Japan gets official on plans and details for world's fastest maglev

We'd already heard about Central Japan Railway Company's not-so-near-term intentions to deploy a speedy new maglev system in the country, but it looks like it's just now getting official with things, and it's still promising to have it up and running no sooner than 2025. By then, there should be 180 miles of track stretching from Tokyo to central Japan, which'll accommodate a maglev train capable of topping out at 310 miles per hour, apparently making it the world's fastest. That, as you might have guessed, comes at a fairly hefty cost -- $44.7 billion, to be specific -- which makes some similar, but decidedly less speedy systems pale in comparison. As The Register points out, however, while Japan's train will be the fastest maglev system, it won't quite keep up with the fastest conventional trains around, or whatever else might be around in the year 2025.

[Photo courtesy of FYS]

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[Kei @ Jan 1st 2008 1:57PM]

Doha (Capital of Qatar), has announced that it will soon be constructing the worlds fastest maglev to be completed and integrated into New Doha Airport and Lusail City. It'll also be the first Maglev in the world to be both above ground and underground at the corniche area.

[Temple @ Jan 1st 2008 11:06PM]

Shanghai already has the world's fastest maglev connecting the airport to the city. There is a huge difference between airport transportation and real long distance transportation solutions. The maglev discussed here is 180 miles long and isn't just a small distance maglev designed to get bragging rights to the "world's fastest".

310mph is insane for a train that actually takes passengers (Japan already has a 360+mph maglev in testing, but its not for people to actually ride). That's significantly faster then the top speed of a Bugatti Veyron. And more then twice as fast as Amtrack's Acela Express (fastest in train operational in the US).

[Kei @ Jan 2nd 2008 5:42AM]

Yep, you're right. I love Shanghai (been twice last year (which was yesterday) )
Alot of my Chinese friends are quite angry about it because they say it's a waste of money.
All of the world's fastest, best, largest, are all designed for bragging rights ^__^
However Doha's maglev isn't a short distance either (I don't know if you alot about Qatar) but the airport has to go through two cities (so it wont be a short distance). The maglev will also connect to 12 major stops including the upcoming subway.

On a side note, Doha's New Doha airport will be the largest in Asia and is the world's first airport to be purposely built for the new Jumbos.

[Iain @ Jan 1st 2008 2:29PM]

"That, as you might have guessed, comes at a fairly hefty cost -- $44.7 billion, to be specific -- which makes some similar, but decidedly less speedy systems pale in comparison."

Hang on.
This one's supposed to be 310mph and the 'less speedy' one you link to is meant to be... 310mph.

Am I the only one confused here?

[Reader @ Jan 1st 2008 2:45PM]

Yeah... I read the linked article and it the read link points to an article saying the 'less speedy' train "has a top speed of more than 500km/h (310mph)" which would make it possibly faster than this one.

Maybe I'm missing something...

[sitruc @ Jan 1st 2008 3:03PM]

What happened to the plans for maglev in the US? I remember DC to Baltimore was relatively close to becoming reality before 9/11...

[Flashpoint @ Jan 1st 2008 3:30PM]

DC - NYC takes roughly 45 minutes so for now, that is the logical, feasable route.

By Rail, there is already Amtrak. It is slower yes, but it won't require new installation and thus, billions of dollars.

Even if America wanted a Maglev from NYC-DC, you can thank President Bush and his oil executi... I mean...his cabinet for spending every penny America's got and plunging us into debt and declining dollar value.

[Aashish Jain @ Jan 1st 2008 4:07PM]

"DC - NYC takes roughly 45 minutes .."

Really? :)

[sitruc @ Jan 1st 2008 4:37PM]

DC to New York isn't too short for a trial which is essentially what the project was supposed to be. I guess I've missed those trains that make it to NYC in 45 minutes.

I found the website that had information about the project and links to the DOT.
http://www.bwmaglev.com/
An article dated October 2, 2007 says the studies are still alive...
http://www.wjla.com/news/stories/1007/460227.html

[Josh @ Jan 1st 2008 8:19PM]

It took more than an hour to get from DC to NYC on an express train this summer... not sure what you are talking about when you say 45 minutes.

[willy the impeached @ Jan 2nd 2008 8:11AM]

Actually flashpoint, I'll blame Klinton and Co. for ignoring teh terrorist threat while cutting our defense budget buy 40% and intelligence budgets to the bone. Even after attack after attack. So sure we have to pay now for jerking off in the 90s, but how many attacks on the US has there been since 911? hmmmm ....
Besides now that NYC has been relatively cleaned up why in God's name would they want a high speed transport to the most crime ridden city in the US (and thats just the demonrats in congress)?

[Flashpoint @ Jan 1st 2008 3:26PM]

I've been on Japan's railways such as Narita-Shinjuku and it took what seemed like 45 minutes to complete. I'm sure the Japanese will appreciate this.

I'm more interested in a maglev train from BeiJing to Shanghai to Hong Kong. That would truly be revolutionary.
Shanghai's Maglev covers almost 25 miles in just 10 minutes.

[Jeff @ Jan 2nd 2008 7:41AM]

This is going to be part of the already-existing Tokaido shinkansen line, which already hits speeds of 220mph on this route. So it's an improvement, but only by about 33%. It's not like it's going to cut travel times from Kyoto to Tokyo from 3 hours to 20 minutes. It's going to cut that time from 3 hours to 2 hours.

Nice, but worth $44.7 billion? A lot of Japanese don't seem to think so, and I don't blame them. I love Japan's way of pushing through public works that we just can never seem to even agree to build in this country, much less actually fund, but they do occasionally go overboard on things that are unnecessary and wasteful.

[Flashpoint @ Jan 1st 2008 3:34PM]

DC - Baltimore is too short for a maglev project. A Better project would be NYC -DC or NYC - Florida

[Valgas @ Jan 1st 2008 3:49PM]

Japan doesn't waste time on being the first.

[Flashpoint @ Jan 1st 2008 6:17PM]

I don't know how I left out "BY PLANE"

[Jern @ Jan 1st 2008 5:28PM]

This article is actually incorrect, this is not the worlds fastest Maglev train.

"The highest recorded speed of a maglev train is 581 km/h (361 mph), achieved in Japan in 2003, 6 km/h higher than the conventional TGV speed record."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maglev_train
http://www.physorg.com/news117862395.html (read a little down in this article, it sells about the fastest maglev.)

[Jeff @ Jan 2nd 2008 7:47AM]

No doubt they're talking about speeds in regular service.

That's a distinction a lot of people fail to make when talking about speed records, including Engadget in the actual post. The TGV doesn't hit more than 300mph in regular service; not even close. In fact, its fastest average speed between two stops - and this is the fastest in the world, btw - is around 163mph.

The TGV that hit 320mph was a specially modified train carrying no load and operating on an upgraded stretch of perfectly straight track specifically for that test run. No TGV in service has ever hit speeds close to that.

Japan still has the top average speed along an entire route with the Osaka-Hakata run at around 152mph.

[Steven @ Aug 20th 2008 6:14AM]

Also note that this train ran at nearly 20 megawatt, more than double a conventional TGV's requirements. That's from nuclear power, not fossil fuels, but still.

[Gnaget @ Jan 1st 2008 5:36PM]

I hate to point this out but....

soooo, for the price of the iraq war in 08, we could build 4 of these?

[Marko @ Jan 1st 2008 6:02PM]

So what is the point of a Maglev train if it is not faster than the conventional railway, given that it costs 5x more (guess) to construct? Why not just build a regular high-speed railway instead and save money? Is it cheaper to run? I know it is probably a little more comfortable to ride, but is it worth it?!

[fred @ Jan 1st 2008 6:12PM]

"
Even if America wanted a Maglev from NYC-DC, you can thank President Bush and his oil executi... I mean...his cabinet for spending every penny America's got and plunging us into debt and declining dollar value."

ugly fact. if america had the population density of japan we would have over 3 billion people.
density makes public transport viable. most of america isn't dense at all which leads to the problem of what to do after you get off that train. in nyc there are plenty of cabs, and public transport to get around. but in most places in the us once you get off the train you need a car. and that just makes using the train pointless.

[Marcus @ Jan 1st 2008 6:32PM]

@fred - It's a chicken and egg situation - if the government builds a decent local transport system, people will use it, but people will not rely on public transport if the system is not very good.

My personal believe is that a good local and national public transport system is fantastic for the economy. This is why Europe is moving very quickly in creating a high speed rail network (London to Paris = 2hr45 mins).

It's a real sad state of affairs when a nation relies solely on the car to get them from A to B.

[Constable Odo @ Jan 1st 2008 11:16PM]

You got that right. America has screwed itself to nowhere due to the Middle East intervention with no end in sight. No maglevs for the U.S. At least we do have some aging Space Shuttle we can brag about. Well, until the next one gets vaporized due to some careless oversight.

I just hope that International Space Station is worth the expenditure since we're putting the most money into it.

We don't build the tallest buildings anymore and we don't have a single maglev train. We used to be the world's greatest nation, but seem to be slowly losing our prestige.

[Rex @ Jan 2nd 2008 2:23AM]

By your "you still need a car, so we can't have trains" logic we wouldn't have aircraft either, and yet, somehow, the airline industry is doing pretty well in the US.

[Dr Buzz0 @ Jan 1st 2008 6:15PM]

Okay. It's fast and it's smooth and it's shiney and nice, but how much cheaper would a standard bullet-style high speed train be? Sure it'd be a bit slower but $44 billion? That's the cost of 11 full sized suppercarriers. That's more than the cost of the entire fleet of space shuttles, including the two that blew up. That's more than the cost of the English Channel tunnel. That's more than the cost of that huge tower in Dubai times four.

I mean... that's a hell of a lot of money, especially considering that it only serves three cities and won't be compatible with the rest of the rail system.

[Darryl @ Jan 1st 2008 6:31PM]

Fellow Americans and Europeans, start saving your pennies for the transatlantic maglev. Should go up to 4000 mph with the combination of vacuum tunnels (reduces drag and sonic boom) and maglev. Popular Science claims it should cost ONLY 88-175 billion dollars. With the cost of Japan's maglev, I'd say that the cost estimate is a few decimal points off.

[Jeff @ Jan 2nd 2008 7:50AM]

The Tokaido shinkansen already exists on this route. And it's likely a smoother ride than a maglev will be (read up on existing maglev's - "smooth" is not a word most people use to describe them).

So I agree, this is probably a big waste of money.

[stretchoutandwait @ Jan 1st 2008 6:23PM]

I've really got to wonder about the wisdom of this. If it's eventually extended to Osaka, and I believe it must be in order to be profitable at all, I think it'll still border on a porkbarrel project. Especially with Alstrom/SNCF demonstrating the possibilities that still exist with wheels on rails, I've gotta wonder what hand Toshiba or Hitachi had in this.

Does anyone know if the issue of switches/turnouts has been solved? Last I read, there was no way to transfer this sort of vehicle from one 'track' to another.

[emjoi @ Jan 1st 2008 9:52PM]

Nagoya?

Surely the train would have to travel between Osaka and Tokyo to be useful. Getting off half way and catching another train rather defeats the purpose of being fast. Maybe I can do the full trip when I retire in 20 years or so.

[Starrbuck @ Jan 1st 2008 7:08PM]

"Even if America wanted a Maglev from NYC-DC, you can thank President Bush and his oil executi... I mean...his cabinet for spending every penny America's got and plunging us into debt and declining dollar value."

Wow, that's Bush's fault too.

[WorldCTZen @ Jan 1st 2008 8:41PM]

The capital costs of a MagLev system are indeed higher than a steel-wheel system. However, the operation, maintenance, and energy costs are SIGNIFICANTLY lower. Over the lifetime of a public transit system like this, it will make up the difference in capital outlay. Also, consider that land is of major importance in Japan. Conventional rails chew up a fair bit of terrain for right of way, while MagLev typically uses an elevated track that allows for using the land below. This is part of why the system costs so much, but the opportunity cost of reclaiming land along the track will partly defray this.
Once the technology has been proven and the costs understood, we'll probably see MagLev's show up in the US. We were pretty late in putting in a steel rail system compared to Europe for many of the same reasons. Once there's live Maglev systems in place elsewhere demonstrating the viability of the system for intra-city travel versus air travel, that's when they'll really begin to take off locally.

[Flashpoint @ Jan 1st 2008 10:59PM]

You are right, but more importantly, because of the intricate setup of the tracks, Maglevs are best for point to point travel rather than switching tracks and multiple routes.

NYC to DC is intelligent. Even NY to Boston.

You just gotta be sure you will have ridership which supports the railway otherwise you'll end up wasting ALOT OF MONEY like China did building the Shanghai Maglev between Pudong city and Pudong airport.

I saw that sucker in action...it seemed like it was FLYING on those rails - making the entire 20+ mile trip in 7 minutes but, recently, it has been criticised as wasteful and showy since the only people allowed on it are people who have valid air tickets and the destination in Pudong is inconvienient for residents. It would only be good for people going to the Oriental Pearl tower or Jin Mao.

china should have made a Beijing to Shanghai maglev

[Don G @ Jan 1st 2008 10:49PM]

The French tradition rail vehicle was a specially modified vehicle and the test area chosen was specifically flat and straight along with various changes to power supply and cable tension. The complete special adjustments can be found - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TGV_world_speed_record#Record_of_2007

The article quoted makes it appear the test train might have been traveling where curves and inclines are present: "V150 passenger train screaming through the French countryside, ultimately topping out at a breakneck speed of 574.8 kilometers per hour, or about 357 mph".

From the wikepedia source, here is the exact test area: "This section of the LGV was chosen for its vertical profile and gentle curves, with favorable downhill segments leading to the highest speeds between kilometer posts 195 and 191"

The 574.8 km/hr was a one point speed at post 191, or basically at a selected optional point with a downhill run and straight track.

There appeared to be no test runs with two trains running in opposite directions and what speed is possible. The JR maglev has the record for that and tests have been ongoing with passing tests.

The key feature is that the maglev offers a design where the vehicles are wrapped around the guideway and thus non-derailable where as the French or other high speed steel wheeled train sets can easily be derailed, especially when trying to operate at high speeds planned with the JR maglev line.

Does anyone know the powere supply requirement for the JR-Maglev? The special French tests were using 31kv.

[Dan @ Jan 2nd 2008 12:20PM]

It looks to me that we're giving up supersonic planes for speedier trains and boats. Or is it just an impression?

[fred @ Jan 3rd 2008 12:45AM]

"By your "you still need a car, so we can't have trains" logic we wouldn't have aircraft either, and yet, somehow, the airline industry is doing pretty well in the US. "

entirely different. people only occasionally use planes. so car rental upon arrival or whatever is justified. getting people to pick you up from the airport is still a chore for most people however.

trains are more a daily transport solution, and as such you need a cheap and good solution for the final leg of the journey.

as for europe, they also have high population density like japan. i wouldn't worry about it, this will happen organically. oil prices will rise, population will rise, people move to the cities. spending on prestige projects is hard to justify when other needs are not being met.