CinemaNow DVD burning "irresponsibly defective"

If we sounded a little skeptical about CinemaNow's DRM-free DVD burning plans, there's good reason. One one side you have the content industry, which absolutely abhors the idea of allowing download-to-burn movies; on the other side, you've got CinemaNow trying to broker a deal to appease consumers without getting themselves sued, tarred, feathered, and caned. That deal they reached was to use fluxDVD's technology to take care of the magical DRM-less DRM that would allow customers to take their secure CinemaNow content and move it to a DVD which would play back in any old device Unfortunately, that vision may have been a little sanguine, since the reality is apparently turning out to be an "irresponsibly defective" solution, according to the report of an anonymous engineer. Apparently the burning technology deliberately introduces disc checksum errors when writing the disc, thus making the DVD both very difficult to copy, as well as making it nigh unplayable in most consumer DVD devices. And why are we not surprised this kind of solution is the compromise, hm?

[Via Ars Technica]

[andrew @ Aug 3rd 2006 5:03PM]

i do not see the problem they get there money why can't we do that.

[Don @ Aug 3rd 2006 5:07PM]

I'm looking forward to the day when downloading movies is practical works flawlessly. Unfortunately that seems like the distant future as CinemaNow just doesn't cut it. On a positive note, I discovered a DVD vending machine at my local walmart in kennesaw, GA. It carries all the new releases and only costs $1 a day. So far I rented 2 movies from it. I think it is a great concept since Blockbuster is way too much money and for someone that does not rent a ton of movies a month, it's economical.

[Philip Spicer @ Aug 3rd 2006 5:09PM]

Surprise, surprise, another DRM scandal.

[moofree @ Aug 3rd 2006 5:26PM]

"I'm looking forward to the day when downloading movies is practical works flawlessly."
... where have you been?

Oh... you must mean legally.

[Josh Warner @ Aug 3rd 2006 5:32PM]

The content "industries" still don't get it: consumers want FREEDOM to do what they want with what they BUY, which runs contrary to everything digital RIGHTS MANAGEMENT (looks rather Big Brother-ish, in caps like that) stands for.

They simply don't realize they are driving people who used to buy their products to p2p networks and torrent sites - not to get content FOR free, but to get content that IS free of Orwellian oversight/restrictions.

[nimro @ Aug 3rd 2006 5:36PM]

Josh-

Remember "FREEDOM IS SLAVERY" ;-)

[neimad @ Aug 3rd 2006 5:45PM]

This 'anonymous engineer' scenario sounds a litte bit sketchy to me. Of course CinemaNow's competitors are going to play down their new technology.

I actually tried the CinemaNow download-to-burn program, they have a free trial of the technology. it worked for me!

[slyecho @ Aug 3rd 2006 5:47PM]

I'd also be concerned about video quality. If I would ever use such a service, I'd make sure that the quality is good. 4.7 gigs, 576p, nothing less. But I doubt I'll find anything like that now.

[Forrest @ Aug 3rd 2006 6:01PM]

Josh,

The problem is, you're not paying to be allowed to distribute the content. You're paying for a license for *personal consumption*. That fact prohibits you from doing anything outside the realm of personal consumption. While laws may exist that could be used to prosecute you in the case you should violate your license, it's not a practical solution to the problem posed by violators. All profits and then some would be consumed by litigation.

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This issue is a lot more complicated than most people think. Consumers are of the opinion that they're paying for the content, so they should be able to do whatever they want to it. Even though I'm a consumer, I don't agree with that.

Before DVD burners and broadband, you had few potential content distributors, largely because of the expense and difficulty of duplication and distribution of physical media. It was possible for content providers to deliver their products to the distributors with no built-in protection, because it was possible to police them individually to prevent illegal distribution.

Now that it's becoming ever-easier to share perfect replicas of content, any consumer could become a distributor if the mood strikes them. In fact, I think eventually most would, at least on a small scale. Who doesn't share DVDs with friends already?

The problem is that the average consumer isn't willing to pay what it would cost to make them a 'distributor' of said content. If content providers release their products to consumers with no protections, they'll have to charge enough not only to cover normal use, but all potential use. Say as an example only 1 in 3 consumers of a piece of content actually paid the license fee for its consumption. The provider, to be fair to its investors, would need to charge 3x as much per license. The problem is the average consumer won't understand that, and won't pay for it.

I will agree that current DRM methods suck. But we must have *some* way for content providers to protect their intellectual property, otherwise they'll just stop producing content. Do we want that?

[TransFlashBlast @ Aug 3rd 2006 6:29PM]

I will stick with netflix. Way easier and it only costs $30 a month for 5 out at a time. Between me and my roomy that is plenty. I will never have to BUY a movie again. If I like, then I just back it up.

[DataTracer @ Aug 3rd 2006 7:32PM]

Don't you writers ever proof-read your posts before you post them? "One one side..." You mean "On one side..."? "...tarred, feathered, and caned." Since you've already made one mistake, I'm not sure whether you really mean "caned", as in smacking someone with a cane, or you mean "canned", as in "That guy got canned, fired, dumped, let go." Proof-read your writings please! *sigh*

[I,Robot @ Aug 3rd 2006 7:34PM]

The problem ISN’T complicated at all… Hollywood is just MAKING IT complicated. All they are doing is shooting themselves in the foot. In a “Global Market”, anyone can easily get software from the French/Russians to make copies of DVD’s, “they” know this, so who do they think their kidding with this DRM crap and changing all the U.S. Copyright Laws just to suit them?

If Hollywood is losing money – Tough shit! It’s their OWN fault, and they deserve everything they get.

[Forrest @ Aug 3rd 2006 11:56PM]

So what is 'Hollywood' supposed to do then? Produce said content for free? Or worse, at a loss? Like it or not, the world is awfully fond of capitalism these days. If media companies start to lose money in the content creation divisions of their businesses, they have a responsibility to their shareholders to change that situation. What do you think will happen?

If you don't like DRMs, and you don't like Copyright Laws, then avoid devices and content that are covered by them. If you don't buy it to begin with, they can't tell you how to use it.

[tekdroid @ Aug 4th 2006 3:30AM]

If media companies start to lose money in the content creation divisions of their businesses, they have a responsibility to their shareholders to change that situation. What do you think will happen?
--------------------

It's already happened. We pay taxes on blank media to Hollywood conglomerates, whether we use them for recording little Johnny's first footsteps or not. We pay royalties to every new graphics card and consumer electronics item sold with encrypted digital connections - all to protect their precious content. Control the standards? Control the market.

They have a plan in place to phase out analogue connections with HD-DVD and Blu-Ray's AACS license agreement. Speaking of which, both of these are filled with more DRM and anti fair-use than you can poke a stick at.

Let's not talk about laws being changed to protect them, either.

So, it's all nice and rosy on the 'screw-the-consumer' front. There's always a difference between making money/making losses and outright greed, too.

[Forrest @ Aug 4th 2006 2:46PM]

So, it's all nice and rosy on the 'screw-the-consumer' front. There's always a difference between making money/making losses and outright greed, too.

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I you feel you're getting screwed, then don't buy the devices. Don't buy the content. No-one is forcing you to partake. I'm *dying* to buy an MP3 player, but I've not yet seen one that I think meets my needs and doesn't have a lot of strings attached. When I do find it, I'll buy it - and I'd be willing to pay a premium for it because it'll be what I want.

Whether or not you're getting screwed is really just an opinion. If enough people start to share that opinion, the market will provide an alternative, and the companies doing the screwing will have to change or be driven out.

While not directly related, Netflix is a great example of something like this. There was a hole in the market, and they filled it. That forced Blockbuster to start offering a similar service. If enough people get fed up with DRMs, someone will offer an alternative. Until then, we've got to either bear the stupidity or avoid the situation altogether.

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It's already happened. We pay taxes on blank media to Hollywood conglomerates, whether we use them for recording little Johnny's first footsteps or not. We pay royalties to every new graphics card and consumer electronics item sold with encrypted digital connections - all to protect their precious content.
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And why do we have to pay? Because people have abused the system - at least media companies see it that way. If there was something in place to prevent abuse, there would be no justification for taxes on blank media. As for royalties, if consumers really do tire of bearing the cost for a given method of protection, a new one will surface or the cost will be removed. Or, if not removed, then just moved somewhere else. You might call that greed, but it's just capitalism - and that's the way the world works these days.

[TurboFool @ Aug 4th 2006 3:07PM]

This always seemed like a flawed technology. What with the license to make only one burn (how many consumers have malfunctioning burners, or software conflicts that cause their systems to hang while burning discs?), not to mention the issue of DVD+R versus DVD-R (the single most-asked-about question on the recordable media aisle in any Best Buy) and player compatibility (we all know what format our players play, but I'd be surprised if even 10% of the mass market does), this was a disaster waiting to happen, DRM issues or not. Great concept again failed format confusion and lack of consumer education.

The future's going to be in non-hard-copy media. Buy a license, have access to your media from any of your devices. Stream or download it to your home theater media center's hard drive, transfer it to your mobile player, access it on a temporary basis from a friend's house, etc. If done properly it will allow nearly all the freedom of the illegal options while making the studios happy without taking away ALL of our rights. A (relatively) happy medium.

[tekdroid @ Aug 4th 2006 8:57PM]

I you feel you're getting screwed, then don't buy the devices. Don't buy the content. No-one is forcing you to partake.
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I won't be buying Blu-Ray and HD-DVD, that's for sure. However, it's hard to avoid CD and DVD for most tasks these days. It's too entrenched. But this isn't about what I buy, it's about *the fact that the majors already have too much power, and it's not about breaking even* or anything related to that.


And why do we have to pay? Because people have abused the system - at least media companies see it that way.
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The media companies, like most companies, will do what they can get away with, and they have been doing so for eternity. Please don't even get into an argument about profit/loss because the only thing they need to worry about is producing content worth purchasing. None of them are searching the couch for loose change. They have far more political and financial power than should be allowed. We don't have to participate, of course. At least not in these new standards. While we still have a choice. It's actually quite frightening how much power they will have if the new connections become standard, let alone HD-DVD and Blu-Ray.