Professors banning in-class laptop use
By Evan Blass 
posted May 3rd 2006 10:14AM
posted May 3rd 2006 10:14AM
In yet another sign
that Luddism is alive and well in academia (remember Lakehead University's silly WiFi ban?), the
Associated Press has picked up on a disturbing "trend" of professors banning laptops in their classrooms.
Unlike the WiFi brouhaha, which revolved around fears that the wireless signals might be dangerous, keeping laptops out
of the lecture hall is seen as a way of forcing students to pay attention. The AP article cites several law school
professors who have enacted the ban, including one whose inspiration came while serving as an expert witness in a
trial, when he realized the court stenographer wasn't absorbing any of the content that he/she was transcribing. If you
ask us, not only does this policy fail to address the root of a problem -- hey Prof, try making your classes more
interesting if you want people to pay attention -- but considering what students are paying for a higher education
these days, they should be allowed to lug a mainframe and three monitors to class if that's how they like to get their
learnin' done.
I disagree. Unless they are integral to a class, laptops should be off. Cell phones, too. It's distracting to the student, to those sitting around them, and to the teacher.
halfs of the people who bring laptops are surfing webpages or playing world of warcraft, so really I'm on the fence with this one.
I agree with above. I graduated in 03 and laptops were kind of a rarity at that point. However, I'm not excited about laptop proliferation when I enroll in grad school in the fall. If I were convinced that students were using laptops only to take notes -- and I'm not -- I'd be okay with it. However, I find them to be mostly distracting and disrespectful.
And professors making their classes more "interesting," whatever that means, might not be the answer. Perhaps we can all learn to exist without gadgets for 50 minute blocks at a time and absorb information from someone who might know what they're talking about.
Its not distrubing, it makes sense. I go to Carnegie Mellon University, one of the highest tech places on earth. In many classes, using a laptop is pointless. People who use laptops in these classes use them to check e-mail and surf the web. Not only do these students not pay attention, but they distract all the people around them. Of course there are classes that require the use of a computer, and they are obviously good for homework, but if you are in Math class, there is very little productive you can do on a laptop (at least related to the course).
Disagree. The prof can do pretty much whatever he/she wants in a class, and if that means preventing them from playing 50 minutes of Snood, so be it. So a student has to take notes by hand. Big whoop. If it really hurts your hand that badly, then you can get a disability waiver from the university.
Some classes in fact benefit from such bans.
For example math: sole purpose of the subject is to evolve your brain. But if you will be offloading work prof gives for *your* brain to say MathCAD/MathLab/etc - the net result will be close to zero.
Experience have already shown, such practice pays back. I never being good math, but in the end (graduation years) I pared much better to the "MathCAD geniuses".
I semi-agree. If someone wants to pay for an education and the professor says I can't have that laptop in his class I think I might just laugh at him/her. If that is the way I'm taking notes / recording his lectures then what honestly can he do about it? (Just don't EVER use your real name if he asks...)
On the other hand I have seen the 17 inch Mac laptops and huge Dell laptops in some of my classes and even if the person is sitting in the front if they start playing a game or if their cute/obnoxious/interesting screen-saver comes on everyone in the 20 rows behind them can see it.
I personally would advocate something that says laptop useage in the classroom is dependant on the person. Everyone starts out have the right to use their laptop, but the professor also has the right to ask you to spin your laptop around at any point and show him what's on your screen.
However, on top of all this I most heartily agree, some of the best teachers I have ever had have had the most minimul laptop usesage in their classes.
Most of the classes I went to the teacher did'nt put any more thought into the presentation than reading out of the book. It's not that hard to read the same thing at home. Not to mention, if you are actually playing attention and taking notes on your lappy 400, just think of all the trees you're saving by not writing out your notes.
If you're that easily distracted that you can't pay attention to what you are doing when surrounded by the tapping of keys, you will never make it in todays business world anyways.
I can see it now: "Boss, I can't get that project to you on time, Jim was typing all day long and it just threw off my concentration."
only tablet pc's should be allowed :-P
I think it is the professor's right. Those students aren't forced to attend the school or the class. If they want to use a laptop whenever they want, there is a place in their parent's basement for them and a job a Dairy Queen waiting for them. No student I've ever seen with a laptop is using it for educational reasons in a class. I, for one, used it for playing Starcraft against other students in the class (no WiFi in some of the buildings so we made our own adhoc networks) and to play World of Warcraft and use AIM in the places that did have WiFi.
I agree with #1. Laptops in class are extremely distracting. If everyone had tablet pc's, that might be ok. But, the clatter of 40 keyboards in a small classroom would make it very difficult to concentrate, not to mention the din that would be caused by 200 laptops in an acoustically amplifying lecture hall.
More power to the Prof! I agree with him totally, and calling it Luddism is totally missing the point. By the time you get to university you should be capable of teaching yourself. Tutors and Professors are there to present the correct information to you, and explain whatever isn't clear; Not to provide a multimedia-enriched entertainment experience - You're not a little kid anymore! While the teacher has the floor you should be paying attention, not dossing. If you disagree with this, you should be flipping burgers, not going to school.
First, I agree that for most courses the laptop offers no advantages for taking notes then paper. In fact, there are numerous tasks that are amazingly easy on paper and next to impossible on a laptop (a table PC maybe).
Second, I also agree that most people are using their laptops in class to surf the web, check their email, play games, watch movies, listen to music, or do homework. Rarely do I see anyone taking notes in class.
Third, laptops are noisy and obstructive to other students. Its hard to pay attention to the professor when the student in front of you is watching Family Guy.
Fourth, just because youre paying an arm and a leg for the Privilege to attend a post secondary institution doesnt mean you have the Right to do what you want. You are not paying for a service and the professors are not in your employment.
I disagree, too. I used to teach literature at Columbia and I did everything I could to discourage my students from taking notes in class (hand-written, no less -- this was in the days before laptops were common). It seems clear to me that you can either listen and participate, or log what the prof is saying, but not both. And, of course, I much prefer the former.
Moreover, and more interestngly, I think you're taking a position which is common these days, but misguided, in your claim that students should be allowed to do whatever they want in class. Education is not a standard consumer service; just because the students are (in most but not all cases) paying the school, hence paying the teachers, that doesn't mean the teachers are their employees. In this regard, anyway, it's more like a police force, where you pay into a system with the understanding that the system, in some instances, gets to tell you what to do. In my classroom, I set the rules, and if you don't like them, take another class, or find another school. If I were still teaching (and perhaps this explains why I'm not) I certainly wouldn't allow laptops in my classroom, for note-taking or poker-playing.
My dental school required us to purchase laptops and required us to purchase DVD textbooks every year so that we could take notes in class. Well the electronic notes were so bad and the DVD so useless that by my final year no one was really using the laptops for educational purposes in class so professors would just tell everyone (including those taking notes on computer) to just close their laptops.
Re. students paying for their education, I suspect most of the time it's often their parents paying, and their parents would expect them to be sitting down and paying attention.
I'm all in favour of using technology in the classroom, and using wireless/mobile devices, but they really do need to be (a) integrated into the instruction and (b) isolated from the Internet (local networks okay maybe).
I think professors need to be lenient and allow for laptop usage. I mean come on this is 2006!!! Everyone's got a laptop and we rely on it. Who writes notes on paper anymore??
It seems that most people disagree with the position of this article, and I would have to add myself to that group.
The line that I found most disagreeable though was: "...hey Prof, try making your classes more interesting if you want people to pay attention." Where it may be true that many professors are about as exciting as a tree, it is the students responsibility to learn. I can see no reason why having a computer is necessary or helpful during a lecture. Transcribing from a dictation recorder later is a better method, since it allows the student to pay attention during class and transcribe later.
Being distracted in class is not the fault of the laptop, but the fault of the student and, to some degree depending on the size of the class, the instructor. I have spent many years on both sides of the lectern and it really does come down to personal involvement.
I purchased an IBM/Lenovo Thinkpad X41 *tablet* laptop for the express purpose of taking notes in class. When folded into tablet mode running MS OneNote, it becomes no more distracting than a normal paper notebook. Yes the *temptation* may be there to check email, etc. but my sense of professionalism as a student prevents me from doing so.
Even without a laptop, students are still able to 'zone out'. However, I also agree with (1) in that distractions to other students or the instructor should be minimized. But then what's next? Will there be a ban on papers, textbooks, cellphones, clicky-pens, and the attractive co-student all as possible distractions? ;)
Sure the students pay to be there (or their parents pay), but that doesn't mean they have the right to bring machine guns, or laptops, or countless other items that don't contribute to their learning. They also don't pay for grades. The classroom is a controlled environment, and if the teacher thinks that laptops are distracting, it't the teacher's call. Those who don't want to abide by the rules are free not to pay (though of course they won't get the education that way either).
Laptops are great for taking notes, but they're also distracting. I know, because I'm at the office, and I should be working, not posting to this comment board.
So much better if they got the best solution out:
"Video podcasts"
See, if the whole lecture is recorded (to watch at home), anyone can use them to make their computer notes at home where it wont distract anyone (and they will have enough time to type in everything needed)
They can also spend their time in the lecture listening to him/her rather than worrying about condensing the information into useful notes
I totally agree with these professors. The basic points have been stated above so I won't repeat them, just throwing my vote in on the side of these professors.
"If you ask us, not only does this policy fail to address the root of a problem -- hey Prof, try making your classes more interesting if you want people to pay attention -- but considering what students are paying for a higher education these days, they should be allowed to lug a mainframe and three monitors to class if that's how they like to get their learnin' done."
It is a reality that all the professors are not equally attractive and it is also true that all the students are not equally hardworking. I think that bringing laptops are only distraction for the class. If you do not like the lecture of a professor then do not go for his course in the first place.
I've conducted training classes for fellow engineers and having their laptops in the classroom is always a problem.
It doesn't matter how interesting your lecture is, or even how important it is for success of the business. People will be people and they will get distracted by an urgent email or reading engadget and won't absorb the lecture material.
I agree that professors should be able to control their classrooms. If that means banning laptops, so be it. I used to take notes on one, and occasionally would have to put it away because a professor would pull me aside after class and tell me that other students were finding it distracting. No problem.
However, usually it wasn't me that was being distracting. It was the guy two rows in front of me that had his laptop open to eTrade, AIM, and ESPN simultaneously. I can tell you that laptops were almost never a problem in the classes that didn't have WiFi access....
Also, RE: #18, maybe you're a much more devoted student than I, but I can tell you that if the lectures were available for download, I never would have gone to class. Putting up the slides that a professor uses is one thing, it's a nice key to memory so you don't have to worry as much about taking notes at the time. Putting up the lectures themselves is a ticket to an empty lecture hall.
This is in line with a trend toward banning Blackberry devices, laptops, and cell phones during business meetings. Few Engadget readers would argue that wireless technology is worthless, but it isn't always necessary, either. Hell, I am totally in favor of WiFi and cellular jammers in certain public places, e.g., theaters and classrooms. If you need to check your MySpace page that badly, go to a freakin' Starbucks. There's one on every block.
I'm a law student, and I think this is ridiculous. This would require asking 85-90% of the class to take handwritten notes. Everyone brings in a laptop, and while I see a lot of things on others' screens, the majority of people are diligently taking notes. With the amount of material in law school, it is just not rational to think that students would be better off without the ease of computer organization.
Secondly, we are given so many cases and materials online that it would cost a small fortune and a couple rainforests if we all printed them out.
Finally, It isn't how much I pay that would make me mad. Or the fact that the bar requires attendance and I can't just skip like one poster suggested. It is just the best way to do things, whether the professor likes it or not. I have found that the people taking handwritten notes are usually daydreaming more than me anyway.
I am extremely dependent on a laptop for use in classes. If I don't have the laptop to take notes on and keep my focus sharp, I am likely to have trouble paying attention. I never open any programs, including an internet browser, other than notepad, during class time. It's a tiny laptop, with a quiet keyboard, and I don't even have any games installed on it. I also sit in the back where no one could be distracted by my (10-inch) screen. I'd love to find a way to do that and show my professor my screen as well, to assuage their suspicion.
And yes... I do have a note in my disability file that mentions my laptop, because otherwise I would need to use a note-taker (someone in the classes being paid to xerox their notes for me), due to my disabilities, and this way I can actually take my own notes. And the speed of typing, as compared to writing, allows me to write down the things that will actually be useful - the anecdotes or asides by the teacher that aren't mentioned in the textbook - as well as the things that may be duplicated in the professor's notes or text.
Yes, my hand cramps up every time I have to take a long test. But I much prefer that to being in slight pain every day from writing all day. Maybe it's because I'm lefthanded and was one of those people that adapted by craning my hand around the top of the paper. But I really doubt that any students can get a note from the disability office based on hand pain alone.
Having just graduated in December I totally agree with this article. About 80% of my professors in college just read and distributed notes out of a text. Not only did they make boring classes, but had overly strict attendance so you had to go and listen to them read a book to you.
I personally used a sidekick or pocketpc during classes and still pulled off about a 3.5 in my major just by reading the text. With a few exceptions my professors were useless, as was college in general.
I find myself wishing I went to a technical school instead of college. Before someone chimes in with a "That's what you get at community college" comment, I went to a satellite Penn State campus. The education system as a whole needs an overhaul from the bottom up in this country.
I use my laptop in three of my classes; my econ class, my english class, and my psych class. Do I browse the internet? Of course, but it's only ever so often when the teacher is mindlessly reading a powerpoint slide he/she made. I'd really say that about 1/4 of the kids in my lecture classes have laptops whether they choose to take them out or not is up to them. I for one like downloading the powepoint slides and with my tablet pc I write notes 'in the margins'. I think it's a great solution to taking notes and actually lets me pay more attention to the teacher rather than focusing on the last sentence he said as I try to write it down. Sure kids are gonna web browse, but it's their grades, and you can't tell me they wouldn't get distracted with anything else...text messages anyone?
As a pastor and a professor, I do not want students or parishioners to be focusing on taking notes. The purpose of a sermon or lecture is to engage the mind, not to transmit information. (There are much more efficient ways to transmit information.)
Research has shown that people who are writing down everything that is being said are not fully engaged.
And to the issue of a boring class, yes it is the responsibility of the instructor to make the class interesting. But part of that is to create an environment free of outside distractions.
Rod
Laptops are the norm here in law school. *shrug*
If anyone has ever sat in the back row of a lecture hall while students were using laptops, they'll have most likely seen hundreds of screens full of solitare, myspace, outlook and hotmail. I'm sure some students actually benefit academically from taking notes via computer, but they are in the minority. College students seem to have entitlement issues these days, and I think that is the real problem here.
In many cases just going to the class is a big waste of time. If someone wants to do a little multi-tasking-- let them. Some professors are just insecure, often just regurgitating what is in the text book they prescribed. So I say bring the laptop and tell the professor to kiss your ass when they approach you with their policyThe whole situation bubbles down to harassment and students should be complaining to the profs superiors.
It's a violation of the American Disabilities Act, if the ban involves a student under ADA need to have one... of course now all the students will have some kind of "learning disability" requiring a laptop, now that I've said this :)
Laptops are absolutly ubiquitous in my law school. And so often they're not being used for school stuff. I can think of one class where to my left is partypoker.com guy, to my right is MAME guy, and in front of me is victoria's secret guy, and next to him is flash-game girl. It's absurd that people pay $24,000 to sit and play games and ignore class. And this is different from them just "zoning out" or not showing up or doodling in a notebook in that each one of them is creating a 15" colorful flashing attention grabber within a few feet of me... it's terribly distracting.
I agree with the article and disagree with almost every one of the comments so far. A paradigm shift needs to happen where students and professors realize that laptops are not a distraction but a tool to enhance learning. I am sure the same shift happened when students started taking notes in class with paper and a pencil, and this is no longer considered a distraction or rude.
I am also disturbed by the former Columbia professor's comments about discouraging note taking in general. I agree that the professor gets to set the rule and that class participation is a very good thing, but when it conflicts with a student's learning styles and there ability to review what they learned in class, then this policy may infact hurt some students.
I am working on a post about this very subject for my blog. I will have it posted in a week or so. Please read it and feel free to disagree. http://k12edtech.blogspot.com
Banning in-class notebook pc use should increase, IMO. I allowed the use of notebook pcs in my last class, and the leading excuse for those students (using notebooks) for not having good notes was that their computer crashed/died.
"The Internet ate my homework" has now become the official excuse for the 21st century.
there has been a disturbing paradigm shift in the last decade. Once upon a time, students were fortunate to have education opportunities and would have to do whatever was required. You think in 1940 people would try and dictate the terms of their professor's class? School has now become a battle for things that students feel they are entitled to, for whatever reason. It's your education, but it's their class. You're mad? Don't go to school there. Upset because you're paying? Don't pay to go there.
This has nothing to do with laptops for me, sure they're used in some classes...it's about ACCEPTING the fact that you are not your own boss when you go to school. You pay to be told what to do in order to earn your degree. And you either accept those terms or not. But students today have a disgusting sense of indignance about them for things that are normal decisions from respected professors. Get over it, and if you don't like it, get out.
Professors are such primadonnas.
How ridiculous. How fragile is your concentration if you can't even tune out a laptop? Assuming that the sound is turned off, what is there to be distracting? Also, @ 18, I think video podcasts would be a slick idea, but I can tell you that I don't see that happening anytime soon. I am a computer science major in 400 level classes and I actually have a prof who says that he won't accept emails. :(
This was on slashdot MONTHS ago.
NeoteriX is right. Do you need them in a single undergrad class ever? No, those classes are like high school, if you show up every day, you would have to try to not get an A. But in my law school, even the students who are ranked near the top of the class would struggle without their notebook PCs. Do I check my mail or browse the web? absolutley depends on the class and the teachers style. Some of the classes are so intense you could not possibly divert your attention, in others it's easy to drop in and out without missing a thing. Even the only straight-lecture class I've had in law school required us to use notebook PCs, not to mention the socratic method classes. If you are seriously bothered by the sound of rain, because that is what it sounds like with 50-90 of us in a room at once, then perhaps your level of concentration isn't up for law/grad school. I'm just saying, undergrad is nothing like this and should never allow notebooks. Law school is a different story.
I've never seen anyone use laptops in-class for a good reason. They are always chattin, or listenin to music or whatever. It IS distracting.
Everyone has different learning styles. So ban someone's laptop on an individual basis if they are causing harm to other's learning experience, but for crying out loud, don't require someone to use a learning style that's less efficient for them.
I use a laptop at college... actually thats what I'm doing right now. Don't worry I'm on my break time. I find that the laptop is very good for taking notes since I can type at 75 kpm and write at a very slow 20 lpm.
Banning laptops is pointless. It is solely the student's responsibility to pay attention. If you're distracted by flashy colors, god only know how you survive a commute with billboards along the way.
Yes, I take my laptop to class, but only one, my CS class. No it's not required there, and yes I typically browse the Internet and talk on AIM. But guess what? It's also my highest grade. I can sit and listen and absorb information while he drones on and on. I tried a few classes without the laptop and it turns out that "distraction" keeps me awake and alert to hear anything that might be slightly useful.
I have a Dell 700m so it's a small footprint and I turn the screen brightness down to A) save battery life, and B) not distract anyone.
Oh, and I absolutely agree that I'm paying tuition, and I'm not paying to get some tenured asshole to mess around with me or bored me to death. I'll be whatever I need to do to get the grades in the class. It's the teachers responsibility to present the information they claim to be so passionate about in a passionate and engaging way. If it's not passionate and engaging, you're damn right I'll do what I want. No, I don't have to go to the school, but I'm sure as hell at least finishing the semester I've already paid for. Sadly, I think that tenure is the problem here. "It's "their" classroom." They should have the option to be fired if they suck when they get tenure just as I have the option to not go the school. We'll see how much it matters to have your own classroom when zero dollars are flowing in from students.
It all comes down to my responsibility to get the grades. If I can do it with a laptop, leave me alone. I did the work to get into the college I now go to, let me continue to do it my way.
Oh, and it's not a community college, its the second oldest college in America.
When I was in college, laptops were rare; the first real laptop (i.e., it had a floppy drive and could run DOS) came out my freshman year. I'm currently in grad school, in computer science, and I've never yet seen a student using a laptop in class (after 6 courses), not even in the one class where the professor was just reading off the contents of the book.
I occasionally pull out my Zaurus when I want to hack something to try out what the professor just said; but that's a lot less distracting.
I'm not sure what the difference is—maybe because most of the professors at my school give out hardcopies of their slides, so the easiest way to take notes is by writing on the slides.
puh_fifer wrote:
"Before someone chimes in with a 'That's what you get at community college' comment, I went to a satellite Penn State campus."
Get a clue. Penn State satellite campuses *are* community colleges.
Talking to some recent grads, once Wi-Fi came in, now most of these students are surfing and IMing in class. It's distracting. I support this ban.
As to the people who say that the prof just reads the text to them, just don't show up for class. That's what I did, and I went to school long before the class status was updated on a web page. I ran the risk of missing tests and had to go through the trouble of finding out what the prof was covering through other means. Nowadays, you can see the assignments on the web and read them without going to class.
I know there are classes where laptops are useful, but in large lectures, they probably should be out.
And look, we've got a law school bunghole in here. Oh yeah, keep on with that "Paper Chase" stuff. Keep thinking that law school is so much different than everything else, sooo much tougher. Only thing worse than the flood of worthless lawyers is the law profs and their Socratic methods, emphasizing the length of their johnson by comparing their knowledge to that of students.
The AP article was about law schools and many like mine, require the students to purchase a laptop. Class is like anything in life, its what you make of it. It's easy to see on the screens in front of you all of the "multitasking" going on. However, many students only use their laptops for taking notes or looking up cases, definitions etc on the internet. The laptop is a useful tool,if I miss a class, I can get notes emailed from a friend. Some of the professors have banned them at my school, but it won't force students to pay attention, and will make it more difficult for the students.
WOW i just had to comment on this because I AM A TOTAL LAPTOP JUNKIE IN ALL OF MY CLASSES. All of you people are the ones being distracted by me in class. But you can bitch all you want because as long as I am paying for my education I can do whatever the F I want during my class time. I don't sit in the front row, I sit in the back so if your distracted by me its cause your not paying attention in the first place.
Personally I have ADD and I am required to tell my professors this at the beging of each semester, I would like it if i didn't have to come to class at all, but professors have such strict attendance policied that I have no choice. My classes are lecture style classes so often there is no student interaction, and since I have notetakers for the classes I get good clear notes before my exams with plenty of time to study.
I see it is if I have to go to each lecture, I'd prefer to be able to get other work done, if its emails or checking engadget, or stock quotes, at least its not a total waste of time.
Once in a while if the professor says something interesting I will poke my head up and listen but otherwise I will get just as much out of the notes as I do any class lecture.
As a student who has used a laptop in class I have to disagree with the article. I think that professors should be allowed to disallow laptops in their classrooms.
Even when the student is doing school work, it is far too easy to tune out what is being said and instead focus on whatever code or design you are working on. This goes for taking notes as well. I've found I take much better notes when I can scribble, draw, etc by hand on the fly instead of think about how to properly format what I've created and what I need to do about getting the diagram the prof just wrote on the board in my box.
There is also the effect laptops have on the prof. All of a sudden, nobody is looking at the board, the prof, or what he's trying to accomplish. There is a wall of monitor screens... a fence between the professor and the students. I can see where it would be an issue for both.
Finally, the notion that "I paid a lot for this, I am justified" is, quite frankly, an alarming one that seems to be taking hold in today's society. You may have paid for it, but it is the professor's job to make sure you get what you paid for... whether you like it or not. You may not realize at the moment (I only noticed later that my handwritten notes were much more complete) but the prof may just be right. You may not be getting the most out of his lecture. People also have to realize that these may be distracting for other students. Yes you paid a lot... so did everybody else in the classroom, and the kid sitting behind you while you check out Homestarrunner may just miss something important. For this same reason many professors don't allow food in their class rooms. It is their call.
"Oh, and it's not a community college, its the second oldest college in America."
I would hope so. Is there a community college in the world that grants tenure? If so, who would accept?
Agree that the prof has the comm of his/her class...that's why he/she gets paid. Like cell phones in movies, the organization has the right to control the distractions. Technology should support learning, not entertainment or out-of-class communications, hotmail, warcraft, etc. I worked at a school where every studen had a laptop, but teachers were given control of how (and when) the laptops should be used in the class.
But in the "people who live in glass houses" mode, have you sat at the average corporate meeting lately? EVERYONE is distracted with CrackBerry's, e-mail, gadgets, etc. It's not that people are that important; it's just that they are rude.
Someone needs to be the grown-up and tell people to shut all this stuff off and pay attention.
coming from one of the guilty who uses her laptop in class to do more than just take notes, i'll tell you this: take away my laptop, and i'd probably just draw pictures or fall asleep.
in most classes, i actually pay attention at least 75% of the time. if class gets boring, i multi-task: read the NYT times maybe (being a political science major, this is relevant), or read articles required for the class that are only available online.
but then again, i have a tablet PC. so, it's designed for note-taking. it isn't distracting, you can't see my screen unless you're standing over me, and frankly... i bought this thing to use to take notes in class, and i'd be pretty pissed off if a teacher told me i couldn't. talk about an expensive paperweight...
There's nothing worse, in the entire world, than sitting next to the only guy in class clattering away on a keyboard the entire class- just the sound drives me f-ing NUTS. I can't pay attention when I hear keyboard sounds. You're not special, and you don't need to bring your laptop to class, nerds- no one is impressed. And sometimes, it seems like that's what they're trying to do. If you must bring your laptop to class, please, please sit in the back and keep clattering to a minimum.
Do people really see alot of laptop use in college? I'm going back in two weeks after 5 years off... I thought maybe I should lug my laptop around day 1 because it's better to prepared than not - but I decided to go with something called a pad a paper and see what others do. Unless someone in authority bans or encourages something, it'll come down to peer pressure.
And then I guess I'll have to exercise some self-control if I do bring one to class.
did this guy every think that a stenographer has to sit there several hours a day and type bascialy in code everything he/she hears? IN CODE! not normal typing, they have to translate words and phases to shortand and type that. they also won't be quized on the matierial, and when asked they have to read back EXACTLY what they recorded, not what they remember. they are almost required to NOT absorb the material. bad observation, bad argument, bad professor!
if you want something for typing notes, get an AlphaSmart. smaller, lighter, and more durable than any laptop, plus battery lasts DAYS not just hours. take it back your desktop PC, plug it in the USB and download it all into your favorite text editing program. not much for making diagrams, but it's small enough that you can have paper for that on your desk too. And if you can get a disablity waver, you can usualy even get a grant to buy one or even a loaner. they aren't really all that expensive anyway.
There are two competing issues for schools here, both of which are valid:
a) Promoting a good learning environment free of distractions, and
b) Serving your customers' wants and needs (and yes, students are *customers* that schools have to compete for)
In an ideal world, all classrooms would be bastions of learning, free of all distractions, with students that are all 100% engaged with their interesting and insightful professors. Unfortunately, this is the real world and things don't always work out that way.
The fact of the matter is education is expensive and students do have a right to expect a certain level of "customer service" for their dollars. I myself, having graduated in 1996, am still paying off more than a $20,000 debt of my own - my parents paid off another $20,000, and we paid about another $40,000 in cash at the time. For that kind of money, I damn well had better not be told what I can and can't do in class *provided* I am not distracting other students and provided I am getting good grades.
I guess what I'm saying is it can't be a blanket thing. If I'm in a class not because I wanted to take the course but because I have to satisfy some sort of lame liberal arts requirement, and if I'm passing all my tests and am otherwise sitting in a corner by myself with a laptop, then I don't see that the school really has any right to tell me to turn it off. I'm paying them thousands of dollars of my own money and I'm not hurting anyone.
Like anything else, though, if you are distracting other people, different story. If you're constantly blowing bubbles with your bubblegum in class, the professor will make you throw it out. If you're constantly passing notes around, the professor will make you read it aloud in class. None of this is new. But college students are not children; you cannot put a blanket ban on something like this. If someone's being distracting for *whatever* reason, you tell them to stop doing whatever it is they're doing. But if they're *not* being distracting, then they have a right to do whatever they please for the amount of money they're paying. These are adults you're talking about, and they don't *have* to be there any more than the professor does.
Back when I was in school, laptops were not an issue. But we had other big issues, namely food and coffee. Apparently, up through the 1980's, nobody brought food or drinks into class at my school, but then the schedules started getting more rigorous and inflexible and you had students who were in class basically from 8AM to 8PM straight on through. What were they supposed to do? So they'd run to McDonald's in between classes and bring their lunches in to class to eat. Some professors allowed this; others tried to ban it. It ended up being front-page news in the school newspaper, with real protests cropping up around the school.
The outcome? Food is now allowed in the school unless it's distracting to others. I don't see why laptops should be any different.
who knows how long some of you people have been out of college. I used a laptop in countless classes, mostly as a textbook - in my sociology, history, literature, and many other courses there were no paper texts but weekly pdfs to download, some of them hundreds of pages long. I'm saving zillions of sheets of paper and keeping them more organized on the pbook. if you're distracted by it, fxck off! oh and yes of course i hit up ebay and email and so on. same as doodling in your notebook or staring at the hot dude across the aisle.
danielle writes: "take away my laptop, and i'd probably just draw pictures or fall asleep."
If you aren't interested enough in the subject to stay awake, then get out of the class.
Steven writes: "The laptop is a useful tool,if I miss a class, I can get notes emailed from a friend."
There's this amazing new technology called a photocopier. You should look into it.
I'm an undergraduate that uses a laptop to take notes. The main reason is my handwriting sucks. WHen I have to write fast in notetaking situations I can't even read it half of the time. My 10" Vaio serves me rather well, and it's small enough not to be distracting to others or block my line-of-sight to the instructor, which I often see with sorry souils with their gigantic Dells. I don't often stray online, althuogh I do occasionally when things get too boring.
College, unlike high school, thrusts the responsibility of learning soley on the students. If they won't pay attention, that's their problem.
Well, this has turned into an interesting discussion. For those of you kiddies who have been saying things like "I paid for this class, and I'll do whatever I want" I can only reply: "Thanks for attending X Univ. Sorry things didn't work out. Good luck getting into X Community College with all those Fs on your transcript. Oh, and by the way, I hear DQ is looking for someone to clean the fryers for minimum wage."
My classroom, my rules, and any administration I would consider working for would back me on this. Try telling the cop who just pulled you over, 'Hey, I pay taxes, I'll drive 100 miles and hour when I'm drunk if I want to.'
I believe there's little you can do with a laptop in class. Except for those classes where on certain days you have to do Powerpoint presentations, I don't see any reason why laptops should be allowed in class. I had one Marketing teacher who busted someone chatting on AOL during class and he asked him to leave the classroom. After that day, everyone who had a laptop had to sit in the front so the teacher could monitor what they were doing in class.
I honestly don't understand what is the advantage of taking notes in a laptop or why some students want to do it. It seems to me that's just an excuse to be chatting on AOL, buy stuff on Ebay or play the Need for Speed during class. I am an experienced computer technician and to me it is still easier for me to take notes on an old fashion notebook, plus it is less distracting. Pens don't make tapping noises like a keyboard, or beep noises from an error message, and when you have to draw diagrams or lines to enhance your notes, drawing on a computer is obviously harder, more complicated, more time consuming and less productive during class than simply grabbing a pencil and paper.
Ok so I can vouch for the fact that I have taken my laptop to just about every class since i got it 3 semesters ago, and MOST OF THE TIME, professors dont care as long as youre not stupid about it. I mean, i take notes, i'd says 65-75% of the time. Then when things get boring, its off to PacMan i go. I try to sit in the back of the class as i understand it could be a distraction. I read the occasional engadget.com among others, but I make the grade. Hell, i pay to go to class so i kinda agree with the article.
I always made it a point to ask the teacher at the beginning of the semester if he or she minded. They usually didnt. In my last semester of school Spring 2006, (speakin of which, i'm finally done now, as of 20 minutes ago, wo0t) laptop use was fairly common. But i made sure my lil Powerbook was on mute and as discrete as possible. We once had a subsitute teacher who I actually had to report to the dean cause that bitch put his hands on me when he saw me on my laptop once while we were watching a movie in class.He was like put that f'ing thing away, and blah blah, and i stood up over him (since i'm 6'7) and he tried his best to keep his composure by grabbin my shoulder. AWW HELL NO... HA. it was funny to say the least. The actual professor didnt care one bit, cause I used it everyday, but this guy seemed to have a coronary-inducing problem with it. so i just..... well.. kept using it. Dammit he's a sub.
I say all this to say.... i dont think its fair for them to say NO laptops, unless its a math or similar type course, since i DO pay their salaries in some part. but if you do have a laptop, be smart about it. Find a lappy with some keys that dont clickity-clack and put it on mute! if you want to be treated like an f'ing adult, then act like one while using your laptop in a class.
SlammaJamma writes:
"We once had a subsitute teacher who I actually had to report to the dean cause that bitch put his hands on me [...] blah blah, and i stood up over him (since i'm 6'7) and he tried his best to keep his composure by grabbin my shoulder."
Let me get this straight. He attempted to control his classroom, you responded with a physical threat, and *you* reported *him*?
Although I use a notebook computer in school, I tend to use the campus Wi-Fi for partial BitTorrent downloads and put the machine away for the period, since taking notes on a computer is slightly cumbersome although it was sorta convenient. I do dread printing the notes out when it comes to exams.
When I did take notes on the machine, most classmates just browsed sites on their computers - of course, they panicked when it came to tests.
Use of a laptop in gradschool (lawschool in particular) is much different then use of one in undergrad. In gradschool you have already evidenced your ability to study and learn simply by your acceptance. I couldn't have made it into lawschool if I hadn't already learned how I needed to study. With the low requirements of undergrad, I think restricted laptop use is fine. Once you go on to gradschool however, you ought to be able to decide on your own.
I seem to remember being easily distracted by a pen and piece of paper in boring classes when I was in University. Maybe those should be banned too?
I say leave it up to the students to decide what's distracting for them. The ones who pay attention will pass, those who don't, won't.
Nope, no way. I'm paying for the education, I intend to learn it as best as I can. If that means I'm taking a laptop into the class to take notes, I'm taking the laptop into the class. If the professor wants to try and stop me, he's more than welcome to try. We put far to much importance on these professors and now they're starting to believe in it. I had very few professors in college that actually deserved the title.
The other problem is the students being "afraid" to stand up to a professor. I had one who insisted on locking the door to his classroom at one minute past the starting time of the class. If you didn't get there by then, you didn't get in. It didn't matter to him that some classes were located on the other side of the campus, and it was impossible without violating the laws of phyics to make it to his class on time. The first time I came to class and found myself locked out, I stood at the door and banged as hard as I could until he finally opened it up. When he told me I wasn't allowed in, I took it up with the dean. When he told me the professor had the final say, I took matters into my own hands...
...the next day, I came to class and again found the door locked. So, I called 911 and had the local fire department come by and showed them the fire hazard he had created. The school was fined, and I was called back to the dean. He tried to give me a hard time and I told him point blank to shove it. The school was the one that had violated the law, not me. I merely did my civic duty and reported it. I then got up and left. And, yes, I got an "A" in the class despite the professor's best efforts.
Students, don't put up with this crap. YOU are paying their salaries, these professors work for you, not the other way around. And as for it being distracting to other students, again grow a pair and say something. If your neighbor is playing WoW in class, ask them loudly "Would you mind taking that back to your dorm?" Let them know it won't be tolerated. It's really not that difficult a solution. Why punish everyone for the actions of a few bad apples, and the inability of the other apples to demand common courtesy?
Makes me wonder what the point of a college education is if you can't figure out solutions to everyday problems.
I think #17 said it best: "it is the students responsibility to learn. "
If they prefer to take notes on their laptop, great. If they prefer to waste their opportunity to learn by playing games, surfing the web, etc, again, it's their responsibility to learn. They are, after all, paying for the education. And in the event that their parents are paying, then it's the parent's responsibility to do something about it, not the professor who has insecurity issues because he/she believes no one's listening.
And as for #19: "Sure the students pay to be there (or their parents pay), but that doesn't mean they have the right to bring machine guns, or laptops, or countless other items that don't contribute to their learning"
Who makes a comparison between laptops and machine guns?? Isn't that ridiculously extreme? Esh.
-nb109
Spoonman writes: "It didn't matter to him that some classes were located on the other side of the campus, and it was impossible without violating the laws of phyics to make it to his class on time."
Why did you sign up for a class that you couldn't get to on time?
As a current grad school student, I do not feel the teacher should limit how I learn. If I choose to learn by surfing engadget or digg while the teacher goes off on some non-relevant, never-worked-a-day-in-his-life tangent, than that should be my choice.
I agree with comment 8, that if you are distracted by laptops in the classroom you have a larger problem.
John Stracke writes: Let me get this straight. He attempted to control his classroom, you responded with a physical threat, and *you* reported *him*?
NO thats not at all how it happened. A. it wasnt his class. B, we were watching a movie, and he started swearing at me and making threats. I stood up, because... well i didnt f'ing appreciate it. AND THEN he put his hand on me. Never once did he *ask* me to put it away, nor did he say anything about it before class. He came in, hit play on the dvd player, sat his ass down, waited an hour, then bitched at me. Thats why i reported him. I dont give a damn what anyone says, no teacher has the right to swear at you, make threats, and put their hand on you... PERIOD. laptop or not.
There was nothing to control, class was almost over, and we were watchin a damn movie, and i was on the very back row and bothering no one. especially not him.
Ummm - WTF.
You Engadget guys have it wrong for once.
I lecture biology courses about 10 hours per week, and I do not believe that laptop use is a student's right, nor does it help them learn the material. Laptops can be distracting to the student and his/her peers, especially if there is internet access or other temptations on the laptop like movies or games. This stifles not only their ability to learn, but impacts that of others around them.
Frankly, an educator's job is to educate, not entertain. Students who cannot pay attention in class, should not be in the classroom, regardless of whose paying. And higher education is not a right, it's a privilege. And equal or more effort needs to be made by the student in the education process.
In my own case, I only have a couple of people per term who want to use laptops in my classes. In these cases, these students feel they can type their notes faster than they can write them in pen/pencil. So, I usually allow them to use their laptops for this purpose, but I also ask them to turn off their wireless connections and not browse the internet during the class. In my case, I can enforce this because my class sizes and classrooms are both small. However, if I was teaching in a large lecture hall, I think I would ban their usage - especially if there is some sort of wireless access.
And don't give me this "You are a Luddite" garbage. I lecture using PowerPoint, with lots of multimedia content to make material accessible to them. I maintain a website with class information, and supplemental materials. Students submit class papers as pdf files electronically - no paper involved.
But when I lecture, I want their undivided attention - period. Otherwise, I can't ensure they will learn their material. And if laptops disrupt their attention, they should not be allowed.
Hey! We are in the computer/information age. Personally, I love using a laptop since I don't have to waste paper and ink, and my hands don't cramp up like they do when I physically write. So what if you can't concentrate - you can MOVE somewhere else. If a student is paying for their education, let them use whatever they want to help themselves. If they want to play snood or solitare, it's their friggin business how to waste their lives and money, not yours! I'm sorry, the professor ISN't the bottom line in the education trail, it's the students'.
The people that distract me are the ones TALKING in the back of the class, when they shouldn't even BOTHER being there in the first place if they don't want to learn. And on top of that, ask ME for MY notes, and I tell them to go fly a kite and pay attention in class. if Wi-fi was such a problem, stick a wi-fi/cell phone signal blocker in classrooms, to ensure that students aren't messing around.
It doesn't matter for those of you are on your high horses about banning laptops, you're going to continue to be ignorant and stupid when it comes to people's rights and choices.
/end rant
John Stracke wrote:
"Let me get this straight. He attempted to control his classroom, you responded with a physical threat, and *you* reported *him*?"
Since when was standing up a threat? The professor should have never put a hand on him. Furthermore, a professor shouldn't use language like that at any time. It's not acceptable. He's a professor and should be professional and respectful. There is absolutely no excuse for using that kind of language in class or touching a student without their consent, unless in self defense.
In this case, I guess you could try to argue that the professor was defending himself from the student standing...
-nb109
John Stracke writes:
"Get a clue. Penn State satellite campuses *are* community colleges."
Really? I didn't notice community or junior college on my degree. Why do you come to a website to try and take snipes at people for an opinion? It's America, and despite what you and your friends at the ACLU think, people are allowed to have an opinion contrary to yours.
Some people have to take two classes on different sides of campus, it's called trying to graduate. This may make them late. When it comes to sleeping in class, college students are forced to take many general education classes that have no correlation to their major or interests. So they can't just "get out" as you say. Email is quick and easy, sometimes students can't meet together at a photocopier to exchange notes.
You sound like an arrogan,t pretentious asshole, who needs something better to do with his time than attack people for expressing an opinion.
John Stracke writes:
"If you aren't interested enough in the subject to stay awake, then get out of the class."
yeah, i wish it was that easy. too bad colleges have certain classes that they require you to take, regardless of your major.
It's not about your choices, #73. It's about ensuring you get an education. And if I can't ensure you are learning, you won't be doing something in my classroom. Sure, it's your choice. Use a laptop and you choose to leave my lecture. Talk excessively when I lecture and you will also leave my classroom. Don't like it? Go to another prof or school.
My guess is that a lot of young people in the US have grown up in an over-permissive environment, where they feel they are entitled to an easy way out of everything. So when someone actually says, "NO" to them - they can't deal with it. Pathetic.
#48, who is going to take notes for you in the real world?
I'm a student, and I agree with this article. In my case, like the previous posters, 80% or more of my professors are just "reading out slides". I take a few words of notes like once in months (never remembered I took any notes in last few months actually). And the thing is, universities force students to attend classes (which may or may not have any value for specific students). It would be much much better to allow students to come for exams and pass the course with an A without ever seeing the professors, if the class is just about "reading out slides". Just to complicate matters, our university doesn't allow students to pick their lecturers, not even to pick their courses! So it's natural that many persons in the classroom never really want to attend that class at all...
I've been using my laptop in most classes that permit it. For some good lectures, I don't use my laptop anyway (even though it's allowed). Using laptops in classes for browsing, instant messaging, or even playing multiplayer games never stop me from mastering the topic anyway. I've got A or A-'s in those classes, and honestly, grades means nearly nothing. Even though in classes where laptops are forbidden, my classmates find another way to kill time: reading comics, playing BINGO with others, or even sleeping.
-Kurniady
In my first couple of years in grad school, I faithfully took notes a la laptop and now have great records of what went on in class. But then I stopped using my laptop because I found it hard to really enter into discussions. I was too absorbed with getting down what the prof was saying and not what I might say in response to him or her. Most profs don't want you to get everything down verbatim. That's what tape recorders are for. They would rather that you think, which is not possible when madly typing at 60 wpm. If these law professors are trying to get their students to think critically in class by banning laptops, then I'm all for it.
If the prof publishes an HTML document with an outline of the lecture, or a copy of his/her PPT, and expects you to follow along/take notes on it, then I had better be allowed to bring my laptop. I've had a number of profs who do so and having it up on my screen is a lot easier than trying to juggle printouts.
I also had a prof who talked too fast for me to write everything she said, and would not slow down. Typing was the only way to get it all. My memory for it was degraded, yes, but better to get it all for in-depth review later than to get only part of it and have a more complete understanding of only that part. I'm not the one killing any in-class discussion I would participate in, rather than asking my questions during office hours, if the prof makes it impossible to get all of the information recorded without typing.
I'll connect my laptop to the prof's projector and show the whole rest of the class if I have to in order to prove that I'm doing something constructive with it. But I expect to be allowed to use it if it's the best tool for the job.
I'm really amazed at the comments this article has gotten. Are people really distracted by other students using laptops in class? I'd say my laptop has been invaluable in helping me take and organize my class notes. Microsoft Onenote rocks.
Usually I'm self-conscious about people looking at my laptop screen, so I sit near the back of the room, so maybe that would also be less distracting for other students, but I mean really, how distracting is a screen on which I'm typing my class notes and maybe checking my email or engadget if I'm not particularly interested in what the prof. is talking about? Considering how much college costs, and the fact that the professor works for me (I pay his salary), I should have the freedom to do whatever the hell I want in class, as long as it doesn't distract other students or the professor. If that means taking notes on my laptop, that should certainly be allowed. If that means surfing the web in class, I should be allowed to. If I want to read the newspaper or sleep in class, I should be allowed to. Now why you'd want to go to class just to read the paper or sleep, and pay for the class to boot, I don't understand, but you should be free to if you want. I should not be forced to turn my laptop around to show the prof what I'm doing. That's my business, not his/hers.
Firstly, it is my choice to attend class, I pay for it. Secondly if I want to take notes on a laptop, it is again my choice as long as I do not distract others. Thirdly, isn't the job of a stenographer to simply record what is said, who cares that they aren't absorbing what they hear as long as they can repeat it back if needed. If all I heard about was people trying to avoid crimes and arguing in court I think I might tune out too.
Something tells me the writer of the summary doesn't know what Luddism means. The professors aren't banning laptops because they don't like the technology, they're banning them because they're distracting and people are using them to surf the internet and play games. That's a legitimate concern.
I usually sat in the back of big lecture halls in college, and the few people that brough laptops in were always used to play games. I watched people play Doom, Quake, Solitaire, poker, and other games, and I watched a guy program an FTP-based streaming radio, but I never saw a single person actually use the laptop to take notes.
If the professor wants to ban laptops than that should be their prerogative.
1) I'm paying for the class. My class fees pay the professor. He is MY employee. He does not dictate HOW I learn, as long as I don't negatively impact other students' ability to learn. Because other students choose to play solitare rather than pay attention should not cost me a useful learning tool.
2) As I can type far faster than I can write, I was actually able to pay MORE attention in class. I could type down whatever notes the prof put on the board, and type faster than they could talk. So, I was busy listening to the prof and thinking about the topic, rather than vainly trying to keep up writing notes.
3) I used a Palm w Stowaway keyboard, primarily for small size. Granted, this was not as visually distracting for students behind me as a laptop. Bringing in a 21" studio laptop is stupid. Bring in a low-end lappy for NOTE TAKING.
4) HOW you use the laptop is YOUR problem (unless it affects other students). If you can't focus on the class, and feel the need to surf, IM, draw, play games, etc.. THAT'S YOUR PROBLEM! You're using the laptop as a TOY then, not an educational tool. It is not the proff's purview to determine for you how you use this tool.
4) Parallel: Since it's possible to play tictactoe on chalkboards, and there's no way for the administration to know what the professors are using their chalkboards for, we should remove them because they might be using them inappropriately.
hmm... I'm pretty ambivalent about this. If people want to pay for higher education, they should just be responsible and use their good judgement...
Spoonman -- you sound like a joy to be around.
"I pay his salary!" "My money pays for this school!" "I pay for this class, I'll do what I want."
Yes, college is so backwards in that you don't get to plunck down your tuition, do whatever you want for four years, and get a degree. I'm sorry that you can't simply wake up, play video games all day, and waltz through life making $100k/year. It's just so terrible that people have actual expectations of you. That professors expect a certain level of decorum in their (yes, THEIR) classrooms.
Again, if you don't like the current setup of college, you are free to sell cell phones, make burgers, or clean streets. I should warn you, however, you probably won't be able to use your laptop on those jobs either.
To everyone that says your tuition pays our salaries you had better think again. Your tuition doesn't pay for much when it comes to running a college. I work in a college, and at one time worked in a graduate school that required students to buy laptops. The laptops were the last thing used to take notes. It was my job to give instructions on how to use the clinical applications for the students. Whenever they brought a laptop to class I didn't say a word, but they never ever took notes on what I was saying. Even when we had hands on training they never were doing what they were supposed to.
Only one student would be responsible for taking notes, and then that student would burn copies onto cds for everyone to have.
So I kept my mouth shut, and when they complained about how much they were paying, I showed them how much money they were loosing the school because of improper clinical notes, laziness, and a plain lack of common sense. The entire attitude of a generation just a few years younger than me is give me what I want because I paid for it. You owe me, and I don't have to do anything for you even if you paid for it.
Just because you pay tuition to go to a school doesn't mean you are entitled to anything. You are given the privalage to attend that school, and they are the ones to decide how you are to receive the education. School is not a democracy. When you pay them you are saying teach me how you want and I will learn.
It seems like the students I saw really excel had to put up with a lot of b.s., but they actually knew how to adapt and get ahead. They knew how the real world worked, or I should say they had jobs and worked for what they had.
Well, I am a student at UNM's Anderson School of Business, which is pretty well respected. The school just built a entire new building, with full wireless-G coverage. Also, laptops are REQUIRED for most classes, and to be part of the business program. Lectures, tests, and demonstrations are delivered via wireless connectivity right to the students laptops.
It doesn't help when there are TV commercials that advertise a laptop as a machine to play games or movies while the "boring" prof is lecturing. There is some girl in my sociology class who brought her laptop to class and started doing MySpace on the WiFi! Sometimes, this can get stupid, though. My computer science teacher banned laptops in her class... uhm, yeah.
My experience is that notes taken on paper is absolutely useless when i look at them later. A laptops makes it all readable, especially because i can write 3-4 times faster by using a keyboard. It is a huuuge advantage, and it's not my problem that someone is surfing the internet. As long as they aren't disturbing anyone else it's their own problem, not the professors. When i look around in the classroom at people who are writing with a pencil, it amazes me how much attension they put into just getting the stuff down. But when i write notes on a laptop (and not even looking at the screen) it's much easier to absorb whats really going on.
Those of you saying "I paid for this class, I'll do what I want" might bear in mind that one thing colleges are selling is a certain exclusivity, or at any rate the enforcement of standards of behavior and achievement. It is, therefore, in the interest of their "brand" to regulate students, to the point of flunking or expelling them, if the case is extreme. Think of it as a "No shoes, no shirt, no service" policy: if the professor says "no laptops", you have no more recourse to the fact that you paid to attend than you do if the manager of Red Lobster kicks you out of his restaurant for throwing shrimp across the dining room.
Thanks for coming, sorry things didn't work out; too bad about the Fs on your transcript. Enjoy your new job cleaning fryers at DQ for minimum wage...
Not allowing laptops in class should be in the discretion of the professor. I'm in the CECS dept and only have brought in laptops(why would you? there are tons of computers available) and only once i saw a professor say turn that off.
But on the liberal arts campus side people bring in laptops and clickity clack so annoying with the keystrokes. It seems that they are doing something else and not taking notes especially when there is nothing to take note of. I'd say it's not productive at all.
umijin writes: "But when I lecture, I want their undivided attention - period. Otherwise, I can't ensure they will learn their material. And if laptops disrupt their attention, they should not be allowed."
" It's not about your choices, #73. It's about ensuring you get an education. And if I can't ensure you are learning, you won't be doing something in my classroom. "
Again, it is not your duty to force an education down anyone's throat. You are paid to make that education available. You present it however you want.
The students pay to get that information that you are paid to provide. It's the decision of the students to collect the information and do whatever they want with it. If they want to disregard it and run face first into a wall, so be it. We are free to be failures in this country. If you want to excell in life, you'll work for it, otherwise you'll find that no-one is going to give you anything in life the hard way.
I must say, it almost sounds as if you have a insecurity issue. "THEY BETTER LISTEN TO ME OR I'LL CRY!"
At the beginning of the semester, I hand out a syllabus for the course that I am about to teach. It lists the policies that I have set for the course that I have worked very hard to create. If I choose to ban laptops (which I currently do not), I will state it on the syllabus. The students in my class all receive the syllabus on the first day and have ample time to drop/add into a different course if they so choose. Anyone who violates my policies can suffer penalties, be it dropping a letter grade, or for more serious violations receiving a failing grade. If students don't like any policy--attendance, exams, laptops, homework--then they can leave. Otherwise the course is up to me, and students who think otherwise are in for a shock. My colleagues have been through numerous skirmishes with students over course policies, and it always comes down to the students' responsibility to obey professors' policies. If you have a legit reason for wanting to use a laptop, talk to your professor. Otherwise be selective in the courses that you take. If there are several profs who teach the same course, seek out the ones who allow laptops, if you so desire.