95 percent of all returned gadgets still work, Americans don't read manuals
By Joshua Fruhlinger 
posted June 3rd 2008 9:43AM
posted June 3rd 2008 9:43AM
posted June 3rd 2008 9:43AM
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I call bullshit.
When you work with technology you get exposed to alot of refurb items and I can tell you that many devices can pass testing fine and then fail in actual usage.
Memory and hard drives are notorious offenders but I have seen this with much more complex devices.
Devices that have intermittent issues are almost impossible to quantify as they typically elude diagnosis.
There are obviously a ton of useless end users but %95 is complete bullshit.
agreed
Have you thought about the average consumer? If they can't figure it out without reading the manual, it's 'broken'. This kinda falls in line with when you read how many people with HD sets aren't receiving HD content. Just total consumer ignorance.
Awhile back, I worked at CompUSA and BestBuy. I can tell you that without a doubt, at LEAST 95% of what came back had nothing wrong with it. Highest return rates had to be on memory, video cards, and essentially anything internal to a computer. "Wrong speed memory" does not equal broken.
in my experience, many people just buy it to try it out. as soon as they find "it's not for them", they will just return it with some random reason. My friend bought a PSP, played it for one day and disliked it. so he returned it, blaming on bad battery life and got a DS instead.
You're totally right, We have been victims of something faulty but good luck making it happen when the tech needs to see it.
Let's not forget the Xbox 360 either
Obviously you've never worked at a major consumer electronics retailer. This figure sounds pretty accurate to me.
You have to remember that most people are idiots who buy desktops and whatnot at retail( and return retail), not somewhat tech-savvy people buying system components from Newegg.
Here are some more notable examples from my 2 years in hell:
-Laptop returned because 120GB hard drive only had 100GB, refused to believe the explanation about recovery partition and file tables.
-Digital camera returned because it only held 7 pictures on the included memory card. "It shoudl work without having to buy anything else!"
-Monochrome Laser printer returned because it didn't print in color
-And quite a few PC returns because it ran slow out of the box (Bloatware).
-Also an interesting note, Mac returns were almost double PC returns because people got talked into them by the in-house Apple rep, and then couldn't be bothered to learn something new.
At least 100% of those items that I have purchased that had been re-boxed because they "came back with nothing wrong" with them, failed within three days of bringing them home.
Well, in building computers it was about 90% of computer parts that were RMAs were just fine. I call it pretty close to right on the money. I call your BS, BS, with you and your non-data.
Yep, and the elitist attitude the engadget editors have isnt helping. First off, what manual? Devices dont ship with manuals anymore. They come with;
1. A government mandated useless 'safety' mini-manual.
2. Some warranty flyers.
3. Some random coupons and other garbage.
4. A pdf somewhere on the CD of a badly translated 'manual' that lists basic functions like "on button is here"
When the industry is serious about usability and training, then we'll start seeing users who can help themselves. In the meantime its all returns to the race to the bottom.
haha i bet that 5% were all xbox 360s
The majority of americans make a terrible impact on the planet`s environment and ECONOMY and this statistic is just another example..
@info:
"At least 100%..."?
You mean it could have been 110% of the items you bought?
@substance90:
You are giving off body heat while typing responses. Please stop contributing to global warming.
Everyone is making some good points. I'd just like to add that 95% seems a bit skeptical to me. I guess I refuse to believe people are that stupid or thoughtless.
I can't really say much about other people, but I know that for me personally, 90% of the time I return something it is actually defective and I exchange it for the same exact item.
I have occasionally made the mistake of getting the wrong item, and I exchanged it for the correct one. I don't think exchanges like that should really be counted. Most of the time I haven't even opened the item either.
Many times a return happens for cosmetic reasons. Sometimes the unit doesn't look good with other appliances and sometimes there's a scratch in the plastic of the undercarriage. I sh!t you not. I've had someone return a radio because the plastic on the BOTTOM had a wee scratch in it. Let's not even get into the stolen goods returned in perfect working order.
Oh, I just remembered that I did add to this statistic once. I was at Guitar Center looking for a guitar amp (I primarily played bass or acoustic before that point). Anyways, the sales people are really pushy and such and I was unsure exactly how big I wanted to go. The sales guys are really pushy and any amp I asked questions about it seemed like they just said it would do whatever I expected, which I didn't really believe (commission...). I didn't really want to just buy something without trying one out with the band (it's hard to really tell inside Guitar Center because it's pretty loud in there). The conversation went something like this:
"Nah, I can't buy it right now because I need to research it more."
"We've got a satisfaction guarantee. If you don't like it, just bring it in and get something else."
"Well, that just doesn't seem right. I'm sure it'd probably be a pain anyways."
"Nope, I personally guarantee it, just flag me down and I'll do the exchange."
"Yeah, but if you're not here I'll have to go through some big hoo haw and they'll probably not want to do it."
"Even if I'm not here, you should be able to exchange it no problem. Ask the manager if you don't believe me."
"Well, I'm sure there's some sort of re-stocking fee or something."
"Nope."
"Exchange fee?"
"Nope."
"Well... Alright."
A few weeks later I returned it for something bigger. I still feel a little guilty about that, but hey, they talked me into it.
But maybe Guitar Center doesn't count because they don't RTV anything nor discount open-boxes.
@ ginnal
True, when I sent my ipod in to be fixed due to software issues, (via best buy) they wiped the memory "bench tested" it and sent it back to me and said it was a user error and i didnt tab my songs correctly, and didn't have the latest software, a total crock. lo and behold i synced it up to my i tunes (after following the technician's advice) and it still puts five and six different songs to a cd by a different artist, and when clicked on revert to where the song should go and freeze. all I have to say is thanks alot Assurant, lying sacks of shit.
P.S. dont buy best buy replacement plans they will make an ass out of you
@Kamokazi: I know that we "tech savvy users" tend to accept your arguments, but I can totally understand why normal users are pissed off..
-Laptop returned because 120GB hard drive only had 100GB, refused to believe the explanation about recovery partition and file tables.
What the normal user hears: "Well, I know we advertise that this thing has 120GB, but you know, when we say GB, we don't really mean GB, but 1 million bytes, which is not the same, and that's perfectly fine, and you are and idiot, sir!"
-Digital camera returned because it only held 7 pictures on the included memory card. "It shoudl work without having to buy anything else!"
Well, if it's useless, why was the memory card added at all? You probably announced that it comes with a 32GB memory card, but why should the normal user know how many pictures can be stored on this card? It sould be announced as "comes with a memory card that allows you to store 7 pictures" instead of "32GB memory card included!" (you're just wasting the money of the consumer, since it has to be replaced, anyway)
-And quite a few PC returns because it ran slow out of the box (Bloatware).
Well, if the PC isn't fast enough for this software, then why does it come preinstalled? (especially since there's usually zero extra value added by these stupid bloatware applications).
Kamokazi, your "most people are idiots" statement is a bit insulting. Many people are UNINFORMED about technology, it doesn't necessarily make them idiots.
hmmm... I am not so surprised by this.
In Canadia many of the stores promote there bring it back policies. Many of the sales clerks say "try it out bring it back if you are unsatisfied." I think this is mostly because you really can't tell with the test models. I would say Best Buy is an example.
However I have never had to lie or create an excuse to bring something back. "I want to return this" is usually enough. The staff will ask if it is broken you just tell them "No".
I would like to know who determines that there is nothing wrong with the returned equipment. "It turns on," is not a proper way of determining if it is OK. I simply don't believe the 95% number. The number would be high but not that high.
@(Unverified) - From what I have heard, a lot of hard drives fail because they were mishandled in shipping.
@Kamokazi
IMHO, as someone who has worked in retail for the past 4 years, i actually don't have an issue believing this number. i don't work in a tech store any more (used to work in K-Mart's electronic section but now at Home Depot) but retail is retail and most of the time it comes down to customer ignorance and poor customer qualifying by the sales associate (determining what the customer actually needs). alot of people come in to get something based on hearsay and don't want to take the time to read and find out if it's what they actually need. i had someone return a corded electric lawnmower once cause it wouldn't hold a charge, but if he had taken 5 seconds to read the box he would have seen that it wasn't cordless and didn't even have a battery to recharge. people come in and make assumptions about stuff, have this elevated view of the average retail associates as "experts", and lazy associates don't explain things enough just to get the customer out of the store. the whole concept is fucked cause "experts" don't work for $9 an hour.
personally, i do ALOT of research on a product before i even go into a store to try it our or purchase it. i read reviews, watch videos, and talk to people i know have used it. like when i bought my new cellphone (Verizon Touch Pro 2), i knew more about the phone when i walked in the door than any of the reps could tell me. and not to mention how long it took me to find one and as i'm reading forums with comments like "i bought this Touch Pro 2 but i'll probably return it because it's too bulky" or "it runs Windows Mobile". those are things someone could know with 5 minutes of research and that's what you have to do to minimize buyer remorse. but some people don't want to take that extra step and end up making multiple trips to a store, standing in a return line, and ultimately messing up store stock with returns (because people always want discounts on returned items) because they won't do a little research. and people wonder why we are in a recession.
@(Unverified)
no, its true, I worked at best buy for a while and I'd test out a lot of the returns to see if they were actually broken. and a vast majority of the time(hard to give a percentage), they weren't broken. I'd imagine a lot of the time people would just say it was broken, trying to avoid the restocking fee that would be applied if it weren't broken. I would too if I bought something and didnt like it! that restocking fee can be super painful on those bad buys.
It's been dugg http://digg.com/people/95_Of_Returned_Gadgets_Work_Americans_Don_t_Read_Manuals
RTFM n00bs
but in all seriousness i can picture this story being true, at least no percentage wise, the reasons i can see being completely true
Out of interest, why don't people read the manual? First thing I do when I get a new gadget (after unboxing it and admiring it), is to read the manual, no matter how cursory it is or whether most of it is the electrical regulation compliance and safety information. There's always a small nugget of information that could save hours of frustration.
Anyone care to enlighten me about this attitude? Perhaps this is one for the psychologists to investigate!
@r3loaded.
Only girls read manuals.
before even plugging it in, i read every word in the manual for a sony alarm clock and even commented on a post on amazon to a guy who said that you can't adjust the time.
i enjoyed reading it, but i think most people can care less and expect it to just work out of the box.
@Richy: Guys read manuals too. There's just usually a trip to the bathroom involved.
@ r3loaded
Ah yes, I've been thinking about that too, and the reason people don't read manuals has to be pride. We all know people don't like being told what to do, so why would being instructed by a piece of paper be any different? For technologically illiterate people reading the manual undermines their "authority" over their new possession. Or reading the manual makes them feel incompetent because they can't figure out what the heck they're supposed to do without reading the instructions.
@anon
Haha, awesome... too true.
I'm with Bufsabre too, the shiny new manual is one of the things I get with my new gadget, so I just gotta pour over it. And hopefully it'll educate me on some cool features I would otherwise not known about. Though sometimes the manuals are terrible and worthless. I usually wait to read them until I "take the throne" so to speak, or lay in bed.
see im a little different if i cant figure it out in about 5 minutes of messing around THEN i go to the manual, it should be simple enough to figure out on its own but some things just arent. anyway thats how we learn best is through trial and error.
just thought id put my opinion in the ring.
@JoePalma
Admitdly, i read the manual just for fun. Not for getting bonus information, but i just enjoy reading them. I guess i got really into it from when i was a kid. Buy a new N64 game and on the 20mins ride home, you would be furiously reading that manual, staring at the back of the box, quite excited to get home and play it. Manuals rawk! :P
Americans can't read or reason. NCLB (No Child Left Behind) and those with "Helicopter Parents have created a generation of people who can't read and reason or whose parents did it for them. People can't even figure out how to set the clock on their VCR or microwave because they can't understand the instructions.
America's newspaper is USA TODAY. There is better coverage of the news in the US in some European newspapers then in USA TODAY.
I'm an American. Yes, people here have become completely ignorant and vain. They want the latest and greatest without responsibility or compensation. Heck, only 5% of Americans pay 95% of taxes. The rest are buying and returning HDTVs off our tax money under the disguise of welfare. Grah, don't get me started on a long rant.
Does anybody know how to program a VCR? I thought that was one of life's mysteries...
how articulate.
Americans are dumb, and technology brings that out. I work in IT. At least once a day we get a call about something that isn’t working which turns out to be it was turned off or it was unplugged.
If you have someone that can’t figure out that a monitor isn’t working because it’s turned off, how can you expect them to operate a digital camera, or figure HDTV out?
@Chuck:
Actually, your comment is not correct -- basically just a talking point started by some think tank and repeated by people when convenient. The top 5% pay about 60% of the total income taxes -- not 95%. The top 50% pay 96% of the taxes. The bottom 50% pay about 3%. And welfare people buying HDTVs...? Sounds like more bullshit to me.
The top 5% of earners enjoy the most luxury and utilize more of the system than the rest of the population in order to achieve and maintain their wealth. Therefore it is perfectly fair that they pay the most taxes.
"There is better coverage of the news in the US in some European newspapers then in USA TODAY."
Get off your high horse. You don't even know how to use "then" and "than" properly.
@SugarDaddy
I was not being exact. I was merely emphasizing the unbalance and unfairness in the American tax system. If you don't think people on welfare are wasting their money on things such as HD TVs, open your eyes. That's why their on welfare.
What I cannot fathom is why the government should take my money, whether I worked hard for it or not, and give it to somebody on welfare in the form of food stamps or whatever. A very smart man once called this legalized plunder, and that's exactly what it is. It I want to, out of the goodness of my heart, give my money for food for the poor, then great. But when the government makes that decision for me, and in the process gives millions of dollars away to people sitting on their butt on a couch somewhere, that's a problem.
I don't care what your reasoning, you cannot justify stealing my money (and that of thousands of other Americans) and giving it to poor people. For heaven's sake this is America. It's the place that if you want to work and get rich, all you've gotta do is try.
I apologize for the lengthy rant.
@rick
yeah too bad you assholes beat us to the invention of the telephone, and the lightbulb, andwe musn't forget about the internet, in which you so proudly cast your wares about. we stupid americans just cant find the time to read manuals even though it dosent take a genius to figure out how to use a gps that has step-by-step directions ( THE ENGLISH COMMONS- Tom-tom) maybe we stupid people can invent somting capable of going to the moon, or advance the field of forensic sciences, which evidently murders in other countries are overlooked as accident, e.g. India, Pakistan, Uzbekistan, and maybe a few more countries to mention. you may want to consider the fact that not EVERY, or even Most, Americans ar stupid, but well capable of mentally kicking your ass. the pentagon for instance, has India, England, Russia, ect hacked it yet? c'mon i thought you guys were first and foremost on the academic food chain. i guess nuclear physics, creating massively devistating atomic bombs, utilizing hydrogen as a weapon, and EMP which could send any country to its knees and back into the dark ages, just dosent compute. if you are going to be prejudice, be sure and consider your own nationaliy and its misteaks before pointing out ours, and if by some chance you are an American, you are the dumbass and you need to move to Canada, or California, where country haters such as youself are very much welcome. P.S. burn a flag for me please, you ungrateful swine.
YOURS TRULY,
wise up er' shut up
@(Unverified)
Yes why care about anybody else at all screw the world until you lose your job or get sick longterm then got luck robbing people of their hard earned money.
@(Unverified)
You just projected the skills of the top 1% of Americans onto the extremely untalented other 99%. Congratulations.
@fourthletter
Welfare child? thought so.
I worked in inventory at a local apple store. In my experience 95% might be a little high but it is easily 65-70%. Most of the time people return stuff because of some sort of electronic hypochondriac situation. For example, when the ipod touch first came out and there was a batch of them that had "dark screens" we had multiple people buy and return several ipod touch because they "thought" the screen was dark. It was my job to inspect all the returns and send them back to the warehouse, so I personally looked at ever single returned ipod. All of which had perfectly fine screens. People hear about a problem then they assume that their device has it. Instead of store employees telling them to get lost their ipod is fine it is easier to keep the customer happy and return it.
Are all 5% xbox 360's?
I kid.
I've never worked in any electrical shops myself, but once when I was in Curry's I saw somebody kick up a fuss because he wanted to return his Xbox 1 because he couldn't play any games on it. He said he had 5 games, listed them and said they had no scratches. The guy on the counter asked him if he had any games with him to test it, so he went to his car and brought back a pirated Splinter Cell.
They told him to buy a real game...