developed.'
so basically, anything theyve made, hes got hold of and put up for availability, ANY company would send a C&D letter in this case
apple would have raided the guys house ;P
but yeah, they dont have a problem with open source stuff being used, but their intellectual property, i bet you cant find a company that doesnt mind their intellectual property being used :)
@Canterrain, oh yea, I read it as they requested the cease and desist letter. Also more of a comment jacking.
@Bryant Well I am a lawyer who litigates intellectual property issues so I will comment on your comment.
You are right that a lawyer/writer would have provided valuable insights into this action by HTC. I suppose the argument could be made that since this is a laypersons site a lawyer's analysis (even with a lay spin to it) might have been inappropriate, but not so.
IMHO this article misses the point on WHY HTC sent the cease and desist letter. (A non-lawyer would not know that, hence failing to talk about this important point.)
Simply put, in any competitive business litigation case where the Plaintiff makes a claim that the defendant stole its intellectual property, the main defense is that the Plaintiff did not take steps to protect the alleged stolen intellectual property.
The argument goes that: "I can't be guilty of stealing your property if it's available for free all over the internet and/or you did not do anything about it nor take steps to protect it." In legal circles words such as "waiver" and "waived" become applicable.
HTC's response to this defense would be "That is not true, HTC aggressively takes steps to protect its intellectual property rights, including sending cease and desist letters, and when the violator does not stop we then pursue litigation."
In some cases and jurisdictions this cease and desist letter is a legally required first step BEFORE a company can file an action in court.
So this isn't really HTC being jerks or flunking at the PR game. They have to do this otherwise they may be foreclosed from pursuing these types of claims, even those that have merit.
Of note, sometimes the software on those ROMs isn't even HTC's because phone companies bundle copyrighted and licensed 3rd party software into their ROMs-on some smartphones that can include some fairly expensive software. Still, the modder community is definitely not gonna appreciate this since it'd make it harder to obtain the ROMs they base their own builds off of. Far as I can tell most modded ROMs for HTC phones have treaded carefully and avoided packaging stuff not licensed. But I suspect that HTC is mostly concerned about Sense UI being hacked onto competitor phones more than anything-if anybody can download it and put it on a Motorola Droid X then HTC obviously has a problem with that.
well, this isnt gonna help, theyll just upload them all on a new site
@marsel Or just keep them cluttered on the other sites that HTC doesn't have the time/patience to flesh out as an illegal hosting site with no other practical purpose.
@marsel
Seriously, f*ck off, HTC. It's just ROMs that they should have ready to download for everyone.
@marsel
And if they do that and HTC finds out, then they'll have A LOT more to deal with than just a simple C&D letter.
@tklr08
I don't know about that. Google did a C&D when it came to their Google branded apps.
Both Google and HTC have a very hands off policy when coming to custom/cooked roms, but they have a responsibility to protect their IP in case it gets used by competitors.
Seems pretty reasonable. They leave modders alone. They just don't want their software on some site other than their own.
@somekindarobit
I agree - the main issue here was they got the Sense UI to work on the Droid and Nexus One, not that their ROMS were on unofficial servers. HTC has left other modders alone who repackaged Android 2.1 with Sense for older HTC devices still running 1.5 or 1.6. If I owned a company who spent time and money developing the best UI for Android, and found it was being installed on other company's devices who don't take as much care with their UI, I would be asking them to stop too.
Dear HTC,
I can't side with you on ROMs until you fix the Evo's 30FPS cap.
Cheers.
@juanvaldez
Or the Incredible's locked NAND.
Just because you CAN do something doesn't make it right. People that cross legal boundaries should be prepared to accept the consequences.
With that said, going after enthusiasts isn't very wise either.
@jolt I think this is the case where, and you kind of point it out, just because HTC *CAN* do something doesn't make it right. Let's think about this from both a $, PR and IP angles.
$ - do you think they are losing sales due to this site, I'd guess so, more in PR.
PR - do you think that the sales they are losing will go right to their bottom line after bad PR on ROMs and build quality recently? I think they have to do more to keep their existing customers happy rather than getting in the news in other ways.
IP - And this is my main point, and also the fact that it's something that is clearly pointed out in their response. Do you think that their IP, assuming someone wants it, can't be easily taken by the parties that want it without this website existing? Clearly, their main defense just seems a bit weak IMVHO.
Feel free to respond, I'm not entirely confident in what I've said, just thinking out-loud here. I just don't think this will help them financially or IP wise, while costing a bit in PR (which is at least half negative on Engadget recently even though the editors seem to like the flagship phone).
@juanvaldez delete "both" from first line, I decided to add IP or PR in their and forgot to *EDIT*.
Does this have anything to do with flash 10.1 available for the EVO? I forget the site but it's available now without rooting. I've registered with the download site but waiting on my confirm email. 2 hours now! Anybody?
Well I'm glad I found Shipped-ROMs. It's a fantastic site.
My Samsung i8910 has GREAT potential, but Samsung blew it with their TERRIBLE firmware.
That’s why i use a cooked ROM...and its never been better.
This is what happens when a company lets its lawyers start making policy. They don't get that one of the reasons HTC is so popular is because they have, up until now almost been the antithesis of Apple's closed nature. They slimly acknowledge this in the opening of the quote.... "We take a hands off approach"
I agree they had better tread lightly.
This is just plain old crazy...why would HTC do this, especially after all the bad press lately with the Evo's screen, graphics, and build quality issues? Unbelievable. These IP wars are just insane...IP is the oil of the 21st century.
@DoctarPeppar
The "bad press" is only on sites like Engagdget, whose readers are usually more technical than 95% of the population. So, your average consumer looking to buy an EVO won't know or care about the screen defect and most certainly won't care about the FPS issue.
Then you have people who will buy one regardless.
@DoctarPeppar Forgot the ironic one, the bad press with HTC firmware on the EVO, maybe that's what you were saying by graphics.
@juanvaldez
By graphics i meant the 30fps cap.
And there are tons of other sites hosting stuff about the evo's issues -- and believe it or not, even joe internet user reads tech blogs nowadays, especially someone whos inclined to buy an android smartphone as well.
@PBB Bad press is bad press, the same 95% you refer to will have little to no knowledge on the good press of HTC. HTC up until now has thrived on both cheap and high-end devices, to think that bad press on their high-end enthusiast phones isn't important is being a bit oversimplistic.
Aw... HTC trying to act like a real company... that is ADOOOORABLE!!!!!
@Wesscoast
Now HTC itself is doing what it stood against for the past 6-7 years.
I used to like HTC for its openness. If this continues to happen, my next phone will be probably a Droid.
@hasnainhyder1 HTC make the droid....
@hasnainhyder1 Huh? HTC makes iterations of the Verizon Droid model (a name that Verizon uses for phones, via license from Lucasfilm Ltd) You meant to refer to Motorola.
No matter, Motorola has sent quite a few cease and desist letters on their handsets. So you will have to buy from someone else.
Maybe check out what phones TracFone prepaid has. I'm sure some of their free base model phones have not generated such nasty letters. LOL.
So much for open.....
@Sonicjet
So much for knowing what the word open means lol
As you said, HTC is absolutely in the right here.
Hard to side with this guy dragging them through the mud for trying to protect their own property.
Especially considering the cease and desist has pretty clear language threatening legal action for sharing it with other parties which he is pretty flagrantly doing.