Toshiba launching SCiB batteries in March: 5 min charge, 10 year lifespan

How does this sound: a battery capable of recharging to 90% in under 5 minutes while remaining useful (i.e., 5,000+ recharges) for 10 years or more? Sounds like the stuff of jetpacks and food replicators right? Nope... March, 2008. It was a long, long time ago when we first brought you news of these so-called "Super Li-ion" batteries. In March of 2005 to be exact. Now they're here, courtesy of Toshiba who just announced their Super Charge ion Batteries, or SCiBs. The wee 2.4V version measures 62 x 95 x 13-mm / 150-grams while the big, bad 24V version measures in at 100 x 300 x 45-mm and 2000-grams. Oh, and they won't short-circuit and explode. The problem? The first production run is for industrial-use (non-CE) class devices like hybrid cars and the like. Oh pretty please Toshiba, with sugar, won't you make a laptop version?

[scott @ Dec 11th 2007 3:18AM]

Oh, please be integrated into Electric Vehicles soon...

[Kurian @ Dec 11th 2007 4:58AM]

Please make a PSP version.

[Frankenstein Black @ Dec 11th 2007 12:22PM]

HOLY Shitsu! The TESLA recharge time just dropped from 3.5 to less than 1 hour! Now add those solar roof & hood body panels and, well, SAY HELLO TO THE JESUS MOBILE!!
http://www.teslamotors.com/

PS For the n00bs (and oiligarch) that’s less than 1 hour in the sun (NO plug in needed) getting you a 250 mile charge! And this is now not Jetson Shite. Now if I only had 150k to drop on one ;^(...

[RoboDan @ Dec 11th 2007 3:30AM]

Toshiba?

I'll believe it when I see it. If it passes proof-of-concept, I'd love to see this integrated into a cell phone/laptop combo (projection keyboard, projection display)

[derX @ Dec 11th 2007 3:33AM]

OMG, THIS IS GREAT! I cannot wait to put it in my iPhone.

Wait....

[Larsen @ Dec 11th 2007 4:03AM]

hahaha...

now THAT was funny as hell!!!

[Skullfighter @ Dec 11th 2007 12:12PM]

Thanks for a great laugh. Haha

[Ransom @ Dec 11th 2007 3:34AM]

So are these just uber li-ion batteries, or is it some other chemical compound?

[Alex @ Dec 11th 2007 8:41AM]

not "uber Li-ion batteries", "Super Li-ion batteries".

the difference is considerable

[Reader @ Dec 11th 2007 3:47AM]

I remember reading about these a long time ago and wondering what happened to them. Awesome they're actually appearing into the real world finally. I could live with a 5 minute stop to charge up my car, would completely obliterate the cap of how far an electric vehicle can go.

This'll do until ultra capacitors are refined for the same uses.

[JAmerican @ Dec 11th 2007 3:47AM]

Now Dell and Apple laptops can look like Nuclear Explosions when they go off :).


I seriously want to see this in UMPCs, laptops and cellphones. Seems like someone's working on batt technology finally.

[JAmerican @ Dec 11th 2007 3:48AM]

My sarcasm tags didn't show up. The first line was supposed to be a joke.

[derX @ Dec 11th 2007 3:59AM]

Dude, we know. If we didn't catch the sarcasm through from the beginning, there's a smiley at the end of the sentence.

-----

The way you did the smiley followed by a period, it either looks like a happy face or a person with one eye frowning.

[Rik @ Dec 11th 2007 5:07AM]

Actually the mechanism that causes batteries to explode doesn't apply to these kinds of batteries. Basically there are two ways of storing and retrieving energy from a Li battery. The first way is ideal but proved infeasable until now. The second is the one which we always used, much slower and with much more internall losses.

[John @ Dec 11th 2007 12:55PM]

Am I the only one who looked at that one-eyed frownie and thought "Aarrr...."?

[Nubaeus @ Dec 11th 2007 3:51AM]

Thank God Sony wasn't working on this.

[robertgmartin @ Dec 11th 2007 4:37AM]

No one said the Charge lasts for 10 years.. They said the battery lasts for 10 years. I paid extra for a 6 year batter in my car. Does that mean I can leave my lights on for 6 years w/o recharging it?? NOT!!

[Ian Tullie @ Dec 11th 2007 5:58AM]

You're right - no-one DID say the charge lasted for 10 years. Why are you flaming no-one?!

[robertgmartin @ Dec 11th 2007 8:53AM]

I was referring to the inference in the article. It was made to sound like you charge it fo 5 minutes and you are good to go for 10 years..

It wasn't meant to 'flame" anyone.. maybe a slight singe but not a full fleged flame...

[i.c. weiner @ Dec 11th 2007 2:34PM]

@ robertgmartin

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/sarcasm


there you go...

[L.Rawlins @ Dec 11th 2007 4:37AM]

The 'N Series' must assimilate this new found loveliness forthwith.

[jdschuitemaker @ Dec 11th 2007 4:49AM]

The charge rate sounds excellent, but what is maximum the discharge rate, dimensions and weight for which capacity?

The radio control aircraft guys are waiting for this kind of battery.

[Joey Geraci @ Dec 11th 2007 10:40AM]

Dimensions and weight listed in the article

[Jonathon @ Dec 12th 2007 10:03AM]

Don't sell yourself short...just about EVERY industry that revolves around batteries wants this technology.

Separate thought. As charging times approach zero, so long as they maintain the same discharge capacity/rate then it changes the dynamics (and annoyance) of what it really means to have to "charge" a battery disappear. Just imagine if those "wireless" short range charging pads became a standard. All you would have to do is "swipe" your [device] across it and you are back up to 100 (erm 90%) charge.

[Kryz @ Dec 11th 2007 6:35AM]

You want to see this in a laptop? I would think 2.4 Volts is a bit too weak for a laptop, so you'd want the 24 Volts version. That means a weight of 2000 grams. Now that's 2 kilograms, and for metric-illiterates here that means 4.41 lbs. Are you sure you want this?

[Simon @ Dec 11th 2007 7:06AM]

maybe, just maybe, they are already working on making it smaller and lighter. maybe ...

it's nice to know there is something going on, but it's still far from what we are all dreaming of ...

[Rynth @ Dec 11th 2007 7:37AM]

I don't think you'd want a 24V battery for your laptops 19.5 volt circuit.

Though I could be wrong.

[rickane58 @ Dec 11th 2007 8:16AM]

God forbid we put an extra 3 pounds on our laps to gain the benefits of this amazing innovation. Because, just like my arms when im playing my 360, my lap goes numb from the weight of bearing it and my 7 lb notebook. OH GOD the horror.

[Diogo @ Dec 11th 2007 1:05PM]

Actually, your laptop has a step-up circuit already, so it can be powered by current 3.7V Li-Ion cells. The same circuit could be applied to this 2.4 volts to generate you the 19V you need. No need for a 2kg/4.4lb battery.

[Eric @ Dec 11th 2007 1:52PM]

Because the only versions they'll ever be able to produce are a 2.4 volt version and a 24 volt version in the exact sizes they mention. No other sizes or voltages will ever be created!

[Kryz @ Dec 11th 2007 2:08PM]

Simon, Eric: I'm not exactly stupid, I understand that there will be evolutions. But the quote from the article is "Oh pretty please Toshiba, with sugar, won't you make a laptop version?", and to me that sounds like they want a version of _this_ battery in laptop design, not of some future evolution. I'm arguing you might not want that.

But then rickane58 probably does want to walk around with 2 kg's of extra weight to his laptop, no problem at all, if I read the sarcasm level of his post correctly, so I must be wrong in my assumption.

And Rynth, Diogo: I bet the current voltages aren't completely correct for current laptops. But since they didn't put any info on the capacity of the battery here, I would assume the 2.4 V battery is not powerful enough to power a laptop. So I simply took the one closest to whatever would be good enough, and that it doesn't fit exactly, well, isn't that why Engadget is asking for a laptop version?

Damn, sometimes I feel like one has to explain everything here. I guess I forgot this is an american site...

[Mike @ Dec 11th 2007 7:59PM]

Way to throw racism in there to make yourself look like even more of an idiot.

Batteries in current laptops are made from a few 3.6v or 3.7v lithium cells in series-parallel to raise the amount of available voltage and amperage to values requiring simpler power conversions.

Your car battery is composed of many large 2v cells in series.

The article's author was commenting that Toshiba should make a battery using this technology to make a laptop-suitable battery.
The article also does not show the capacity of the cells. They are so heavy because they are large capacity they have, required for industrial applications. Your comment is like saying a D battery is the only type of alkaline battery able to be made and that AAA's do not exist and cannot be made without significant changes to the technology.

Bottom line: If Toshiba wanted to, they could make a battery suitable for use in a laptop any day.

[Hung @ Dec 11th 2007 8:36PM]

@ Kryz

Adapting this version to a laptop WOULD be an evolution, it's sort of the definiton of the word.

They didn't list any capacity information because it's very deceiving to most consumers. 19 V at 2.4 amps on one laptop battery isn't the same as 19 V at 2.4 amps on another.

And BITCH, remember Yorktown in 1783 and John Paul Jones. One man with one ship kept the UK awake at night.

@ Mike

It's more douchebaggery + falsely premised nationalism than it is racism.

Series-parallel doesn't mean anything. They're two different kinds of circuit.

[Tony Colonello @ Dec 11th 2007 7:01AM]

From the photo they look just like the battery that is in my Nokia.

This could be the breakthrough needed for electric and Hybrid cars that will truly make them a viable choice for most consumers.

I have a feeling there must be some down side that is not being reported. Why else would they first market them in that form factor and not give a date for replacement batteries for cellphones, laptops, digital cameras, MP3 players etc...etc...etc...?

[bob sakamano @ Dec 11th 2007 7:07AM]

how come batteries are always fast to charge to like 90% but impossible to finish the last little bit?

do they get lazy when they see the finish line?

[rickane58 @ Dec 11th 2007 8:21AM]

It's all about chemical reactions. The closer you get to full capacity, the less "stuff" there is in contact with the cathode and anode (the charging parts, and parts that "give" the electricity to the device) that isn't yet ionized. Also, to recharge a battery, you must be putting more juice into it than it is putting out. So, you can either run the risk f frying the battery by overcharging, or slow down the charge rate as the battery starts to reach equilibrium with the charger.

[Ed French @ Dec 11th 2007 7:13AM]

Not sure this is so great for laptops- to charge my 50Whr laptop battery in 5 mins, ignoring losses, would take a 600W power supply- or probably more realistically a 700W. That'd weigh several times what my (admittedly small) laptop weighs!!

[Jeff @ Dec 11th 2007 7:46AM]

Right - the laws of physics do apply here.

I'm finding it hard to get *that* excited about these batteries. I'm not sure they're really going to be that useful for most applications for just the reason you mentioned (I'm not sure I'd want 1,200 watts coursing through my house wiring for more than a couple minutes to, say, charge up a car, either...), although it would be nice to have a battery that lasts longer than 1,000 charges before losing half its capacity. That rings of marketing to me, though; we'll see how they really perform in practice.

What *would* get me excited would be more battery life. There haven't been many advancements in this area in years - we've been stuck with the same battery technology giving us the same lame amounts of battery power even as our requirements for juice increase. That's had the nice side effect of forcing device manufacturers to come up with better ways of saving power on their devices, but it would be great if that could go hand in hand with better *actual* battery life. Imagine a laptop with a battery that lasts 24 hours of continuous use. Or a cell phone that doesn't need to be recharged for a month. That's what I'd get excited about.

[mohaine @ Dec 11th 2007 8:27AM]

1200 watts is more then safe for normal house hold usage. It is only a little over 10 amps at 110 V, and is at or below where most vacuum cleaners and microwaves operate.

If your house can't handle 10 amps on any circuit, you need to rewire before you start a fire. Any single plug is expected to be able to handle 15 amps for a prolonged time.

[rickane58 @ Dec 11th 2007 8:32AM]

That wouldn't be that hard. since i live in US, my voltage in a standard outlet is 120, or 110. So, to get 1200 watts, i only need 10 amps of current, which is half of what my lowest breakers are tripped at( 20 amperes). So, you could easily charge this in any outlet with an AC/DC rectifier and transformer. That may weigh a lb or two more, but its not something you don't already have in your own home. Also, for any one in Europe, multiply volts by two, and the subsequent numbers by .5

[james @ Dec 11th 2007 8:24AM]

dont get excited about these technologies. They have been around forever. One instant i know of is a friend from college w/ a team created a "super battery" Less costly less energy to charge but more powerful etc etc etc. They major corp's use their teams and stop this sort of thing, with money. This is why we should move to japan...they release stuff like this. or is that korea?My friend has been living in Southern Cali for about 10 years now and doesnt and wont have to work.

[IndiaTech @ Dec 11th 2007 7:08PM]

Dude... You should stop having imaginary friends.

[tastybytes @ Dec 11th 2007 8:30AM]

I am glad someone has finally been working on battery evolution.. our biggest problem these days is extremely limited power.. flying cars.. no problem.. it just needs 1.21 gigawatts to get off the ground for a second.. why are we still hooked up to a city grid for continuous power.. charge ur house for a few minutes.. then run everything from there.. i know we work on chemical reactions these days.. but there has to be an alternative

[Soggoth @ Dec 11th 2007 8:59AM]

What is the max capacity and discharge rate?

[tcc3 @ Dec 11th 2007 9:24AM]

This cant be true they must be Li-on.

=)

[sarchi @ Dec 11th 2007 9:38AM]

no one said anything about temperature one of the biggest drawbacks [ex pun]

[tom @ Dec 11th 2007 10:09AM]

Compatible with HD-DVD only!

hahahahhahahahahhahaa

[Technex @ Dec 11th 2007 11:17AM]

This is the best news I have heard in a long, long time... There is just so many applications for it.

I'm glad I held off purchasing some more lipos and a new charger for my RC helicopter...

This even beats A123 systems!

Awesome!

[evstreet.blogspot.com @ Dec 11th 2007 11:29AM]

GOOD NEWS! Chevron just bought this battery division from Toshiba! Chevron promises to release the batteries for automotive use real soon! Both George Bush and Hillary Clinton are happy with the deal. Ron Paul thinks its bad for the economy.

[Matt M @ Dec 11th 2007 2:33PM]

@evstreet;

Wot are you talking about?