Creative's new Zen Vision:M (with video)
posted Dec 7th 2005 1:30AM
Creative is introducing their new Zen Vision:M, an answer to Apple's
5G iPod, and what an answer it is. We know it
gets old hearing every new player get compared to Apple's flagship offering, but can you seriously blame us here? The
specs are vaguely familiar, with a 2.5-inch screen at 320x240 resolution and a 30GB hard drive, though thankfully
Creative squeezed in 4 hours of video playback, doubling Apple's endurance on at least video. (The audio playback conks
out at 11 hours.) The size of the two players is virtually identical, with the Zen Vision:M only changing it up on
thickness — at about twice the iPod's 0.43-inches. They're also forging their own path on button placement, sporting a
layout similar to that of their Zen Micro
Photo, and including a vertical scroll pad. Creative did add their usual FM tuner and voice recording niceties, and
they have a decent list of video format support, including MPEG-4, WMV, Motion JPEG, DivX, and XviD, so this $330
player could turn out to be a worthy candidate for video capable commuting buddy — if Apple's lawyers don't have
something to say about it first. Check out some closeups of interface, erm, borrowing after the jump.
[Via
Apple Brothers]
I said I wouldn't buy another mp3 player for a while... Looks like I'm gonna have to break that promise
Wowza! I don't want to sound like a typical Apple guy that claims that every device that even remotely resembles the iPod is ripping off Apple... but this is a little close (at least the white one) Perhaps it's payback for stealing/using the Nano in their player? Also, considering my 30GB cost 340 (Canadian) the Apple brand appears to be cheaper (while lacking fm tuner, etc)!
Ha - nice photography to make them look sleeker than they really are. Does anyone get the heiroglyphic icons? But props on the XviD and DivX support.
Hmm, now where have I seen something that looks like that before. Come on Creative, be original...
right. and no one uses divx or xvid either. worthless.
Jesus, biggest friggin' iPod knock-off ever!
This is actually a pretty sleek player. Weighs the same as the iPod v5, but it's definitely thicker. The menu system is a bit nicer and the video stuff works way better...so yeah, it looks kinda like an iPod, but it has enough more than enough differences to make it noteworthy. Also, Xvid and WMV support mean that you don't have to pay for some crappy MPEG4 software to get your videos in the right format and size.
Creative is a clear winner with this device
everytime an ipod dies
an angel gets a pair of wings
(0o)/
WMV (320x240/700kbps and 320x240/436kbps MPEG4 and DivX 4/5, XviD (720x480/3Mbps and 640x480/2Mbps recommendation)
MPEG2 (640x480/2.5Mbps and 640x480/2Mbps
MPEG1 (640x480/1.15Mbps and 352x288/1.15Mbps
Motion-JPEG (640x480/2.5Mbps)
Still picture:JPG(8 Mega pixels)
I don't see how you think the menu system looks nicer...the controls are alot complicated...so not nicer there...and the actual menu itself is an exact rip off of the ipods menu...explain.
I'd get this over a video ipod anyday, however I still wouldn't buy either because I'm assuming the Vision:M is like the regular Vision in that it doesn't support soft subtitles.
Otherwise it's a great player, but soft subs are a requirement for me. Cowon A2 here I come.
well this player looks rather good, probably one of the better ones creative ever has [and the most copied from apple's design team]. creative should spend more time designing products which appeal design-wise.
Apple's Menu...for comparison.
http://www.connectedhomemedia.com/Visual/Articles/Index.cfm?ArticleID=44484
Too bad you dont need to pay anything to get xvid converted into mpeg that is ipod compatible. I like the reflection of the player below it.... looks like some other companies ad's. I dunno why everyone always praises FM and a mic as a better feature that makes that player a better buy. I listen to the radio going to work cause I dont have an ipod dock for the car and my cellphone does recordings also and I have used it maybe once in the last 2 or 3 years. Cheaper slimmer and much more integrated seems like a better buy to me.
Well, I can tell you that I used the mic on my Zen today in a meeting (I forgot my notebook and the quality was DAMN good), and I frequently use the FM tuner to catch ball games and shows while doing stuff in the yard, so I'd say they're worth it.
Granted, I also don't get the appeal of ipods (other than some sheep like reflex to be like the cool kids). I'm fairly interested in this device also since it means I can plug it into subscription music services and load up, plus toss on the occasional video (ok, not really a major issue). I am curious if there will be a way to output the video for sharecasting.
I don't understand why companies bother to put in FM radio and so rarely AM. I need AM for traffic reports, weather conditions, road conditions, avalanche warnings, etc.
#7 - "and the actual menu itself is an exact rip off of the ipods menu"
You must be some obsessed iPod fan because if you new anything about mp3 players then you would know that Apple took Creative's menu system and copied Creative's design. Chalk a lack of creativity up for Apple on that one. Get your facts straight.
At 19mm instead of the iPod's 11, It's almost twice as thick.... yuck
#12
Actually, Apple created it first (the design and menu). As the original inventor of the iPod I would know, since I created it.
Nice Effort though.
Actually, Creative managed to get a U.S. patent on the menu system that Apple uses (the name is Directory based browsing system or something like that). So if Apple does try to sue Creative for the resemblance, Creative can countersue on the interface aspect. Since Apple's biggest plus is its interface, they might be reluctant to sue Creative.
#14
Creative's Patent
"The patent, which the company calls the Zen Patent, covers Creative's interface for portable players, which allows users to select a song, album or track by navigating a succession of menus. The patent office awarded the patent on Aug. 9."
"the company first shipped music players with the navigation system in September 2000, and filed the patent application in January 2001. Apple announced the iPod in October 2001."
Nice effort.
The black one looks nice! If it has a better viewing angle than the Zen Vision with good pricing to the Ipod Video, I might considered this one.
According to the link sources, the playback for movies is twice that of Ipod Video. Great, just what I am looking for in a way, I need a recorder to record down lectures.
BRAVO CREATIVE! BRAVO CREATIVE!!! THIS IS PRETTY BADASS, WHEN IS IT COMING OUT???????? I WANT ONE NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
All creative basically did was add several basic functions that barely anyone use, make it fatter, uglier, and added their own buttons. Voila, a Creative Zen Vision:M
Yet another product to add to Creative's ridiculously large MP3 player lineup that will be yet another huge flop like all the others that came before it.
#14
Creative's Patent
"The patent, which the company calls the Zen Patent, covers Creative's interface for portable players, which allows users to select a song, album or track by navigating a succession of menus. The patent office awarded the patent on Aug. 9."
"the company first shipped music players with the navigation system in September 2000, and filed the patent application in January 2001. Apple announced the iPod in October 2001."
Nice effort.
While there's nothing really wrong with this thing, Creative is going to have to stop reacting and start innovating if they ever want more than 5% (or whatever they have) of this market. Regardless of who did what first, to the general public this looks like an iPod knockoff. And while it has a couple features that will appeal to a couple thousand geeks (divX, etc.), it has some big disadvantages for the millions of average non-geek consumers (thickness, limited capacity). This will do nothing to save Creative's floundering ass. Which is too bad, because I would really like to see someone put some competitive pressure on Apple. They are phoning it in, but when the best their competition can manage is "me too, but with an FM tuner", phoning it in is good enough.
Are these going to be out before christmas? I seriously am considering buying one. Xvid and Divx support is absolutely fantastic.
Twice as thick? Ew. That button interface looks like it would suck. I'd have to try it first, but it doesn't look nice. I've used their vertical scroll before and hated it.
If this thing is more durable and less scratch-prone than my ipod then im buying one. The video formats this thing supports is good too. I suspect theyre being released in Japan first so im guessing theyll be out here in a couple of months.
#25
Good point. "Regardless of who did what first, to the general public this looks like an iPod knockoff."
Sucks that everyone compares everything to the iPod, which IMO is a very poor mp3 player compared to some others (cowon, samsung).
Looks like Creative will keep with their id3 tag menu system. Why can't these major mp3 makers realize that there are people who hate that system and prefer a file folder system? This will be the only reason I won't buy one.
Amazing, looks JUST like another certain product I COULD SWEAR I've seen before somewhere ;-)
Are you kidding me. I just shelled out $400 for a Zen Vision. It looks like the only difference with this one though is that they made the screen smaller so they could make the overall dimensions smaller. Why so thick, though?
The good news is that I still love the beautiful screen on my ZV. I'm undecided though.
Ok...about this apple-stole-from-creative tit-for-tat-bs:
The Creative patent is pure bunk...and they know it. I'd wager they made this UI to try to prod Apple since Apple hasn't responded to their patent in the first place.
The fact of the matter is, the iPod UI emulates the OSX Finder column view, which was adapted from the NeXT UI and "aquafied"
Now while creative did have a menu system on their mp3 players (I know, i bought a couple of them before the iPod was intro'd) none of them were like the NeXT/Openstep UI.
I personally think its rather lame of a company named "Creative" to try to pull this crap, and I hope that Apple brings all of its IP and prior art to the table and sends Creative back home weeping.
Perhaps then, like a previous poster said, they will innovate again like they did with the Jukebox instead of this sadness.
And it is *sad*, because I have to say that the codec support should sell it to the geek crowd alone.
Taking the iPod's distinctive UI and sticking it in their player pretty much tells the tale:
"We can't make a more appealing player than Apple's without dipping ito the MacOS X UI"
i'm with #26 (scott). to ad to that, these are advertised (and accepted as) portable audio players, WITH video--their main function is music playback. on that note, creative's 11 hours is considerably less than apple's 14 hours. as a closing note, "almost twice the thickness" is the kiss of death--too many people (including myself) like to carry things in their pockets.
Who cares about originality and patents. NOTHING IN THIS WORLD IS ORIGINAL. The only thing that concerns me is that this thing supports XVID and DIVX and has twice the video time (@ 4 hours) that my current ipod does. I just might be buying this bad-boy when it comes out.
Funny, no body seems to see what Apple is offering on it's video ipod, which is a complete solution for the general public. Do you expect your 50 years old mom, or your computer dumb girlfriend to be able to convert all the videos into divx or what so ever? For the general public, with one click, they can have good quality and legal videos on their ipod to go. No all people are as geek as us will spend hours converting all the video and transfer to the players. I think, unless any other mp3/pmp companies come out with a better solution than Apple's, it will always be the geeks' toy only.
Yay for Creative.... now when does it come out? I see it as a way to visually see my songs somehow...
This is one fine mp3 player that's heftily borrowed from Apple and is better off for it (regardless of your feelings about Apple or Creative or whether or not it's innovative, you know as well as I do why Creative's UI looks the way it does - and I don't blame them for it), but it won't sell to the general public. It'll sell great to geeks (I mean, who doesn't have just about everything of theirs encoded in XVid/Divx?), but last I checked, we don't make up a majority (a shame, really). Why? People seem to forget the razor/blade relationship between the iPod and the iTMS (though I can never really tell which is which) - what with the number of shows added to the "TV Shows" section today, I can more or less guarantee iPod market domination once again this coming year. Yes, Creative can offer XVid support for all the illegal movies you bittorrent, but Apple can offer a way to download and watch the episode of "Law and Order" you just missed (granted at a low quality than it could or should be, but the rise of mp3/lossy audio codecs in general is pretty indicative that people are far more utilitarian and look for convenience, so long as it looks/sounds "good enough").
But for those that opt to purchase this Zen, I hope that DVD Jon gets cracking on the DRM - if this thing could play back video downloaded from the iTMS, it'd be a nice bonus.
I don't care how it looks, compared to the iPod. But if it won't work with my Mac, it's pointless.
even thought I dont own a video ipod(i have a 30g photo.......) i still think buying the video from the itunes store make it so unique in comparing to other players on the market. i just check their current selling line-up, now NBC is joining it... crazy... I would like to see FOX and Comedy Central on the iTMS too...
looks good, but the menu look very similiar to hte iPod's
Great effort by Creative.
So what that it looks like an iPod, don't all TV's, celphones, cars etc. look alike! It's just another step in the universification of these mobile devices, finally! Let's just call it the cPod for all I care :)
Still from a device twice as thick you'd expect a better video performance as well as audio, what's up with that?
Keep it up Creative, Apple etc. this way we get better gadgets!
I don't care that its a rip, or knock off of the iPod. General consumers want something thats convenient and works best, unless you're a fashion conscious junkie.
The iPod is a great machine, no doubt! But even though this wont sell as well as the iPod vid, i'll be sure to get one in the near future for the following reasons:
1) It looks great, unoriginal, but about the same dimensions as the iPod Vid except for thickness, hell, it even weighs the same.
2) It supports more formats, pretty much every common video format that you can download off the web, and just drag and drop onto the creative, no need for this bloody syncing mish-mash
3) Double the battery life <--- for me this is the deciding factor,...As much as I love Apple (I own and love my powerbook and soon to get a next gen mini mac), this is their biggest boo boo. Most modern movies, or drama's are 2+ hours long, creative crosses this thresh hold. I wouldn't wanna be watching an iPod during a flight/trip and have the battery die half way through a movie, i'd be majorly pissed.
My only concern up till its release is the actual quality of the screen, then I can determine wether it really is a worth the purchase or not!
What about TV Out?
There really is nothing original AT ALL about this design. Check out the small pics of some of their accessories, such as...
A very white looking "dock"
http://images.jp.creative.com/images/inline/japan/products/VM_ds/VM-DS-pdt.jpg
and
a remote that is nearly the exact same layout and design of the (old) iPod remote
http://images.jp.creative.com/images/inline/japan/products/Zen_Neeon/zenNeeon_wiredrc.jpg
Creative has to be crazy to think the Apple legal team isn't going to come after them for at least something.
Are you mad? H.264 blows DivX and Xvid away. It's the codec used on HD DVDs and Blu-ray disks as well as the BBC's HD library. It scales down too which is why it's used on mobile phone networks and in the iPod. It's the standard codec for Digital TV. That's why it's used.
There's endless FREE utilities on the net to convert almost any video format to iPod sized H.264 MPEG4 video.
But as ever in these discussions, people forget about the other half of the iPod's success - iTunes. Creative's, Sony's and anyone else's players would stand a better chance if it wasn't such a pain in the arse getting songs on to them and managing your library.
Be aware, divx support doesn't mean all your divx movies will be supported... I just returned my regular zen vision; though it supports divx 4 and 5, it doesn't support divx 3, and it doesn't support ac3 audio. That counts for about 60% of my collection i found. Not only that, but it really seems like creative doesn't care about these issues. I may sound like I'm predisposed not to like creative, but I wouldn't have bought a zen if I were, I really was turned away from them because of their product (it also froze all the time, and had other issues, and is seems they don't plan on ever fixing the issues...)
-Taylor
I just think it is about time that these big companies like creative starts thinking out the box and could come out with a radical new design of mp3 player, everything is starting to look almost the same these days, maybe go for a slide up feature like some phones have this way you can get more controls on there that makes some thing easy to adjust.
Gross... its so fugly, it looks like something from Fisher Price or to monitor your baby.
QUOTE: "Actually, Apple created it first (the design and menu). As the original inventor of the iPod I would know, since I created it."
don't forget Creative still owns the "Zen patent" on the UI, which Apple also tried to patent but got rejected.
Daaammnn....that thing is awesome. Heh, and to think I was actually thinking of buying a iPod video. Funny stuff eh?
For all you people bashing this new creative, will you listen to yourselves.... "no one uses xvid and dvix anyway.." WTF are you smoking! EVERYONE uses divx you moron! Just because u don't doesn't mean everyone else doesn't...
And, for everyone bashing the creative's look-alike interface, you (and apple) have NO RIGHT AT ALL to complain...apple STOLE creative's interface in the first place...
And, if they really wanted to copy the ipod, they'd make it w/ a retarded 1.5 hours batt. life for video, and make it really thin, but w/ no features...
Nobody but geeks cares about dixv or vidx or whatever they're called. In fact most people don't really care about video and therefore will like the ipod's better battery life for audio. If they do they're not thieves so they actually pay for it off the ITMS not use limewire or whatever other geek program is top of the list this month rendering any argument about compatible formats moot.
Most people aren't geeks
Most people care about sleekness and, quality of UI and respectable brand name- Winner: Apple
Result: Creative sells a few of these players to the geek crowd becuase of some obscure format support. However because it can't compete with the ipod's dimensions, UI or itunes integration it will fail just like every other creative product.
my goodness, creative is definitly not creative with their designs.
For all you people bashing this new creative, will you listen to yourselves.... "no one uses xvid and dvix anyway.." WTF are you smoking! EVERYONE uses divx you moron! Just because u don't doesn't mean everyone else doesn't...
And, for everyone bashing the creative's look-alike interface, you (and apple) have NO RIGHT AT ALL to complain...apple STOLE creative's interface in the first place...
And, if they really wanted to copy the ipod, they'd make it w/ a retarded 1.5 hours batt. life for video, and make it really thin, but w/ no features...
I was jealous of the iPod video until I saw this post. I always thought the nano would be perfect if it had FM and a voice recorder.
I just hope the GUI isnt all stupid!
And what about H.264 support? Clearly the best codec remains to the best player yet. Once you see how fantasticly your DVDs are seen using it you won't want to go back.
Of course, there is always people who will buy this not compatible PC-only thing to put in legally doubtful downloaded stuff.
Is it just me, or are a lot of the people saying "Yes! It'll play my xvid/divx movies!" the same sort of people who were not long ago saying "Watching movies on a 2.5inch iPod screen - what kinda moron would do THAT?!"?
As far as the Creative/Apple interface argument is concerned, the fact that ANY country would allow ANYONE to patent what is a very basic cascading menu system is beyond belief.... in fact, I wrote a similar system for document handling for a university project back in 1991 - maybe I should sue Creative? :o)
"4 hours of video playback, doubling Apples endurance on at least video."
Not quite double (although close enough). Apple's estimate is based on H.264 decoding, I bet standard mp4 lasts a bit longer.
"EVERYONE uses divx you moron!"
Not me. I abandoned it for H.264 a year ago. The improvement in quality is frankly astounding. Also it's nice to have something standards-based, instead of the disgusting mish-mash of formats that is the all-pervasive .avl.
"The Creative patent is pure bunk...and they know it."
I actually agree. If Creative thought there was any strength in it, they'd have sued by now; fact is, it's basically a patent for nothing (like so many patents filed these days, including many filed by Apple). Apple probably have a good case for a "look and feel" lawsuit though, especially looking at the photo browsing.
What makes me chuckle are the people who have immediately leapt on this, saying how wonderful it is - just because it's not an iPod. It's blatantly an iPod knockoff, with bugger all original thinking gone into it. It really doesn't deserve that kind of adulation! Hell, I'd love for someone to give Apple some decent competition - I'm a "Mac zealot", as you put it, but I feel very uncomfortable with any company having an effective monopoly; even Apple.
"Nobody but geeks cares about dixv or vidx or whatever they're called"
Buahhahhhaaaa!!! You have no clue what you are talking about ;))) Talk to your grandson, he'll explain you how the things are these days...
DivX/Xvid support in this player is a distinctive advantage and anyone who needs video on-the-go will appreciate that. iPod "video" has thouroughly dissapointed me, hope this one won't.
just make it easy to put DVD movies on it, and I'm there, I am a basic user, but it's easy enough to convert all my apple format music to MP3 to use this thing....
xvid/divx video geeks, thats mpeg4 which guess what? is supported on the iPod with video.
the videora ipod video converter makes everything so damn easy
I've yet to see creative roll out a software package that anyone like my mom or grandma would be able to use, iTunes excels at being easy.
For a split second I thought that was an iPod Nano up there. Sorry Creative, but I'm sticking with Apple.
Video, Schmideo. If you want this, go ahead and buy it, I'm not the one to stop you, you're gonna look sooo deliciously counter culture...
But one thing is for sure: this will not dramattically change the market shares... And as far as simplicity goes (I'm talking about the whole experience here, not just the player), I'll stick with iTunes+iPod for now.
hmmm...
wonder if this baby will support dvrms formats?
I have Media Center and it would be great to dump all the shows I've recorded for the morning commutes!
kudos to creative for allowing this to act as a hard drive (unlike Crapple)
byah!
I am all for competition but I despise out and out copying! Be original Creative...if you want to beat big bad apple you need something original and groundbreaking not a replica of the leading model.
Seriously, the average consumer buys a product based on emotion not specs... looking at these two players the consumer is gonna pick apple 85% of the time beacause Creative has not differentiated their product...this will just be seen as an "apple knockoff" by the average joe.
as far as I'm concerned, Apple's Marketing team has done a good job of brainwashing alot of people into thinking they own the color white.
(I'm an Apple fan, but this is ridiculous)
BWHAHAHAHAHAH THis is a JOKE i mean come on Creative GIVE UP , I dont see huge press for a "Creative One More THing" event launching the Zen Vision:M ... and where is Creative Video store to fuel the content for this device.. i mean come on lets just wake up for a moment,How many products have creative released that were suposed to be iPod Killers...How many have sony released...how many have all the other companys released... Now how many have SUCSEEDED...Simple NONE, and thats the way its going to be for quite some time..
Those who dont INOVATE are doomed to DIE
Copying a good idea that is allready sucsessfull on an international scale is not the way a company should go... Creative spend Bugger all on R&D they just use other peoples..
And this is from a company name CREATIVE????
Where is the creativity to come up with your own look? It's like When Windows 95 came out and copied the Mac's look and feel but claiming to be different by placing the Trashcan on the left and taskbar on the bottom.
The reason i like this device is because i can copy recorded digital tv from my computer directly onto it in true 720 x 576p. for the user who claimed H264 was the codec of digital television i would like to know where you live because as far as i know there are two major digital terrestrial systems ATSC and DVB-T both of which use MPEG-2 compression. no doubt H264 is a versatile codec but if you search any torrent for the "Lizzie Maguire Movie" my guess is youre not going to find too many copies in H264
To all the people saying that Creative invented the UI first, I think you should actually read the patent... What they did was patent a navigation 'concept' (for want of a better word). It is purely notional and bears no relation to the look and feel. It's obvious that the colours and layout of Creative's new UI are almost identical to the iPod and Creative certainly don't have a patent on that.
Whatever you think of Apple, and however you feel about the additional features in the Zen, Creative have released a player that is aesthetically similar to the iPod. I can understand why people think less of them for it...
Oh come on! All you Apple fanboys just shut up....I own a Ipod Photo myself and im no fanboy...sorry but apple does not pay anyone to be loyal nor do they give even give a crap about any owners...so all you loyal fanboys are just sad.
With that, everything is going to look like an ipod. In my opinion Apple set a standard with the Ipods, thats just my opinion. So now all the others use that standard to improve players in both interface, looks, controls etc...etc...
Nobody is going to risk and entirely different design. Do you want the screen to be under the controls? YOu want it to be held vertcaly with the controls on the side? You want a triangular screen? Theres only so much you can do with an mp3 design without making the consumer scared of it.
So if you are still crying about this looking liek an ipod, go talk to an apple representative see if they will give a crap about your loyalty....
DIVX & XVID ARE NOT OBSCURE FORMATS!!!
Almost EVERY SINGLE movie on P2P (Limewire, Kazaa - you know, the stuff most of the mp3 buying public uses) are encoded in DIVX/XVID format. The iPod CANNOT play these formats, it doesn't have the necessary codec processing ability. Besides, the people who buy mp3 players for the most part are not 50 YEAR OLD MOMS AND DUMB GIRLFRIENDS, they're people who are into technology and/or music. Also, 50 year old moms and dumb girlfriends won't be able to tell the difference between the two products...
Unlike Apple, Creative - yet again - offers consumers freedom, instead of locking them into a music subscription service.
With that said, I think this is a very good product, and had it been earlier, it'd be a sure success.
Xvid & Divx5 to iPod is EASY AND FREE ( assuming that the mpeg4 is iPod compatible no-qpel no-gmc ). Those that claim otherwise just are not trying hard enough. It's as simple as remuxing ( and possible converting the audio ). Video must be less than 230000 pixels ( WxH ).
ffmpeg -i file.avi -vcodec copy -vtag mp4v -acodec aac -ab 96 -f mov output.mov
Dispite it's limitations the iPod "just works". I don't mind fewer options because they work without thought or aggravation. I have only payed for a couple of tracts through iTunes, the rest are personal CD's and a few random tracks off the internet. I have never had any trouble getting iTunes and iPod to play any of it.
Hmm... It's funny how Apple fans always find a way to claim something ripped off the iPos..err... iPod. So what if the navigation system is similar. They use it because it is effective, and it works for most people. essentially all Laptops use touchpads now...are they ripping off the company that made it? Not really, they are using it because it works, and effectively.
#78 - Xvid and DivX aren't obscure, but I do have to disagree with you on one point. I see more girls (a.k.a. Dumb Girlfriends) with iPods than guys on campus. And most of the guys that use it are probably dumber than the girls.
Personally, I think this whole 'Video X' vs. 'X player featuring video' is stupid. The video playback musty be important or you'd have just bought a player that does only audio, therefore the 4 hour video playback is impressive and important. 11 vs. 14 hours of Audio playback is a small thing. Most people don't listen to there player 11 hours a day, so charge it overnight. my Olympus m:robe 100 get's about 6-8 hours of playtime.. I just charge it overnight, no big deal.
If you listen to it at work, take it off at break and charge it and talk to your co-workers for a change (social interaction is essential for humans). Oh, and if you are worried about the 3 hours of audio time, then that extra 2 hours of video time (THAT'S DOUBLE!) should have you thanking the deity of your preference.
On a different note, sure you can convert the DivX/Xvid to iPod compatible formats, but why should you have to waste the extra time?
Why is it that everybody thinks that Apple can do know wrong & they get knocked off by everyone else.
Apple knocked off the Fontopia earphone design from Sony, they just make them in white rather than Black.
Looks sweet... but without a store that sells inexpensive, high-quality TV shows and movies, it'll go nowhere. Most users don't want to bother with converting videos and all that nonsense.
@#76: oh no! Creative used THE SAME COLOURS those bastards! I didn't realize that...
a) Apple had a patent for black text on a white background.
b) the iPod has a lime green interface.
I'm with #78 and the others. Use bittorrent, and the VAST majority of stuff is in DivX/XviD, which is fine by me because my modded Xbox is happy with it, and my PDA plays it too, if I want something on the go.
I want a transcoding free world, and if I ever got a PMP, it would have to do the same (of course, I wish this zen had a bigger screen). ;)
A couple of things,
Regardless whether you like the way it looks or not, creative does not have what apple has, and that is "itunes".
Yes, you can download all your movies,shows, from p2p/bitorrent networks or copy and rip your own.
But the majority of people in the USA and probably the world are not going to be savvy enough to rip/burn their own, have enough patience to want to do this, or spend time searching p2p/bittorrents sites for technically "illegal" downloads.
I work in the IT field, and when you see people telling you that the monitor is busted when actually the monitor is not plugged in. It's kinda hard to believe that they'll be ripping and encoding at home.
And this is where Apple shines. You open up itunes, type in a show you want and bam! it's all listed. For 1.99 you click and the show is delivered to your computer.
Don't discount easy and convient.
people are paying 30 bucks for a UMD movie on the psp all because it's easy.
Are you all high? It weighs 20% more and is twice as thick. (I know that metric conversions are hard, but do try and keep up. 166 grams != 4.8 ounces, boys.) That alone reduces its "keep it with you everywhere" quotient significantly.
And let's not get started on the interface - that scroll bar sucks compared to the wheel.
"Nobody is going to risk and entirely different design."
So, you do agree that Creative's UI is suspiciously similar to the iPod look/feel? That being said, I completely disagree with the notion that MP3 player UI design has reached the pinnacle of what can be achieved, so design teams around the world should just sit back and put their collective feet up while their factories stamp out a never-ending line of iPod clones (and yes, a clone that happens to support your favourite format is still a clone).
I'm not sure why people are trying to turn this into a "My MP3 player is better than yours" argument when really, the only thing the 'fanboys' have actually said is that the UI looks a bit familiar...
First thing first it looks like a pill to me, But I am a pharmacist so have these things on the brain.
Regardless of UI and who made it first and who is innovate and whose not Creative have made a pretty solid player.
On its own merits it plays loads of formats big plus for us geeks who can argue about compression methods for forever and a day, looks good.
At twice the thickness of the iPod with video it is by no means bulky.
And the interface well it swings and roundabouts aint it? iPod scrollwheel may be ace for your granny but seriously these interface arguements really should be ignored given the core demographic 18-35 year old tech-savvy folk will be able to figure out pretty quick.
However there is potential for this device to whoop the iPods ass, it has Napster To Go support(I presume...every other zen device does so this seems reasonable) if Napster jumps on the video bandwagon, it has a subscription service which works and with some tweaking I am sure loads of networks will sign on shows because you never own the content as you do with ITMS you just rent it.
The press release that this post links to says audio playback should be at 14 hours if I'm reading it correctly, rather than the 11 that the Apple Brothers site states.
I've been wanting to upgrade from my Creative 40 GB Zen Xtra, so I had really high hopes for this player. The lower battery life for audio and no 60 GB HD is really a disappointment. Looks like I may finally be making the switch to the Ipod after 2 Creative players.
Dudes does this even have TV-out?
I don't see it in the specs:
http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=ja_en&url=http%3A%2F%2Fjp.creative.com%2Fcorporate%2Fpressroom%2Freleases%2Fwelcome.asp%3Fpid%3D12272
That would be the deal breaker for me, personally. Also, I'm not seeing any legal content deals announced with this device, which is essential if you're gonna compete with the iPod.
is it me or is Creatives offering of mp3 players really confusing? What to do with the Creative Zen sleek thats only been out for what 5 months? Or the Creative Zen? The Zen Neeon and Zen Micro have exact same capacity, same features its useless to have them both out at the same time...As someone said in a different post at least Apple has small, medium, and large offerings that arent confusing and dont compete against each other. Creative needs to get their act straight...
If creative really thought this through, and Microsoft and Napster, they would have offered a easy, legal way to get video content. That just doesnt exist for playsforsure devices and i suspect that people who compare the two will come to the conclusion that this is an ill conceived attempt to steal the ipod 5G's thunder that wasnt thought out
i guess imitation really is the sincerest form of flattery but thats not gonna get this Zen vision:m to sell
Hello,
Apple is an evil copy cat, too. Look at this traffic sign, http://www.vkwodw.de/Verkehr/Vk_zeichen/z_361.htm.
Here you see, where Apple took the inspiration for the design of the iPod.
Phew, is that what they call CREATIVE?
It amazes me that people think this looks "sleek" It's really sad is what it is.
On the plus side, if the translation is correct, it looks like album art is supported finally.
Hierarchial menus patented or not, that green battery icon on top of the shaded 3D title bar is what made me go "wtf?"
But I say, if it ain't broke, don't fix it. The iPod interface is fine, regardless of who made it first. And while it may not be the pinnacle, it's a good interface and there's not a big reason why we should have some new design thrown into the mix.
Creative knows Apple's got a big hold on the market. They need a "transitional" device for people to switch to Creative, so why not make a device that will make hardcore iPod users say "hey, it works like an iPod... lemme give this a shot."
I likes! Too bad I've already spent so much on my iPod. I may buy one just out of respect to Creative for this nice player, if and when it ever comes out which by then Apple will have the real Video iPod. Especially since iTunes Video store is so successful. I used to own Zen Micro and was a complete iPod hater, until I tried it out and saw how many accessories are available for the iPods.
The problem with Creative is that they announce their products way too early and leave us waiting. By the time it actually makes it to market there are other players to choose from. I mean, take a look at the Zen Vision, it's still not available at stores! How months ago did they originally announce it? Now, take a look at Apple, they announce their new players and within a week you can buy it at the store. Within a month or so you can buy a ton of accessories for it.
Don't get me wrong. This is a beautiful player, but again, when is it going to be available for purchase? If it's out within a month then I'll buy one.
For those Apple Fanboys out there, if I'm not mistaken, Creative did have a patent for the MP3 interface before Apple did. So Apple is the one that is actually ripping Creative off with their interface.
http://www.engadget.com/entry/1234000467056617/
I have the Zen Vision and am unimpressed with Creative products. The lack of support for AAC is a real pain as there is a lot of mpeg4 video content out there with aac audio. Also it does not play all divx or xvid files I download (maybe a B frames problem?) so I end up doing a lot of transcoding. Divx 6 doesn't work well as audio and video is often out of sync when played externally (internal screen is ok), also with divx 6 i have to manually rename the files to .avi extension. No stand is a pain too.
Overall Creative devices seem too closed and expensive for the quality.
Squint hard enough and you actually see a blurry nano.
I'm waiting for Cowon's answer that ups the ante with Ogg Vorbis and USB 2.0 On The Go.
It's pretty hard for a company that created the hard drive based mp3 player concept to "rip off" anybody. And in general creative always does it better. Better support, better audio quality, better battery life, better price. I've bought several creative players and have never been disapointed. Although my last player was a Rio Karma I'll probably buy this device.
Creative might be copying (stealing) ideas from Apple, but doesn't Creative own a bunch of patents for the interface, which last I heard Apple is infringing upon?
http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/08/30/1827206&tid=155&tid=227&tid=141&tid=126&tid=3
Wow! This is definately an iPod knock-off!!! I mean, it's a white rectangle for god sake!!! And the battery meter is the same color!!! Sheesh!
Seriously, I don't understand why people get so worked up over the appearance of every new mp3 player in comparison to an iPod. As long as it works well, that's all that should really matter.
Creative makes the ugliest mp3 players on the planet. If you're going to copy the iPod, at least do it properly.
Look okay.. apple didnt knock anything off of anyone.. they made a player that works, who cares how, it just works all seamlessly, i feel the iPod is an extension of my computer and that itunes is an extension of my iPod.. creative are trying to copy apple, and YES copy, or why else would they randomly create this thing about 2 months after apple released their own video playing iPod.. hmm 2.5inch screen, 30 gig... all sounds too familiar to be very creative at all.. yeh DIVX and all that crap.. whatever.. i dont see anyone proud to get a zen out and watch a video on it.. an iPod on the other hand.. you get that thing out with pride cos it has an original iconic style that noone can recreate no matter how hard they try and fail.. nice try creative.. well actually it wasnt cos ya didnt even change the damn colour scheme for the interface on the white one..