I don't understand why all the criticism when Microsoft shows people with realistic values purchasing computers. The fact is that Apple owns ~10% of the market share for PCs, and the reason for that isn't because they're brainwashed into being stupid. It's because of compatibility with their work. It's because there is a noticable price difference in the store. It's because of personal familiarity with Windows of the users. It's because of gaming. When anyone points out there are reasons not to want to spend more money for a product that doesn't meet their needs adequately, all the Mac fans in the world (ie, the writers and artists of the world) pile out of the wood work and claim that it's a sham. Could it be that most of the PC users in the world just have different values than Mac users? Is that too much to believe?
the only people who bother to comment in these types of posts are fanboys for each side. in other words, you're wasting your breath on ~1% of the computer users.
i'm a graphic designer. ever since i got my vista 64 bit, 8x2.66 GHz, 8 GB, quadro fx 3700 rig, you couldn't pay me to use my mac. actually, i guess i'll still use it for the internets and what-not.
I'm also a graphic designer, and I actually used my head to buy the following:
Intel i7-920- 2.6 GHz ASUS P6T Deluxe motherboard Transcend RAM - 10 GB DDR 3 - 1333 BUS (2GB X 5) GIGABYTE Case "Aluminium" Sumo - Black FSP Power Supply 800 Watts GIGABYTE NVIDIA 9800GTX 512 MB DDR DDR3 PCI-E WD HDD 1 TB SATA -7200 RPM 32MB Cache Windows Vista U 64bit Microsoft thin Wireless Keyboard and Mouse.
All for about $1700 only!!! I shit you not.
Now tell me, how can anyone talk about any Mac after all of this awesomeness at that price?!
Because to the Mac fanboy (not the general user), they want competition, except if it is competition with an Appe product. They want choice, as long as the only choice is Apple. They want you to Think Different, as long as you think the way Apple does.
Any criticism, any challenge, or pointing out any problems with an Apple product and it sends them into a tailspin. If you do criticize, then you are just not enlightened like they are (see any of Paul's posts). If you do challenge, such as with the Zune, then you are just copying everything Apple has ever done (see any of Jubei's posts). If you show a flaw, it is not Apple's fault, it is because you are an idiot and too stupid to know how to use the offering made by Apple and it is your fault (see any of Zak's posts).
To a Microsoft user, we know it is not perfect. We will admit to flaws, mistakes, imperfections, and downright stupid things they have done. But to the other side, they criticize Microsoft for those problems (and often, those criticisms are valid) but when Apple does the same exact thing, eh, it is OK, because Apple did it. Some examples are: Drivers missing from Vista - the OS is a failure. Drivers missing from Leopard (search for missing HP printer drivers) - why would you want to use a 4 year old printer? Vista puts up a UAC dialog when trying to modify protected data areas or install software - the OS is a failure. OS X puts up a similar dialog - it is there to protect the user. Microsoft puts content DRM support in their code - the code is a failure. Apple has content protection in their code - it is there to allow more people to download meida they want. Microsoft puts out a commercial saying that Windows computers are cheaper than Apple computers - how dare they. Apple has commercial after commercial attacking Microsoft, sometimes lying, sometimes showing flaws in Microsoft products when Apple has those same problems, sometimes saying one thing when it is Apple that does it (remember the disclaimer ad from Apple, how many disclaimers do you see in a Microsoft ad, how many do you see in an iPhone commercial) - Yeah! Stick it to them Apple, they deserve to be dragged through the mud.
Here's to the imperfect ones. The invisible. The less-fortunate. Those that make do with what they have. Valuing substance over appearance. The ones who embrace options.
They're not fond of restrictions. And they have no respect for the latest trends.
You can praise them, disagree with them, quote them, disbelieve them, glorify or vilify them. About the only thing you can't do is ignore them.
Because they make things possible.
They take risks. They cheat. They make opportunites. They attempt dangerous things. They flirt with failure. They try what others don't.
@Saad Rabia I really hate to burst your bubble but if you had used your head to buy that then you would have realized that 10gb's of ram will not work with an i7 processor because it requires triple channel memory. 3, 6, 12, or 24gb's.
Also while it does cost more for a mac pro you have to keep in mind that the mac pro has 2 server grade i7 processors in it along with a damn sexy case and has better software support for graphic designers and movie makers.
@everyone 1080p on a laptop isn't important. The screen is so small that you will never notice the extra resolution for watching movies. if you are doing something that needs a lot on the screen at once get a desktop.
@cosmo you make some valid points. You point out apples defensiveness about the Eula, there are 2 reasons they are like that. 1. so they can sell hardware. 2.It keeps quality of user experience consistent and makes it easier for their engineers to write solid code. When Microsoft makes windows they have to have it be fully compatible with 100's of motherboards, 100's of graphics cards, 100's of sound cards, 100's of processors, 100's of dvd drives, where as Apple only has 10 processors 10 motherboards, 10 graphics cards, and 10 sound cards they have to support so it is much easier for them to write good software that takes full advantage of the hardware and has as few hardware based vulnerabilities as possible.
lack of bluray is kinda annoying, so is hdmi, but I understand why they don't do both. bluray cuts into their sale and rental of hd movies on itunes which they feel is going to win over bluray because of the easy of use and the speed of the internet. and no hdmi allows them to sell adapters so that if a user wants to use a non apple external monitor then they still have to pay a little money to apple. greedy I know, but it's how they do it. Also 99% of users don't care for those sort of things. In my experience most people only use usb ports and don't feel comfortable with the other ports because they don't know what they do.
also for the record I am not a mac fan boy. I several windows pc's but for laptops I feel that the build quality of apples is worth the extra money. I just purchased a 15" macbook pro(refurbished so it didn't cost as much) and a i7 desktop. I am all about quality of my computing experience and I just find windows laptops to be clunky poorly designed and they tend to run slower even with faster hardware. My macbook pro boots from off to usable in 20 seconds. I have never seen a windows laptop 100% usable in under 30. I think that everyone should buy a mac laptop and return it after a week and see if they still feel the same way about their windows laptop.,
The truth. Most people still use Windows because of three reasons. Price. Not having to learn a new system. Compatibility with a wide array of software including games.
@saad Rabia --> okay, find a prebuilt computer with all those specs and see how much they charge for that.its obviously gonna be cheaper if u build ur own computer...
@Saad @Slamevil Im a graphic designer and web developer and i got a last gen 24" 3.0 ghz imac with the 8800 gts and 4 gb of ram sitting next to my overclocked c2d q6600 3.2ghz 4 gb ram, dual 8800gtx's, and you couldn’t pay me to use that windows box for work anymore.
Once you truly figure out the workflow and power of OS X, i don't see how you could go back to working on a windows computer. But i do use that win machine to play games sometimes, but not as much as the imac, even for gaming.
The fact that i can without installing some insanely unsafe windows scripting program, create an instant workflow from apple script that will touch up all of my photos without even opening ANY program like photoshop, size them for web and even apply effects to them. And i can do all of this stuff with a mac that i take right out of the box. And no im not talking about fucking iphoto here.
Ok so the new thing on engadget is for all the windows people to just massively downrank EVERYTHING that is not an advertisement for windows. Awesome good job engadget.
The point being that there is a reason the Mac costs more. Period. Compare the hinges on a mac lappie to a PC. But mostly its the software quality and compatibility. Apple doesn't have to test on x number of hardware and drivers generally do not suck. They have a known manufactorer, a known market, well thought out developer guidelines. Sure they are a year behind hardware wise... but it works. And it works great. Not 'ok', not 'just good enough'. Crashing is unacceptable. Steve is a perfectionist. And this is what you pay for. What you don't pay for, you don't get. No tablets. No support for 'x', because its never half implemented. Look at the early bluetooth stacks and wifi drivers on pc vs mac, its a given.
Now that we've thrown 'em off the trail, use the form below to get in touch with the people at Engadget. Please fill in all of the required fields because they're required.
I don't understand why all the criticism when Microsoft shows people with realistic values purchasing computers. The fact is that Apple owns ~10% of the market share for PCs, and the reason for that isn't because they're brainwashed into being stupid. It's because of compatibility with their work. It's because there is a noticable price difference in the store. It's because of personal familiarity with Windows of the users. It's because of gaming. When anyone points out there are reasons not to want to spend more money for a product that doesn't meet their needs adequately, all the Mac fans in the world (ie, the writers and artists of the world) pile out of the wood work and claim that it's a sham. Could it be that most of the PC users in the world just have different values than Mac users? Is that too much to believe?
Except they don't. Generally, it's more like "Apple is an overpriced toy vs. Vista sux."
the only people who bother to comment in these types of posts are fanboys for each side. in other words, you're wasting your breath on ~1% of the computer users.
i'm a graphic designer. ever since i got my vista 64 bit, 8x2.66 GHz, 8 GB, quadro fx 3700 rig, you couldn't pay me to use my mac. actually, i guess i'll still use it for the internets and what-not.
I'm also a graphic designer, and I actually used my head to buy the following:
Intel i7-920- 2.6 GHz
ASUS P6T Deluxe motherboard
Transcend RAM - 10 GB DDR 3 - 1333 BUS (2GB X 5)
GIGABYTE Case "Aluminium" Sumo - Black
FSP Power Supply 800 Watts
GIGABYTE NVIDIA 9800GTX 512 MB DDR DDR3 PCI-E
WD HDD 1 TB SATA -7200 RPM 32MB Cache
Windows Vista U 64bit
Microsoft thin Wireless Keyboard and Mouse.
All for about $1700 only!!! I shit you not.
Now tell me, how can anyone talk about any Mac after all of this awesomeness at that price?!
Because to the Mac fanboy (not the general user), they want competition, except if it is competition with an Appe product. They want choice, as long as the only choice is Apple. They want you to Think Different, as long as you think the way Apple does.
Any criticism, any challenge, or pointing out any problems with an Apple product and it sends them into a tailspin.
If you do criticize, then you are just not enlightened like they are (see any of Paul's posts).
If you do challenge, such as with the Zune, then you are just copying everything Apple has ever done (see any of Jubei's posts).
If you show a flaw, it is not Apple's fault, it is because you are an idiot and too stupid to know how to use the offering made by Apple and it is your fault (see any of Zak's posts).
To a Microsoft user, we know it is not perfect. We will admit to flaws, mistakes, imperfections, and downright stupid things they have done. But to the other side, they criticize Microsoft for those problems (and often, those criticisms are valid) but when Apple does the same exact thing, eh, it is OK, because Apple did it. Some examples are:
Drivers missing from Vista - the OS is a failure. Drivers missing from Leopard (search for missing HP printer drivers) - why would you want to use a 4 year old printer?
Vista puts up a UAC dialog when trying to modify protected data areas or install software - the OS is a failure. OS X puts up a similar dialog - it is there to protect the user.
Microsoft puts content DRM support in their code - the code is a failure. Apple has content protection in their code - it is there to allow more people to download meida they want.
Microsoft puts out a commercial saying that Windows computers are cheaper than Apple computers - how dare they. Apple has commercial after commercial attacking Microsoft, sometimes lying, sometimes showing flaws in Microsoft products when Apple has those same problems, sometimes saying one thing when it is Apple that does it (remember the disclaimer ad from Apple, how many disclaimers do you see in a Microsoft ad, how many do you see in an iPhone commercial) - Yeah! Stick it to them Apple, they deserve to be dragged through the mud.
And so that is why there is so much criticism.
I don't know how you designers can use Vista.
My agency would never allow that.
Here's to the imperfect ones.
The invisible.
The less-fortunate.
Those that make do with what they have.
Valuing substance over appearance.
The ones who embrace options.
They're not fond of restrictions.
And they have no respect for the latest trends.
You can praise them, disagree with them, quote them, disbelieve them, glorify or vilify them.
About the only thing you can't do is ignore them.
Because they make things possible.
They take risks. They cheat. They make opportunites.
They attempt dangerous things. They flirt with failure. They try what others don't.
They find the way forward.
Maybe they have to be imperfect.
@Saad Rabia
I really hate to burst your bubble but if you had used your head to buy that then you would have realized that 10gb's of ram will not work with an i7 processor because it requires triple channel memory. 3, 6, 12, or 24gb's.
Also while it does cost more for a mac pro you have to keep in mind that the mac pro has 2 server grade i7 processors in it along with a damn sexy case and has better software support for graphic designers and movie makers.
@everyone 1080p on a laptop isn't important. The screen is so small that you will never notice the extra resolution for watching movies. if you are doing something that needs a lot on the screen at once get a desktop.
@cosmo you make some valid points. You point out apples defensiveness about the Eula, there are 2 reasons they are like that. 1. so they can sell hardware. 2.It keeps quality of user experience consistent and makes it easier for their engineers to write solid code. When Microsoft makes windows they have to have it be fully compatible with 100's of motherboards, 100's of graphics cards, 100's of sound cards, 100's of processors, 100's of dvd drives, where as Apple only has 10 processors 10 motherboards, 10 graphics cards, and 10 sound cards they have to support so it is much easier for them to write good software that takes full advantage of the hardware and has as few hardware based vulnerabilities as possible.
lack of bluray is kinda annoying, so is hdmi, but I understand why they don't do both. bluray cuts into their sale and rental of hd movies on itunes which they feel is going to win over bluray because of the easy of use and the speed of the internet. and no hdmi allows them to sell adapters so that if a user wants to use a non apple external monitor then they still have to pay a little money to apple. greedy I know, but it's how they do it. Also 99% of users don't care for those sort of things. In my experience most people only use usb ports and don't feel comfortable with the other ports because they don't know what they do.
also for the record I am not a mac fan boy. I several windows pc's but for laptops I feel that the build quality of apples is worth the extra money. I just purchased a 15" macbook pro(refurbished so it didn't cost as much) and a i7 desktop. I am all about quality of my computing experience and I just find windows laptops to be clunky poorly designed and they tend to run slower even with faster hardware. My macbook pro boots from off to usable in 20 seconds. I have never seen a windows laptop 100% usable in under 30. I think that everyone should buy a mac laptop and return it after a week and see if they still feel the same way about their windows laptop.,
@Robert Harrold:
you what?
The truth. Most people still use Windows because of three reasons.
Price.
Not having to learn a new system.
Compatibility with a wide array of software including games.
@saad Rabia --> okay, find a prebuilt computer with all those specs and see how much they charge for that.its obviously gonna be cheaper if u build ur own computer...
@Decoy
Damn, dude. That might be a bit too deep for this site.
@Saad @Slamevil Im a graphic designer and web developer and i got a last gen 24" 3.0 ghz imac with the 8800 gts and 4 gb of ram sitting next to my overclocked c2d q6600 3.2ghz 4 gb ram, dual 8800gtx's, and you couldn’t pay me to use that windows box for work anymore.
Once you truly figure out the workflow and power of OS X, i don't see how you could go back to working on a windows computer. But i do use that win machine to play games sometimes, but not as much as the imac, even for gaming.
The fact that i can without installing some insanely unsafe windows scripting program, create an instant workflow from apple script that will touch up all of my photos without even opening ANY program like photoshop, size them for web and even apply effects to them. And i can do all of this stuff with a mac that i take right out of the box. And no im not talking about fucking iphoto here.
Ok so the new thing on engadget is for all the windows people to just massively downrank EVERYTHING that is not an advertisement for windows. Awesome good job engadget.
The point being that there is a reason the Mac costs more. Period. Compare the hinges on a mac lappie to a PC. But mostly its the software quality and compatibility. Apple doesn't have to test on x number of hardware and drivers generally do not suck. They have a known manufactorer, a known market, well thought out developer guidelines. Sure they are a year behind hardware wise... but it works. And it works great. Not 'ok', not 'just good enough'. Crashing is unacceptable. Steve is a perfectionist. And this is what you pay for. What you don't pay for, you don't get. No tablets. No support for 'x', because its never half implemented. Look at the early bluetooth stacks and wifi drivers on pc vs mac, its a given.