HDMI specific Xbox 360 Elite details emerge
By Conrad Quilty-Harper 
posted April 1st 2007 12:59PM
posted April 1st 2007 12:59PM
If you've been oooing and ahing at the Xbox 360 Elite's HDMI connection -- which really should have been there all along -- then this is the post for you: a source at Microsoft has posted specific details of the Elite's HDMI capabilities. Apparently the Elite will only support the 1.2 HDMI standard, and not the 1.3 spec which would have enabled TrueHD or Dolby Digital+. As such, you'll have to stick with regular DD, DTS, and WMA-Pro for your sound output. It also only supports dual channel PCM output, not full 5.1 channel, and if you want full 5.1 PCM output the tipster cheekily recommends "purchasing the Toshiba A2 player" which is much cheaper than the $479 Elite. At this point the complexity of the tech talk takes a step up, as amirm refers to a fall update that will bring support for "different video levels for VGA output" which could potentially improve fidelity and HDCP handshaking support on displays operating at 1080p. We suspect that around half of the people that started reading this left to read our interview with fake SJ somewhere around the point that we mentioned "dual channel PCM output", but what do the three people left reading think about these HDMI deets?[Via Loot Ninja]
Yes because Sony is always original.
PS3 has motion detection. Oh wait Nintendo Wii came out with that before the PS3.
PS3 has rechargeable controllers. Oh damn the 360 had them before the PS3 came out as well and you can even change the batteries on the 360 controller.
HDMI output? I'll stick with VGA thanks since most HD TVs don't have the exact HD resolution.
So lets see what does the PS3 have that no other console has? Oh yes that's it. It has Blu-Ray and the reason is has blu-ray has nothing to do with Sony trying to inflate the blu-ray figures by touting PS3 buyers as blu-ray buyers.
If the PS3 is so brilliant why do Sony fanboys feel the need to constantly try and put the 360 down ?
"If the PS3 is so brilliant why do Sony fanboys feel the need to constantly try and put the 360 down ?"
Your putting ps3 down right now youself
MOTION SENSING control has been out since the video game crash of 1983.
POWER GLOVES and U FORCE were just two examples of all the stuff the Japanese had already tried on a dozen other systems before the FAMICOM.
Guess what, rechargeable controllers have been out since the days of ATARI - thats right... Atari had a wireless, rechargeable controller too.
You really aren't saying much at all.
SONY isn't trying to inflate Blu Ray prices, it doesn't have to. Anyone with half a brain can read the specs for both formats and instantly realize which one is better. Only a fanboy would bring up the points you have.
Unlike the Sony fanboys (ie BloodFalcon) I'm willing to admit the 360 has some faults. I never said the Wii was the first machine to use motion sensing nor did I say the 360 was the first device to use rechargeable batteries. My comments were that both had these features BEFORE the PS3.
This whole pile of rubbish reminds me of the Playstation and Saturn releases. Sega had made a very powerful machine in the Saturn but then they read/saw the Playstation specs and realised it was a much more powerful machine. So Sega went and added a load of extra power to the Saturn making it a lot more powerful but a nightmare to code for.
Now what machine in this current 'console war' has taken a few years to come out and is hard to program for ? Sony wiped the floor with Sega and Nintendo when they released the Playstation but now they are falling behind.
The 360 is pretty much a games console first and a multi media centre second. I'm not sure Sony know what they want the PS3 to be. It's taken almost two years for MS to change the hardware in the 360. It's taken Sony just six months to change the hardware in the PS3. And just how many firmware updates has the PS3 had?
If you don't like the 360 then don't buy one. Take your insecurities and stick to posting in PS3 articles. You don't see me posting in the PS3 articles putting it down do you ?
I just believe that microsoft low balled the elite. If you watch the interview everyone has seen with the marketing guy from M$ he blatantly says the system is aimed squarely for the big media users, hence bigger HDD. They have have their core and premium systems to undercut sony's prices and thats just fine. I have been waiting for hdmi in the 360 since i bought it. I'm a huge video/audiophile. Yes i do realize I'm the minority, BUT THATS WHO THE ELITE IS FOR!!! It's for the people who have the money and are willing to spend it to get the cutting edge stuff. It is wrong to say "if you want HD disc capability go buy an A2." I have the money and could if i wanted to but its nice to pay 200 instead of 400, its nice to have one less piece of equipment plugged into my receiver. Go read sound and vision's review of the sony ps3's capability as a blu ray disc player, its better than some of the standalone players that are available right now! I have my 360 jacked through ethernet and the no wifi doesn't bother me but would have been handy, bump it up to 500 even and i'd still buy it. If this system is aimed squarely at competing w/ the ps3 it has failed. M$ you half assed something that had potential to be awesome. The single reason (realistically) that people had to buy this system, other than it being black, you botched. I have been excited about this for the last month and now probably won't purchase one. They should have just called it the xbox 360 mediocre and made it grey.
Being none of the games or the HD movies from Marketplace have uncompressed audio I do not see a single reason for it on the system. This is the content they are trying to push, not HD-DVD or Blu-Ray. For the price of one HD movie, whether it is blu-ray or HDDVD you could own the 4 best South Park Episodes, rent two HD movies and own your favorite arcade game of the past without going to the store even once, or even getting off the couch for that matter:)
The future isn't about bigger and better Audio and Video Resolutions, it is all about digital delivery. I know there are many people out there that hate the idea but you can't deny it
It wouldn't be a surprise that Microzombies make a new console next year. I would see Mocrozombies customers crying about it.
I own a PS3 (I always say that so people can say that I'm at least TRYING to be fair, instead of being a fanboy)
I think Microsoft had the potential to ABSOLUTELY crush Sony with this machine. and no, I don't mean adding a HD-DVD.
here's what they should've done.
*HDMI 1.3 (just to shut fans up)
*a better processor so it won't get that dreaded ring of death
*lower the first 2 SKU and mark Elite at 400
That would KILL Sony, but instead, people are seeing Sony PS3 as more reasonably priced than before. Big mistake.
seriously theres no point in buying the elite.
#1 No wifi
#2 blu-ray
#3 No DVD-DRIVE
The only thing that the new system has going for it is the 120gb hard drive. but hey if u want more space go and waste ur money on the 120gb sold seperately for 179.99$. Your choice
I think people complaining about the lack of HDMI 1.3 and no built-in HD-DVD don't get it.
If you're such an audiophile that you want Lossless 5.1, you should be a lot more concerned about the fact that you're watching movies on a frickin noisy ass video game console. It totally defeats the purpose.
PS3 is a different story. Blu-ray players are uber expensive, so the PS3 is a good deal if only for Blu-ray. That's NOT the case with Xbox and HD-DVD. You can get a standalone HD-DVD player for a lot less. So if you are an audiophile, why on earth do you want to play HD-DVD movies on a noisy Xbox? And thus, why on earth would you care if the Elite doesn't have the 1.3 spec of HDMI?
Audiophiles don't buy any console to watch any movie, ever. They buy quality movie players i.e: Pioneer Elite BDP-HD1. Also, an audiophile won't use HDMI to run audio. They run toslink or digi-coax. If you're going out and buying Wilson Audio speakers with Mark Levinson amp's and pre-amp's with a Runco plasma, you won't care about HDMI 1.3 vs 1.2. Most people that play their consoles on a surround system are usually running a "Home Theater In a Box" and HDMI 1.3 won't change a thing for them. Also, less than 10% of gamers have HDTV's, and less than 1% of those TV's have HDMI 1.3 in.
I can't get over the fact that this forum is already three pages long. Stop bickering over stupid things and just discuss things. Quit crying how one little thing is better than another. PS3 sucks because it doesn't work with ANY universal remote. Xbox 360 sucks because they give you options.
Also, stop claiming PS3 is more powerful than the 360. They are equally good because sure, PS3 has the "Broadband" processor, but it only has 256MB ram for the GPU and only 256MB ram for the CPU. Plus, it's a pain in the butt to program for the Broadband so most game developers design their games for the 360 and then adapt them to the 360. However, 360 only has three processors but they are three amazingly powerfull processors.
Finally, no more using the "web-browser" factor for the PS3. If you want to use your computer on a big screen, why not use the WHOLE computer on the big screen.
Stop the BS please!!! The XBOX 360 is a blatant ripoff and a flawed system. Anyone that looks at the specs, sees what is available, and still buys the thing isn't thinking.
#1 A 120GB 2.5" SATA HD can be found all day long for a retail price of $80. Cost to Microsoft in volume should be around $40. They are charging $179 for a $40 drive. You can't use your other 20gb drive for anything else so you just have to throw it away. Why do people think this is acceptable?
#2 Microsoft includes a wired headset along with a wireless controller. If you want the wireless headset you need to pay $50 for an inferior headset compared to most bluetooth headsets at the same price. Including the wireless headset would not have added that much cost to the elite and should have been included.
#3 No integrated Wi-Fi. This is just idiotic. Implementing Wi-Fi would barely increase the cost and I hate to break it to the blind following of fanboys that Wi-Fi is a big deal and the majority of high speed internet households have or are planning on adding wireless. Not to mention the city wide wireless plans that are being put into effect. People in apartments that can't run wires through walls use wi-fi and often need to since phone jacks for DSL may be 100 feet from their TV. Microsoft charging $99 for a USB Wi-Fi adapter is plain robbery.
#4 HDMI has been added but isn't fully supported. Its really more like DVI and not true HDMI. If you are going to put a port on the box put a full spec port.
#5 The needed changes to the internal components haven't been made. The smaller chip is not available and the cooling system has most likely not been changed either. This points to problems with 65nm production and shows that the chips might not be made any time soon.
The 360 may have a larger game library than the other next gen consoles but it has been out for over a year. The majority of this game library is available on other platforms so other than a small percentage you don't have to miss out on a game if you do not have a 360.
I read that everyone here is complaining about the elite not having HDMI 1.3 But the real issue is having a receiver that can USE it. I know that my recievers, both in my living room and theater room don't have 1.3 it will be a little while before i get one that does. And I don't have cheap recievers. The one down stairs is Denon 4306 paired with Deftechs and my theater room has a Pioneer ELITE vsx84. Both do hdmi switching over 1.2 upconverting to 1080p if i so choose and both are 2000 dollar recievers purchased this year.
Have to love how all the PS3/Sony fanboys have to flood every 360 related article with sad attempts at putting down the 360 in an attempt to make themselves feel better about all the money they just blew on a PS3.
@Carbonize
Why are u getting so bothered that people are pointing out the mishaps of the X360? I mean, they call the system "Elite" yet it obviously lacks the nex-gen equipment. I mean no WIFI... U all can bicker about the 65nm chip and HD-DVD blah, blah, blah, I could care less as long as I can keep playing my games but NO WIFI... Thats absurd!!! I mean thats a cheap fix. I'm definitely not saying get rid of the hard wired ethernet, but some of us have our HDTV's in the living room, no where near our internet connections... NO WIFI... I'm still scratching my head on that one
Don't get me wrong, Gears and Lost Planet are the shizz, but I'd really like to be able to play them online... And I don't want to hear " No one wants/needs WIFI, blah, blah, blah." Judging from the high quantity of sales of the overpriced wifi adapter(as well as every 3rd or 4th post), internal wifi would have been welcome!
BloodFalcon could possibly be a sony fanboy but you my friend are just as much a microsoft fanboy if you can't admit that the new X360 is quite a bit less then "Elite"...
As I said in my comment earlier, "Unlike the Sony fanboys (ie BloodFalcon) I'm willing to admit the 360 has some faults."
I don't see the Elite as a replacement for existing 360s but just a new higher end version. This whole debate began because of people saying stupid things like it should have HD-DVD built in ( why? It would just increase the price of the machine just for the few who would use it) and it should come with a remote ( err isn't that what the joypads for? )
Guess I'm lucky in the fact my cable modem and router are in my living room right behind my TV (40" Sony Bravia HD TV just to show I'm not a Sony hater. I also have a PSP and a Sony Ericsson K550i mobile phone).
I mean after some of the intelligent arguments I have read (ie not those of BloodFalcon) I am willing to accept that WiFi possibly should of been included at the standard 54G. I just looked on eBay and the cheapest Buy Now WiFi adapter for the 360 is £41 (about $90).
The SE K550i is weak sauce. Step up your game before you start droppin' names.
I care about 1.3 because I feel that it should have been included if you include HDMI. If my box is going to sit in my living room for the next five years, don't you think that I should want to future proof it as much as possible? Also, my receiver takes HDMI 1.3. I don't use TOSlink. I use HDMI. I also expect a lot of compensation for my 479 dollars. Like the ability to play Gears in 48bit color, not 24bit. But you know what, it doesn't matter because an "Elite" gamer only needs HDMI v1.2 and 24bit color. An "Elite" gamer doesn't need to future proof his system because he's too hardcore of a gamer and can drop five frankies at will.
I'll give you the Universal Remote problem. I have a top of the line Sony UR that doesn't work with my PS3. And the 360 having options is good. For the first two, anyway. But I don't really like the third, "Grease You Up and Aim For Penetration" model. They're shafting both their fans and newcomers with their Elite model, IMHO.
Also, you do know that the XBOX 360 has 512mb UMA ram right? It's shared between the CPU and GPU. So it's equal to the PS3.
The 360 has three units clocking in at 3.2GHz. The PS3 has one main core and seven synergistic units running parallel and helping out. It clocks in at 3.2GHz. But as anyone knows, the clock speed doesn't matter anymore. Nowadays, you have to drop performance numbers in the form of flops. And with that, the PS3 drops ~ 2.18 tfps vs. the 360's approximate 1 tfps.
With programming, it's like the last generation. The architecture might have been difficult to program for from the start, but the games didn't suck in the end. Also, this time around, Sony's in-house studios are helping the third party developers out with newer devkits and techniques.
It's a given fact the the PS3 is more powerful. But right now it doesn't matter because the games suck. That's the point that you should have made.
I also don't need to use a WHOLE computer to browse the web on my TV because I can already do that with my PS3. And you know what, I can run Linux on my PS3 right out of the box, so I guess I DO have a WHOLE computer on the big screen.
Ok I also have a W810i and an LG Shine but what does it matter WHICH Sony phone I have as the point was that I actually HAVE a Sony phone.
So care to explain how mentioning that I have Sony products in my house is "droppin' names" ?
I have an Xbox 360. Am I allowed to say that or is that dropping names as well? Oh I also have a Samsung TV but I better not mention that as it will make me a name dropper.
Oh wait I suggest you actually go look up the term 'name dropper' first then maybe you will use it in the correct context next time.
"Name dropping is the practice of casually inserting the names of important people or institutions into a conversation in order to seem more important to the listener." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Name-dropping
Name dropping occurs when you want to seem more important/less hostile to the listener. Literal definitions don't always apply in the real world. Arguing semantics for something that wasn't even coined until recently is a bit childish, no?
You name dropping SE allows you to seem unbiased, and therefore more credible to the listener.
I own a SE K800i, SE W950i, and a SE W880i.
See what I did there? A) I confessed to not hating SE products, so that I'll seem less hostile to you, by being in the same, unbiased boat. B)I actually do own those phones, so I'm ridiculing you for having a lower end phone. The only reason that I'm doing that is because you deem it important to state the specific model like flossin' that phone means anything. You could have just said, "I own a Sony Ericsson phone." That would've made you seen less of a name droppin' jerk. You're right, it doesn't matter which Sony phone you have as long as you have a Sony phone. Why didn't you just keep it that simple in the first place?
And in case you need to, here's the link to the definition of flossin'.
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=flossin
I mentioned the model to add credence to my point. If I was going to be "droppin' names" I would of come up with something better than the K550. I would of come up with some hogwash about owning a VAIO and not a mid entry Cybershot phone.
Personally I wouldn't of said the W950 was better as it's a different type of phone altogether so can't really be compared. Specially since it has no camera (which is damn weird from Sony). Same with the W880 as it is a 3G Walkman phone (with camera) where as the K550i is a 2G Cybershot phone.
Anyway I think I managed to prove my point which was that BloodFalcon was a fanboy and like most fanboys he goes through life with blinkers on and feels the need to put down the competition to try an make him feel better about his choices.
"these were/are supported on the HDMI spec from day dot (1.0), its just that HDMI 1.3 adds support for the next gen audio formats."
The main thing is NOT that HDMI is not 1.3, the main things is it can only output PCM in 2.0. If it could outpute 5.1 PCM, then the 360 could decode the audio onboard and send it out as 5.1 pcm. As it is, it cant, unfortunately.
"360 could decode the audio onboard and send it out as 5.1 pcm. As it is, it cant, unfortunately"
Sorry, I meant Dolby true hd could be decoded onboard and sent out as 5.1.
I won't be buying it if it is not HDMI 1.2. Like others have mentioned, it is about the increased color depth, not the audio. If a PS3 can support HDMI 1.3, there is NO REASON on earth the XBOX Elite should not support it. Also, you CANNOT upgrade from 1.2 to 1.3, so I would expect yet another XBOX in the next 6 months-year. I would bet when they go to 65nm chips, they will also upgrade to HDMI 1.3.
For now, no Elite for me.
Yes, but there currently are not any "true color" content out there-and few if any TV's support it. Even the PS3's games do not (currently) have true color.
Jeez, this area turned into warzone. I just read through a few posts and so much bashing going around. I don't think anyone should get worked up about these things at all. I'm guessing the reason why people do this is because they want thier "investment" to be the best.
I have all systems since Super Famicon came out, except for Neo-Geo, couldn't afford that one. And the only thing I cared about was the games. Super Nintendo I got because of Street Fighter, Mega Drive I got because of Streets of Rage, PS2 - Final Fantasy VII, Xbox - Ninja Gaiden, N64 - Legend of Zelda, Game Cube - Resident Evil, Game Boy - Tetris (no comment - I like to play it on the subway), DS Lite - Mario Cart DS, PSP - Super Ghosts and Goblins, Wii - Zelda, Xbox360 - Oblivion & Halo 3, PS3 - Metal Gear Solid 4 & Final Fantasy XIII.
Those games I listed beside the consoles are the only reasons I got them. I love games period. To me it doesn't matter who makes the game, whose console it is on, as long as they come out with great games that are fun. It's a shame there isn't only one console in this world, that would solve everyone's problem and no one would be bashing the other. But that's not the case.
But everyone should only care about what's important to them. Since the Super Famicon days to the PS3, the times have changed a lot. Gaming systems are no longer called gaming systems, but now Entertainment Systems. They do so much more than they did back then when all you could do is stick in a cartridge or CD and start playing. And I think that is great because it's evolving, gaming is evolving.
To me, there is room for all 3 consoles to survive. Whichever one does better will obviously be the one that pleases the general public greater. We'll just have to wait and see the outcome.
But getting back to the original article of this topic is HDMI. Personally, I'm shocked that MS didn't throw in 1.3 to make everyone happy. Because they made it 1.2, look at how people have reacted. I really don't see why they didn't add 1.3. Whether or not you think it is needed or not, it doesn't matter. The standard of HDMI has reached 1.3. I can only guess that it was cheaper to go with 1.2, that's why they did it or that 1.3 would be useless on their system in terms of the HD-DVD drive not being able to fully utilize it. I don't know, I hope they give a clear statement as to why.
My view on the Xbox360 Elite, if you got an 360, you don't need it. If you don't got one, I'd still wait a bit before jumping into it. See if there are any issues with this new 360 like the previous ones. Biggest one being that heat problem.
My view on PS3, best system on paper, and slowly improving it's operations. Rumble is back, online service getting better, addition of Home... As long as it's improving that's important. Please just release MGS4 and FFXIII soon, I wantz to play that shit really bad!
No matter what 360 fans think, Sony will be here to stay. And vice-versa. Both have already planted their seeds pretty deep. Same with Nintendo, they got the eyes of the general public more than any other console. I just hope they do things right from here on so that it doesn't become just a fad. More Zelda, yes please!
Peace.
This is dumb Microsoft - 1.2!!!. I too will be buying the PS3 as it has version 1.3 and it's all about the future. There are more and more TV's coming around the corner (even in the U.K!) which WILL support 1.3 as well as AV receivers. The colour palette on 1.3 is huge compared to 1.0 - 1.2 so visually, PS3 games will just look better and better and then off course the benefits of TRUE DD / DTS.
Over the next 6 months, the proliferation of 1.3 supported hardware will catch up with the PS3 and all that know the benefits will consider this as a positive over the XBOX360. Sorry Microsoft but you've lost me as a potential customer now.
this is the dumbsauce. microsoft is treating the xbox hardware like a version of windows throwing out the equivalent of service pack updates to counter their competitors console.
by the end of the summer i expect to see ms release the 'xbox leet-leet' with motion sensitive controls and a touchpad screen built onto one half of the nunchuck for $579 and maybe (crosses fingers) HDMI 1.3 support.
Oops. I'm sorry guys for double post. :S I clicked on the wrong link to activate the message. :( Apologies.
Ok, I don't get why people are so bent out of shape about the 360 not including HDMI @ the 1.3 spec. You think because a handfull of people on a message board have components that support it or want it, you think you guys are the norm. No, that is not the case. There is no such thing as "future proofing". If that was the case, our consoles with still be aiming to produce game in 640x480 at 60fps.
And everyones complaining about not being able to get lossless audio. Come on, I may want it, and so may a handful of people who have the equipment to support it, but how many other do? And to be honest, how many people have the audio knowledge to be able to hear a discernable difference. You guys argue about things that are not even standards.
Wi-Fi. This is an everchanging technology. There was A, then A+B, then AB+G, now N, soon to be who knows. So why implement it if it continues to change. I'm in IT and I don't even need it implemented. Because I know if they implement it today, something new will be announced tomorrow. Plus, the G standard only give your a base throughput of 54mbps (if you have the right signal strength). I'll stick to my ethernet connection thank you.
HD-DVD. This is the only thing that I think Microsoft messed up on. I think if they really wanted to classify this as an elite system, then they should have threw in all the bells an whistles (HDMI, HD-DVD, Wi-Fi, bigger HDD - elite components always come with at least one thing a person doesn't care for), and then once they created that sku, then lower the price of the core and premium systems.
And for you information John, HDMI 1.3 is not a standard yet. The PS3 is the first consumer device to implement it.
For 90 bucks you get 120gb notebook sized HD, HD size IS important regarding price, and an HDMI connection
i dont see nothing wrong.
both sides can b*tch and moan about both systems all they want people generally could care less. I was just waiting for this to happen...just watch ..ps3 is going to do the exact same thing in like a year ...bet you 1million dollars they will, just like they did with the ps2, ps. They always look to improve the product if even such an inch.
sony fanboys stfu
xbox fanboys stfu
seriously you guys b*tch too much ...dont like the product, dont buy it. plain and simple, or better yet, build YOUR OWN!!!! and leave the rest of sony and xbox buyers alone
IS it worth upgrading the HDMI cable for the Elite? ie. to Monster HDMI?
Some say it's just zeros and ones and cable quality doesn't matter...
Since I sell the stuff, I tried both, hell, I tried about five or six. Monster does make a difference. 600 Series from Monster is better than any of the competition that Best Buy and Circuit City carry. If you're just starting out with A/V stuff then stick to 600. If you're a videophile, then get 1000 Series. It allows you to crank the sharpness to full and still get zero artifacting. And that's even on my new 1080p TV.