STI's Cell processor to be announced today
posted Feb 7th 2005 11:24AM
Sony, Toshiba, and IBM's (the STI group, as it were) jointly developed Cell processor will be announced today at the International Solid State Circuits Conference, amongst the hubbub and rumors currently encircling what the marketing machine is hyping as a revolution in computing just around the corner. What we know is the chip is expected to show up in the PlayStation 3 and Toshiba's new HDTVs—not very indicative of anything (and old hat, we know), but we'll bring you up to speed on the rest. So what do they have under wraps that they think AMD and Intel will be so scared about? Apparently the Cell processor can be expected to crank out a theoretical 256 gigaflops per second—a number that could be grossly overinflated—and each of the CPU's nine cores (which are supposedly running up to 5.6GHz now) will be an individually operable 128-bit processor. If all that doesn't make sense to you, don't fret; the point is, STI wants you to think this chip will run at something like 10 times faster than anything else out there—and we'll know soon enough whether they're fronting or not.
OK , show of hands: who else sees pushpins in a picture like that and wants to run them over with their big sticky ball?
The specs may be realistic, but you need to be aware that the 9 cores are very specialized processors. They are more comparable to x86's SSE and MMX extensions than to general purpose-CPU. The cell may have the potential to do to media applications (like video processing/decoding/encoding) what NVidia's GeForce GPUs did to 3D graphics rendering, but do not expect your word processor to run any faster.
Time will clearly tell whether the early hype is justified. But what's clear is that, for the first time in the history of processor design, a piece of technology originally conceived for "mere" games is seriously being considered for applications well beyond the game space.
This, in itself, is worth noting, and makes the Cell processor an issue to watch in the months to come.
AMD and Intel may not yet have reason to be overtly scared. But I suspect they're watching this story very closely, and will adapt their own plans accordingly.
Carmi Levy
http://writteninc.blogspot.com
"OK , show of hands: who else sees pushpins in a picture like that and wants to run them over with their big sticky ball?"
That was my first thought as well.
I feel it, I feel the cosmos.
There's so much speculation and hype, I'm not sure this is gonig to deliver everything it promises, but with playstation 3 riding on the chip, I think it's safe to say it the chip is going to set the pace.
http://futurefeeder.com
so does anyone know yet if the Cell has any G5 guts in it or not? there was that rumor (not entirely believable) floating around awhile back saying that the "Cell" and the multi-core G5 dealio in the Xbox 360 and the chip in the Revolution... were *all* more or less slightly different branches off the same PPC970 tree.
in that... all were 'basically' the same chip. doesn't sound too realistic... but doesn't sound entirely far-fetched either... considering IBM and it's involvement in all projects. and IBM really pimping the 970 these days.
010111 - They're all offshoots of the IBM Power4 Chip. There hasn't been any concrete details on the Revolution, but most people believe it'll use a 970FX derivative. Right now the GC uses the PPC750CXe (According to Wikipedia; the Apple G3 was the PPC750). It'd be logical that Nintendo stays with an IBM chip, this way they get to preserve backwards compatibility. Wouldn't that make the Revolution the first backwards compatible Nintendo console? :-x
I know MS has been sending out XBox2/Xenon/XBox360/XBoxNext dev kits that run on PowerMacs, and it's basically been confirmed it'll be running a 970 also.
As far as I know, the Cell processor is part of the PowerPC family, but it's not a 970. So it'll probably share alot of features but still be quite different.
I'd say it's believeable. So we'll end up with the XBox and Revolution having very very similar CPUs, but different GPUs (MS is going ATI, Nintendo is going nVidia). Then we'll have the PS3 with the Cell processor and a very similar GPU to the XBox2.
Unless the Cell Processor is something amazing, this round is going to be settled with software -- game titles and features. There won't be a clear ownership like there is this round. (GC's Graphics > XBox's > PS2's -- I know, it's debateable but most people would agree the PS2 is at the bottom of that comparison.)
Tim -
You're right, this is very much like how NVidia's GPUs increased graphics performance. But that's b/c, like those GPUs, these are separate discrete processors, not co-processors like those original x86 designs. However, unlike the GPUs available in commercial graphics cards, these SPE/APUs are designed to be more generic so they can handle tasks that are not necessarily graphics oriented.
I also agree that it's not going to speed up my word processor. At least not to the point where it knows what I'm going to write before I type it. But considering that word processors are now more multimedia oriented these days, I would expect that it could speed up things like resizing charts and diagrams or simply formatting a large document.
As Carmi points out, "Time will clearly tell whether the early hype is justified."
In a recent interview, Sony Computer Entertainment president Ken Kutaragi acknowledged complaints that the processor is nearly impossible to write programs for, in part because of the memory structure and restrictive Digital Rights Management enforcement systems.
Kutaragi was unapologetic about the issue: "This is the design that we came up with. There may be people that complain about its usability, but that's something which users and game software developers will have to adapt to."
"The processor is [architectured] on purpose," Kutaragi added. "It's according to specifications. This is something that we've created, and this is our specification. There was a clear purpose to it, and it wasn't a mistake."
Offering additional testimony praising the processor, Kutaragi said, "I believe we made the most beautiful thing in the world. Nobody would criticize a renowned architect's blueprint that the position of a gate is wrong. It's the same as that."
"The first real life application of the new cell processer is for an Internal Sony project. The new Cell chips will allow Sony's hype machine to produce almost ten times the reality distortion effect produced by the emotion engine that powers the PS2. With results like this, Sony determines it can persuade 93% of all television owners that their new home console is worth purchasing without having to actually produce any real-world benefits of the machine, or any playable games."
@ Ryan0rZ
It's Sony who'll be using an nVidia GPU, not Nintendo. In fact, Nintendo will be utilizing a graphics chip from ATI just like they do now.
@ Edward T
I remember those comments from Kutaragi, with one mayor difference. He was talking about a slightly misplaced actionbutton on the PSP handheld instead of the CELL. So, that's a bit...peculair.
That's funny Edward T! Woo!
Sony's attitude toward its customers has been really shitty recently. Why do they act all high-and-mighty? Didn't they see what happened when Noika ignored people's complaints for a year?
heh, reality distortion, i thought that was a steve jobs ability only...
"Kutaragi was unapologetic about the issue..."
Let's not spread another rumour :)
As Ronn pointed out I also remember those comments verbatim when he was talking about PSP Square button placed too close to the screen.
#12
> Sony's attitude toward its customers has been really shitty recently. Why do they act all high-and-mighty? Didn't they see what happened when Noika ignored people's complaints for a year?
What does Sony's attitude have to do with the performance or features of the Cell processor?
To summarise ronns post, Edward T is talking bullsh*t... Kuzaragi was indeed talking about the square button on the PSP.
Sorry. It was an attempt at humor. Seems like Sony is always saying stuff like this. Remember how the PS2 was supposed to push 66 million polygons but games have trouble getting more than 6.5 out of it?
Hype and Spin.
This to me sounds like, "I am going to bolt 10 Honda CRXs together and my new invention will be 10x as fast as a Honda CRX!"
After reading the Times' article on Cell, I felt it necessery to post wild speculation on the possible link between this chips future release, and Apple's reluctance to give any actual information on the future architecture of the G5 powerbook. I know this is far-fetched, but could there be any correleation between the capabilities of this chip and the future of IBMs lead consumer of the PowerPC to date, Apple?
unless Sony brings something truly innovative to the table, they wont be getting my money this generation. I prefer to spend my money on something that will (hopefully) bring back my love for games, because this generation really lost my interest. It appears the Big N will be getting my money this time around
lol Edward T's crx thing is so close to wut i think
but seeing as sony is 1/3 of this, i dont think they can screw it up alone