Windows 7 details galore: interface tweaks, netbook builds, Media Center enhancements
By Nilay Patel 
posted Oct 28th 2008 1:58PM
posted Oct 28th 2008 1:58PM
- Obviously, the big news is the new taskbar, which forgoes text for icons and has new "jump lists" of app controls and options you can access with a right-click. You can select playlists in Media Player, for example. Super cool: when you scrub over the icons, all the other app windows go transparent so you can "peek" at the windows you're pointing at.
- Gadgets now appear on the desktop -- the sidebar has been killed. That makes more sense for all those laptop owners out there with limited screen space, and you can still see gadgets anytime by peeking at the desktop, rendering all other windows transparent.
- Window resizing and management now happens semi-automatically: dragging a window to the top of the screen maximizes it, pulling it down restores; dragging a window to the edges auto-resizes it to 50% for quick tiling. Nifty.
- The system tray now only displays what you explicitly say it should -- everything else is hidden, and the controls have been streamlined.
- User Account Control settings are now much more fine-grained -- you can set them by app and by level of access.
- They demoed multitouch features on an HP TouchSmart PC -- it was pretty cool, although the usual nagging "what is this good for / that'll get old fast" concerns weren't really addressed. The Start menu gets 25 percent bigger when using touch to make it easier to handle, and apps will all get scroll support automatically. There's also a giant on-screen predictive keyboard. Again -- could be amazing, but we won't know until it's out in the wild.
- We've always known Microsoft intends Windows 7 to run on netbooks, and we got a small taste during the PDC keynote: Windows SVP Steve Sinofsky held up his "personal" laptop running Windows 7, an unnamed 1GHz netbook with 1GB of RAM that looked a lot like an Eee PC, and said that it still had about half its memory free after boot. (We're guessing it was running a VIA Nano, given the announcement this morning and since most Atoms run at 1.6GHz.)
- At the other end of the scale, Windows 7 supports machines with up to 256 CPUs.
- Multiple-monitor management is much-improved, as is setting up projectors -- it's a hotkey away. Remote Desktop now works with multiple monitors as well.
- Media Center has been tweaked as well -- it looks a lot more like the Zune interface. There's also a new Mini Guide when watching video, and a new Music Wall album artwork screensaver that kicks in when you're playing music.
- Devs got a pre-beta today; a "pretty good" feature complete beta is due early next year. No word at all on when it'll be released to market apart from that "three years from Vista" date we've known forever.
Read - Keynote videos on the PDC site
Read - Technologizer Windows 7 hands-on
Read - Ars Technica Windows 7 interface walkthrough
Read - Laptop Windows 7 hands-on
Read - Windows 7 Media Center revealed
Not sure if I like the new taskbar...I like my text. What if I have like 4 Word docs open? I want to know which is which.
You hover over, and a pop up shows up showing you all the open word docs.
It seems very intuitive.
You can even hover over one of the docs and that goes to the foreground to show you it.
"The system tray now only displays what you explicitly say it should -- everything else is hidden, and the controls have been streamlined."
No more "Safely Remove Devices"?!??!? About time!
Safely remove devices wasnt exactly the worst idea out there. Compared to OS X.
But yes, it should have been hideable.
Hopefully there is an option to have this OS appear and behave just like XP...
Another issue .. stacking downwards photos right to left is annoying .. should have been the other way.
http://www.activewin.com/screenshots/windows7/Libraries.png
@ iEye
Why would anyone want their OS to look like XP, Yuk !
@Major4Play
iEye said to behave like XP, not look like XP. Either way, I would want windows 7 to behave like XP, to be slim and snappy, of course with all the good looking features
nah .. I don't like the idea of rolling over something to see what it is. that's not intuitive or user-friendly.
tom: appear and look are synonyms.
Please GOD, let this new windows not be made for beginners like vista.
I want the control panel similar to XP and please bring back the tabs in control options.
I did not switch my laptop because I feel vista is for beginners. I takes me longer to change a setting.
I want quick user control access that is NOT DUMBED DOWN!!
oh please micro$oft,oh please.
@tom, read again.
Why do everyone love XP so much? Of course it's quick on modern computers when it's about 8 years old! It's old and overrated.
blarvh: I am running XP, it is working fine for me. There is no reason for me to switch. The only reason is Halo 2 PC... but that runs very slowly under Vista! However when I use the hack to make it run under XP, it runs much better.
Of course, this is just me. Undoubtably other users may find Vista seems as responsive as XP... but they likely have one of the following conditions:
1) They don't play any games past Solitaire, where the performance drop becomes most noticeable.
2) They have a new processor. The newer the processor, the better your computer will run. However XP will run even better... but at a certain point the performance gain from XP over Vista doesn't really matter much anymore. I am nowhere near there yet... Vista is simply too slow for my processor.
Even if I tweak Vista's running services, and turn off all the eye candy, there is hardly any speed boost. XP still beats Vista when all of XP's eye candy is ON, and with an anti-virus installed (I just uninstalled AVG and got a significant performance boost out of XP... and it STILL beat Vista then).
That said, I have gotten Vista to run well... when I strip everything out using vLite. At that point, it's basically the same feature set as XP (actually a bit less)... so I don't see any point in using it.
Don't get me wrong... when I get a new CPU I may very well switch to Vista. However at the moment even if I do there's little on that OS that I care for at the moment that I can't get elsewhere for free (IE third party programs etc).
Summary: I don't use Vista because I feel, for my purposes, it is overrated. XP works for me, it's faster for me, and I have no need to upgrade. That is why I (and probably many others) choose XP over Vista.
WRT the start bar, in theory there'll be an option to show full document names,etc , highly unlikely they'll just get rid of it completely.
I don't think it's intuitive at all to have to move your mouse to see what's open. What if you just want to look at a glance, it's counter-productive for most situations, that's an extra mouse gesture you have to do every time you want to see what you've got open.
Personally i think it looks too simplistic. The reason i like XP, and Vista too for the most part is that it looked businesslike - or at least reasonably professional. This just looks a bit too "easy to use" rather than functional. I'm sure it'll actually be nice and intuitive once i've had a play on it, but for now i prefer the functionality of XP/OS X. One thing Apple got right is that their interface has been pretty much the same - and it's very good on the whole - hardware notwithstanding. Windows on the other hand has spent lots of time rejigging interfaces and i can't help but think they should have stayed with the Vista styling which was nice, instead of going for a whole new UI. In contrast, i like how the new app grouping system works. It's a nice touch, it works well when tabbing between windows so it should be good there too.
Otherwise it looks good. Jump Lists are a great idea, file browsing looks well done - i'll probably get this when it's released after i find out what the status of compatibility is, there are workarounds for most things i've found.
@ Dan Bugglin
That is a poor excuse. Quit being a such a broke fool and get vista.
Kinda reminds me of Mojave.
Also, and this is a small complaint, I don't like how the http:, www, and slashes are all greyed out in the address bar. I understand the point of it; it highlights the "friendly" part of the URL, but I think it makes it look busy and draws unneeded attention to the address bar.
am i the only one to hate XP 64 bit? Vista is way faster in 8gb than xp was.
funny, all this was available on a MAC 5 years ago.... Way to keep up MS
yea some botons dont look write, just tweek it and make it like the mac dock, just avoid the making of a taskbar nobody likes, just use one that everyone likes (hint hint MAC)
@william
O RLY?
Like how mac had:
-desktop gadgets (no, the widget layer doesn't count, they arent always there, you have to interact to bring it up)
-auto resizing windows
-transparancy to highlight the window you're peeking at
-OS designed for multitouch interaction.......or any kind of touch interaction
-a netbook capable OS
Yeah, they've had all these things for like 5 years...oh wait, they don't have any of them, even now.
"2) They have a new processor. The newer the processor, the better your computer will run. However XP will run even better... but at a certain point the performance gain from XP over Vista doesn't really matter much anymore. I am nowhere near there yet... Vista is simply too slow for my processor."
Perhaps, but...
http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,2845,2302499,00.asp
This is on a E6750 which is a fairly decent CPU although, since the issue was craptastic drivers, any Core 2 Duo will give you the same result.
I appreciate that if you're running an old P4 then you might be better with XP - I don't know, never tried it - but if you're buying a new PC you'd be a mug to choose XP over Vista.
Bottom line: Upgrade? No. XP on a new machine? LOL!
I like the idea. I usually have maybe 8-12 windows open, I never get to see the text part anyway, icons would save space and be easier to recognize.
@curtisrutland
in Tiger (and in Leopard probably) you can display gadgets from Dashboard on the desktop (in devmode).
Also, Leopard was installed on netbooks (http://uneasysilence.com/archive/2008/10/13519/) and seems to run very well.
The transparency part is indeed not present on the mac, but honestly this is something that always bothered me in vista. All the transparent and blurry things behind the front window dont help me focus at all.
I agree with the auto resizing windows, seems to be a great feature.
move shit around, put in a little wow, a pinch omg, but did they fix all the errors and warnings in vista? (yes, I have SP fucking one)
Take a look at my comment history and you'll see I would probably be considered an Apple "Fanboy". But I'll have to admit, Microsoft is definitely heading in the right direction. It looks sharp and everything i'm hearing about functionality sounds like some great improvements.
Looks pretty good. Thank god they're revamping the horrible start menu/quicklaunch/taskbar/system tray fiasco. I wish they'd lay off the eye candy a bit, though. It's fine where appropriate, but Microsoft seems to try to take it to the extreme, to the extent that it limits the usable space in the various windows. For example, in the screenshot, they waste ungodly amounts of space on the title bar, menu bar, side bar, and whatever the bar is at the bottom. What, do they get a cut of new LCD display purchases or something? :)
"What's compelling about touch is that it works everywhere in Windows 7. It's not some hokey add-on that works only in certain applications and only partially in others. (I'm looking at you, Apple.) "
-Paul Thurrott (www.winsupersite.com)
It seems like MS can't afford to hire a better UI/graphic designer or something... or they simply still don't get it, why Apple keep stealing the market share from them...
Poor nerd in MS, please... please simplify the UI and dress it up like a 21st century system to give us the wow factor... I believe Mac OS is not better than Windows, but it really look gorgeous... and we really care about STYLE & FASHION
"What's compelling about touch is that it works everywhere in Windows 7. It's not some hokey add-on that works only in certain applications and only partially in others. (I'm looking at you, Apple.) "
-Paul Thurrott (www.winsupersite.com)
As far as I'm aware, desktop OSX doesn't support multi-touch.
The multi-touch enabled trackpads aren't supposed to replace the mouse - they're supposed to extend the things normal trackpads can do. That's why it's on the trackpad and not the screen.
I actually realy like this OS. Looks very clean and clear. Kinda reminds me of Longhorn during its development. I hope UAC has been improved alot though - it made re-installing all my apps etc after a hard drive failure a labourious task (to say the least).
Now I come to think about it, does anyone know if in theory Windows 7 would be prone to simillar driver issues that plagued Windows Vista's release? Or would it use the drivers which were developed for Vista without much trouble? (Sorry, probably a bit of a noob question. Just curious.)
Almost looks like linux. But not bad, not bad at all.
So can you tell me what Linux looks like?
Like Gnome? Like XFCE4? Like KDE? Like Enlightment? Or any other WM you can image in out there?
Exactly...which windows manager were you hinting at there, imacmatt09? It doesn't look anything like my OpenBox display I have running...
KDE.
http://tredosoft.com/files/pictures/kde.png
Not the same but similar. I think Windows 7 looks better though.
The only thing that looks similar is transparency and gadgets...
KDE was made so to give people coming from Windows somthing that looked similar to the Windows Start menu/Task bar.
Wow.
Ever consider that KDE was modeled after Windows?
Well sorry for not being so knowing that KDE was modeled from Windows. All I was trying to say that it looks similar more similar now and that Windows 7 looks good.
This screenshot is a bit closer:
http://www.kde.org/announcements/4.1/screenshots/desktop.png
If you use the small Kicker panel and turn off the labels on the panel icons, you get pretty much the same look as the Windows 7 shot. I like it a lot. :)
Yes, this does look like KDE, the time looks exactly what KDE looks like if you configure to show date and time (all the screenshots for KDE i saw only had time and no date showing). The way the systray icons are all small and look cheap is KDE-ish.
Also, is that space next to the date and time the place you can click to hide the toolbar, because if so, that is very KDE-ish.
Just one other question....Is Windows 7 going to have multiple desktops??
"fred @ Oct 28th 2008 2:21PM
KDE was made so to give people coming from Windows somthing that looked similar to the Windows Start menu/Task bar."
You are correct. But KDE also came up with a lot of it's own cool ideas as it borrowed and integrated ideas from many systems. If Microsoft wants to return the favor, more power to them.
What's cool about KDE is the high level of configurability while maintaining a familiar and intuitive interface.
There's little point in arguing chicken and eggs. Just like auto companies, software companies all copy each other and evolve their systems from what they see in others.
I like how the original poster gave a compliment to Linux and got destroyed for it by Linux supporters.
that's what I thought too from the first look actually, so give the guy a break please, no need for y'all to be aggressive like this ...
I only counted three snide remarks. The rest of us where carrying on a discussion and being informative. :)
If anything, the statement "It looks like Linux" is too simplistic because of the reasons offered in the second comment. But I'm not here to bash the guy for that. In fact I'll say good spotting that, imacmatt09. It probably does look like Linux as he saw Linux, and I think you can find many Linux configurations which have for some years looked like this new Windows interface, and that's fine. As fred was trying to point out, KDE was originally designed to mimic the most familiar aspects of windows. But since that inception the KDE team has had many integrations from other window managers as well as innovations of their own. If Microsoft wants to borrow some of those things back and make a better operating system, I say go for it. It's a smart thing to do.
All window interfaces are rip offs of Xerox Alto an Xerox Star. Including MS Windows, Mac OS and KDE.
It looked like this.
http://www.vintagecomputing.com/wp-content/images/namepixels/pixels11_num2_answer_large.gif
If I hadn't seen the title, I could've easily thought that someone had done a KDE reskin.
Sounds awesome!
Super awesome indeed!
I hope they keep releasing new updates every 10 minutes. This *might start looking like a blog without personal preferences interfering.
i kid!
Too be honest I don't really care either way. The Apple post generate a whole lot more traffic than MS posts so they have to go where the money is.
I really don't think Engadget is biased at all.
Hehe they (Engadget) even remembered the 'breaking news'-tag.
But this is actually huge, and if you ask me I'm alot more interested in Windows 7 than Snow Leopard, which is going to be installed on my MacBook from day one;
-Cool new GUI improvements / better Vista interface
-Great perfomance
-Awesome taskbar
-A lot of small fixes and features
Good job MS!
Meh..
Is it me, or is this underwhelming? It doesn't look all that impressive at all. Sort of Mac-ish, but not as refined as the current Mac OS is right now.
Its you.
Definatly.
Yeah its definitely you. I see no similarities between OS X and 7.
I've got a mac, I like the mac, I think this looks nothing like a mac. Macs have quite a stripped-down UI now, this seems quite cluttered but I suppose flexible, and probably requires less explanation than a mac to a new user.
Well to me it looks a lot more harmonic than Mac OS
oh cool, BeOS is making a comeback =D
I liked BeOS....... ran great.
It never went away......There is still a small team working a BeOS....
Don't I wish. :)
BeOS was awesome. Too bad it never really took off. What a super lightweight and elegant system.
ha. tough crowd.
looks pretty good
That looks just like an operating system I have installed on my PCs. It's called Windows Vista.
Uhh it was never supposed to be vastly different
Snow Leopard will look similar to Leopard.
The latest Ubuntu looks almost NO DIFFERENT from the one two releases ago.
Sounds like they brought a lot of features in while retaining the downwards compatibility with only one Windowmanager. Pretty impressive.
And it sounds like they have learned a lot from compiz-fusion, too :)
I know dude they definitely copied OSX!
Just look at it! OSx has a taskbar! Windows 7 has a taskbar! HOLY SHIT THEY ARE BOTH THE SAME!
http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/5136/14235601jt4.jpg
With Windows 7 coming out so soon after Vista.... will it be rushed? And we will it suck until Windows 7 SP1 comes out?
Oh come on... I'm being serious!
XP came out in 2001, Vista in 2007. Just wondering how things will be different this time around.
Well, if you RTFA, you would know that they aren't making any massive architectural changes. Basically they said any software/hardware that works with Vista will work with 7. In a way, think of 7 as Vista's Second Chance. This time, they get an even newer, slicker UI, but keep all the changes under the hood that actually help the OS.
"And we will it suck until Windows 7 SP1 comes out?"
Looks like your sentence was rushed.
Do none of you understand why Vista failed? It's already far more streamlined and improved over XP and already has a slick and new UI. Making them newer and slicker won't change a thing. Anyone else working in a field where you're introducing people to computers through retail or whatever are going to already know everything I'm saying. People (the masses) want intuitive, RELIABLE (as in works the same way, ONE way, every time), but at the same same time very technically capable computers as well. You CAN NOT achieve that kind of environment by developing your OS and your hardware separately. On top of that you can't just give "Joe six pack" a computer with Vista on it and expect him to go out and get the best software for his photo and video editing, DVD playing program, photo management, etc.. People want ONE program that works well, and that comes with their computer for each task. They want ALL of their programs to compliment each other and seamlessly work together. If you've ever repaired computers you know the most common problems always stem from that one root problem - software incompatibilities. The ONLY problems people saw with Vista was when they had their own idea of what hardware it should go on and what software they should use and they all clashed with each other - because they were never developed FOR each other. I could go on and on as to why this is propelling Apple ahead of their competition in sales right now but that would just piss off all the Windows diehards.
@utahnkid
That's not really Vista's problem, and if they did try to bundle every program you need, they'd have their asses sued right away.
Vista's biggest problem was one of advertising, PR, and a weak launch. Vista had some real bugs at launch, bugs that were quickly taken care of. Other than that, it was mainly just a bit confusing, because menus moved around to more logical arrangements, but people have spent 7 years learning XPs menus.
Because of that poor launch, some early adopters, (and people who didn't want to change) spread their crap all over the internet, and to their friends. "Don't buy Vista, it sucks." And Apple absolutely pounced. They slammed MS with humiliating ads that MS did nothing about.
That's where the problems came from. People formed a heavily biased opinion having never used the product.
Now, they have an ad campaign going. They have something that looks and feels different than vista, without having to completely rewrite the stuff under the hood. Like I said, Vista's second chance.
@utahnkid
"People (the masses) want intuitive, RELIABLE (as in works the same way, ONE way, every time), but at the same same time very technically capable computers as well. You CAN NOT achieve that kind of environment by developing your OS and your hardware separately."
And yet people (the masses) overwhelmingly use Windows around the world, and accomplish amazing things every day using the operating system, despite the fact it's developed separately from hardware.
Actually...
Wikipedia would help with this but,
XP = 2001
XP/64 = 2002
Windows 2003 Server = 2004
Vista = 2007
Windows Server 2008 = late2007/early2008
So seems like Microsoft has been pushing out OSs pretty rapidly
Sweet lord! This looks amazing. :)
hell yes, my friend. if this thing can run on a current netbook at 1.6ghz, i cant wait for the new devices that will be able to run it in the future.
if an oqo can run vista, we're all in for a treat in 1 year.
cant wait to beta test this
LOL @ Saad. You drink that kool-aid! You drink it up!
Hi, Mr. Zak Pot... Mr. Mikey Kettle. Yeah, you're black.
Sign me up. I use Macs right now, but my next computer will be Windows 7!
(The two operating systems aren't mutually exclusive, though)
it looks very usable... i never got that impression from Vista.
my one concern is still security. having this great, light, streamlined version of Windows is still no help to me if i've got viruses, or have to run so much anti-everything-ware that my computer is slowed down again.
for me, i don't see Apple and Linux growing because they're phenomenally better or different... it's because people don't want to deal with the gaping holes. hopefully those are all getting patched up.
It's your own dumb ass for getting viruses. I have run Win98, Win2000 Pro, WinXP Pro all without anti-virus software and never had a problem.
Anti-virus software is for people who don't know how to responsibly compute.
I'm glad they're taking the google approach to things. (except a little prettier)
light, fast & streamlined is the way to go.
kjb434 also uses one drive and never makes a backup, keeps his financials in a .txt file on a floppy that he takes with him everywhere, plugs in along with 30 other devices into the same outlet, and keeps his password (singular) on a sticky note attached to under his desk.
This sparks a memory I have from some big hacker conference that engadget reported on last year. One of the main events was hacking the big three OSs: Windows, OSX, some Linux Distro. I seem to recall OSX lasting about 90 minutes, WIndows Vista lasting two days, and the Linux system holding up through the entire conference.
So I'm tempted to say that OSX ain't so secure after all, but I can't find the articles or results, or even the conference name to back me up. Anybody remember this and have a read link?
@jorvay:
You're thinking of the PWN 2 OWN contest back in March:
http://www.engadget.com/2008/03/27/pwn-2-own-over-macbook-air-gets-seized-in-2-minutes-flat/
http://www.engadget.com/2008/03/29/linux-becomes-only-os-to-escape-pwn-2-own-unscathed/
Thanks Erik, I've been going nuts trying to remember what it was.
looks like Vista II, to me. BFD
hope it has better memory management
Amen!
I switched to Mac one year ago but I must say I'm impressed with the changes presented here. GUI-wise these are some very innovative and usefull changes, I really like!
I do however hope the underpinnings will be just as streamlined as the GUI, I mean... if it still has the lackluster memory management, and poor 64bit support I'm not very keen on switching back... Wait and see I guess, but looks like Apple better have something nice up their sleeves for Snow Leopard.
What's wrong with Vista's memory management? And please don't say it "uses it all" because I will facepalm.
Can we also cover the poor 64 bit support bit too because that's got me a bit confused?
I wonder if the multi-touch features will also be usable on the Dell XT tablet with no modifications.
it will, i got a copy of the prebeta online at some site and tried it out. it works. but i warn you, it is really jerky at times. but im sure theyll work out the bugs when its officially released.
The Dell XT already supports multitouch within Vista, just download the hardware update from Dell.
Yes, the Dell does support multitouch in Vista already, but only 3 gimmicky gestures.
Zoom, scroll, and turn screen off.
From what I understand, the multitouch will be much more pervasive in Windows 7.
There's actually a demo video somewhere of multitouch in Windows 7 on the XT. The gestures look much smoother than N-Trig's.