You can bet Sony's got tons of engineers working on the problem of how to keep their laptop batteries from
exploding. In a meeting with reporters on Wednesday, Sony Electronics president
Stan Glasgow mentioned that laptop manufacturers are likely to switch from lithium ion batteries to lithium polymer sometime in the near future. The advantage of lithium polymer apparently is that the lithium is contained in gel packs, which can be squeezed into random spaces (instead of being cramped into compact cells), and thus apparently doesn't have the propensity to, um, explode. That being said, it appears that Apple has already struck its foot in the lithium polymer camp, given that it's keeping MacBook and MacBook Pros juiced up with these newer batteries (pictured), which were not subject to
recalls. Of course, there's always
zinc and
fuel cell batteries, which still toil away in research labs across the globe -- it doesn't really make much difference to us which one wins out, so long as we can somehow realize that dream of untethered beach-blogging for 12 hours straight.
[Via
Slashdot]
posted December 9th 2006 7:29AM
that's a pretty stupid post.
One you want carry around flamable H2 for your lappy? Or do you want the super low power density of zinc? OR do you want something that is here and now. Don't think for one second that the active chemistry in Li polymer is different than Li ion. Those fires are self sustaining and they don't need an oxygen source.
These can catch fire perhaps even more easily. They are used in RC applications as many have noted, and if the soft shell gets dented or crimped they can overheat.
This is $ony again lying to consumer. I'm surprise they didn't say sometihng like "this batteries will last upto 10 days on a single charge, plus it plays our Blu-Ray format" please sony just give it up with your false statements and hype.
Shouldn't laptop batteries not explode by default?
I love this new feature. Finally some innovation out of Sony's fort.
You're either a plant or a moron
I didnt get the "Plant" part at first, I was thinking Leafy green with roots kinda plant instead of a paid poster.
In either case, it works.
Idiot XD
I have an iRiver mp3player from 3 years ago that uses a Li-polymer battery. It is a 20gb hdd player that is comperable to the 3rd gen iPod. That iPod got 8 hours of battery life if you were lucky, mine got 16 hours easy. From what I know people were modding the iRiver with new Li-polymer batteries that could power the players for up to 50 or 60 hours. I don't know why this technology hasn't been used very much up until now?
"I love this new feature. Finally some innovation out of Sony's fort."
I hate to break it to you, but Lithium Polymer batteries for mobile PCs are nothing new. Electrovaya http://www.electrovaya.com has been doing it for years. Their tablet PCs are top-notch (I'm using one right now) with a 75 Wh "SuperPolymer" battery shoved into a .75 inch thick unit (lasts about 9 hours). They've improved the density and will release a 90 Wh battery (same dimensions) in January. They also offer "power pads" which are a sort of universal batteries offering ungodly amounts of juice (up to 300 Wh).
That diagram had me confused for a bit. Didn't know what I was looking at. Then I turned it 90 degrees and BAM! It hit me. That can ONLY be a LiPoly battery pack being inserted into the bottom of a laptop.
Now back to watering my plants.
On a density basis I think the polymer battery can get maybe 20 percent greater charge then an ion battery but this also has to do with it's reduced housing. There is no way to moded a iriver could get 60 hours(unless you disable the lcd and reduce playback to like 10Kpbs and even then you would probably have to put in another battery) More importantly regarding fire hazards Sony have better REALLY done there research becasue if the battery is overcharged you are gonn see an explosion that will put a IONs explosion to shame.
I don't know which polymer Sony is going to use, but I've been using LiPoly batteries in my robots for years, and if anything they are far MORE unstable than anything I have seen from LiIon. I have watched a pack get taken out of a robot and placed on a charger and within 10 minutes burst into flames. Maybe Sony has figured something new out but...I'd be happier with LiIon than LiPoly.
>>Shouldn't laptop batteries not explode by default?
Unfortunately, Li-On batteries are explosive by nature because they run incredibly hot and their power/weight ratio, per density Li-On have a higher capacity then Li-Poly batteries (in fact the highest of any battery). However, Li-poly can conform better then Li-on and may make up for lost power density by filling a area more efficiently.
Strangely, Sony is the leader and the first to commercialize the Li-on back in the early 90s, while they currently are the leaders in Li-poly, its a dramatic move nonetheless.
@ Marcus Peng
I'm pretty sure if the LiPolymer batteries were WORSE, they probably wouldn't be putting them in. Most of you people that are saying sony is stupid and that Li-ion is much better, are the ones who, if sony decided to stick with Li-ion, would be saying sony is stupid for staying with the same type. People like you that are so against one company (Sony) that if they came up with a cure for cancer, you would still have some kind of snarky remark to make about them...
and @ ED
How the hell is sony lying? There were no quotes in that whole article, and they werent trying to advertise the new battery as being some kind of battery-demigod. Its just a fix, calm yourself.
I am not anti-Sony. My point is that the blog post is stupid because it implies that Sony didn't care about their batteries exploding. My point is that no device that stores energy is exempt from accidents like explosions.
Engineers work their behinds off to prevent this from happening. But of course there's manufacturing, shipping, and the end users that tests the final product and hopefully...
I am an avid RCer, and I own LiPo (polymer) batteries in my high powered RC cars. They BLOW UP. They are highly unstable. This is angering me that Sony has the nerve to put these in their laptops.
LiPo packs need to be charged and discharged with supervision. I have seen cars EXPLODE at my local track because of collisions. If the laptop is dropped, not only is the laptop dead, but it will burst into flame.
I think what Sony is referring in this article is next-gen Li-poly batteries that are safer and have a more organized crystal structure (for faster charging)as well as lower internal resistance.
Li-Poly batteries are currently everywhere, including the iPods, Nintendo DS, and even Sony's own PSP. But great advanced are being made, hence its not accurate to compare current gen Li-poly batteries to future Li-Poly that use polymer cathodes or organic compounds that should make it safer and more powerful.
Likelyhood is that Li-Poly batteries will be used in future Hybrid cars as well, and replace the current Ni-MH batteries that are being used.
You people need to realise that all batteries have their strengths and weaknesses, and that all batteries of a certain type are not the same. There isn't one battery that is a clear winner.
For applications that you need on battery to last a long time (say you car or a UPS) a lead-acid or gel cell is the way to go. Their power/size and power/weight is crap, but they last for 5+ years.
For batteries that you need a very high current draw in a short amount of time (r/c cars, battle bots) the nicad/nimi batteries or some types of lithium batteries are the way to go. You have to fully charge/discharge them to keep them healthy, they don't last very long, but they work and power/size and power/weight is pretty decent.
For things that need to be as small/light as possible you need lithium batteries. li-ion batteries usually have a higher power/weight ratio when they are new, but after a year they are down to 1/2 their original capacity. li-po batteries are a little worse power/weight wise, but they will last for years. (for example I had a li-ion battery in my laptop, and after 2 years it lasted about 20 minutes. Then I got a li-po battery and after 2 years it still lasts 2 hours)
Also, you can't say that li-ion or li-po batteries are more dangerous/more likely to explode than one another. I once had a hard landing with one of my rockets and I had a pair of .3a/hr li-po batteries in it that were literally rolled up in a ball when I got to it. Even after several minutes they did not show any signs of fire/explosion. I have have never crushed a li-ion battery so I can't say what it would have done. But as you say the li-po batteries can explode, and we have all seen li-ion batteries explode.
Pick your poison people...
http://www.technologyreview.com/read_article.aspx?id=16673&ch=energy
viral batteries are the way to go. viruses FTW!
As long as they have really good protection circuits, they should be all right. If they don't, though, they're in seriuos trouble. My GCp (Gamecube portable) had Li-poly batteries in it and after accidentally overcharging them my GCp was toast, literally (check the benheck.com forums for pictures if you're interested). Almost burnt my damn house down, too. Which is why I'm now a bit weary of li-poly batteries, but still, if they can prevent overcharging, they should be fine (because besides the explosions, li-poly batteries rock!)
I used to have a SE T68i, which used a Li-Poly battery. I dropped it a lot and accidentally sat on it once (I was about 10 or so at the time and somewhat clumsy) and not once did the battery explode in my face.
I can't see what Apple has to do with this story, Li-poly-batteries have been used in portable computers for years.
I don't know if someone already mentioned this, but I've been using Lipo in my rc cars for about a year, and they are known for causing fires and being much more dangerous than Li-Ion. In fact, I can't remember the source, but someone with an RC car with a lipo battery in it placed it in the back of their lexus truck, and the truck ended up toasted to a dark crisp.
My 1st gen iPod was lithium polymer. Not sure why apple decided to switch back to ion and back to polymer.