Zune wireless: worthless (for now)
By Ryan Block 
posted October 2nd 2006 8:55AM
posted October 2nd 2006 8:55AM
So throughout this whole Zune launch thing the whole lot of us have been playing cat and mouse with Microsoft on the finer points. Will it or won't it be built on PlaysForSure or some variant? How will it recognize copyrighted vs. creative commons content without opening up piracy loopholes? And perhaps most importantly: how will the wireless work? Well, it turns out that a Zune employee by the name of David Caulton thought it'd be worth putting together a cogent explanation of what the Zune wireless connection can and can't do.You can:
- Can search for and find other Zunes nearby.
- Can send songs / albums for the 3 x 3 trial. Songs past the three days / listens are deleted at next sync, but catalogued on your PC for record-keeping should you want to purchase them later. No word on whether Microsoft is going to keep track of which files are traded.
- You can send and receive image files for "unlimited viewing." (Oh, so copyrighted images aren't worth DRMing?)
- Connect to the internet.
- Download songs directly from the Zune store via WiFi.
- Sync to your computer via WiFi.
How could you say this?
Just because its first gen doesnt mean it cant have all the features. The thing is twice as big as a 30gig iPod. The only halfway decent thing is the UI, which Apple is sure to fix in the near future.
And dependable? How would you consider a company who had to extend warenties on Xbox360's because they were breaking "dependable"? How about the 1,000's of virus that Vista will get on Launch?
And may not have any intentions to release all these features you are talking about. Stop living on false hope, and buy a proven Mp3 player instead, regardless of whether its an iPod.
i wouldnt say that exchanging songs is worthless. If you remember anything about the ipod craze and swapping headphones deal or the elaborate craptacular devices people use to transferd still drmed ipod content across.
The question is it a toggle or is it always on...
Would be kind of odd to have it costantly searching for other zunes let alone a waste of batery life.
I really don't care about wifi. When I want to share my music, I email the urls or write down the name via SMS on my mobile.
"I've been watching all the media coverage on the Zune ever since it was first brought to light. This is one exciting product! Microsoft is leading the way here by developing something cool, hip and original. I can't wait until this comes out. I know myself and all my friends will be buying one. There's a lot of buzz on this one."
Look at that statement. Speaking of underground/gorilla marketing . . . I mean, come on Microsoft, with your huge cash reserves this is the best underground marketing team you could find to hype your product? "Hip and Cool" . . . "lots of buzz". Give me a break. Someone out there thinks Engadget readers are super dense.
"I highly recommend buying the Zune over an iPod. It's a very cool product."
Thanks, you freakin' Microsoft rep.
What's it feel like to be a plant?
Do you miss your soul?
"...I'll be purchasing Zunes for the whole family."
I'm sure your employee discount will facilitate that.
Jesus Christ, Joe, why didn't you just put your your "Microsoft PR Department" e-mail signature at the end of you message? Comment and forum thread plants are even lower in status than telemarketers, IMO.
I have a question, I think my son stole someone's zune and it has over 300 songs on it. I want to return it to the owner and when I called microsft they forwarded me to the zune dept customer service and said they couldn't help me because it wasn't registered. I have a serial number, mac something number SSID name. Am I at a lost cause trying to find this owner?? I have wireless internet can I get anything from that. Thank you for your help.
Search for other Zunes nearby? Send songs to other Zunes?! Talk about worthless features. This is nothing but Microsoft's attempt to compete with the iPod by stuffing in features that nobody wants and almost nobody will use (kinda like, cough, Word, cough).
oh so its ok for apple to bring out, an ipod, that dosent have these features and is labled "amazing!" but soon as microsoft bring out something its tagged as shit!...
at the end of the day its better than an ipod, looks better if u ask me, and as wireless. ye you cant connect to the internet, but can you with an ipod? no!, yeh apple will probly now take this put it into their ipod, and add some better feautures to it aswell but for now, this is better than an ipod, an looks just as gd if not better. so stop bitching and just say now they brought a new idea to the table, which can be worked upon and made better..
an im not dissin ipod, as i have had 5, altho there batteries are abit shit but i'll be expecting this with the zune aswell.
anyway like i said at the moment this is better so give them some credit.
So will there be a firmware update later that allows the Zune to do what it can't do now?
I would say yes. This is just another post written by someone who doesn't know all of Microsoft's plans... just because a feature wont be available from day one, doesn't mean that it wont come. It's probably being held back for technical or legal reasons.
And what's with the heading for this article? It's not half obvious what the motive is going to be.
Thank you Engadget, this thread alone is going to get me through this work day. The entertainment that is going to ensue will be priceless if that Zune vs iPod thread is any indication.
Come on MS employees, get to typing, we all know you guys are here trolling... I mean, posting independant thoughts and not being paid by MS to post on blogs...
Bulky, bulky, BULKY......... If it was just a lot thinner, it WOULD be amazing.
Aaaaaaaaaaaaarg, you want to know the truth? The ONLY reason I want the Zune, is the way it displays album art. I really hate the small album art function the current iPods have.
Don't care for DRM, I'd rather buy the cd, rip it and do what I want with it...
(DRM will ONLY be a problem for "most people" when MS changes something that limits the way you can use "your music" AFTER you have bought it...
And thus begins the downward spiral of the Zune.
You can't have a downward spiral from the bottom.
I agree the wireless sharing thing is going to be pretty pointless to begin with and even when/if they get a critical mass of zunes out there unless your in a city or other densely populated area it's not going to be that useful.
But equally this is the same team that put together the Xbox project, They put a network card in every Xbox and it was pretty much useless for the first year, but then Xbox Live came round and totally changed the whole market and then if you look at where Xbox Live started and where it is today... MS gave the people what they wanted.
I wouldn't be suprised if features like WiFi on Zune access to the Marketplace, Zune Marketplace on 360, WiFi Syncing and such come along very soon. But atleast it has the possibility to do these things in the future.
Are you Ashley Allen the fantastic playmate? Always wanted an autographed photo! Wow!;-)
@Ashley
"I wouldn't be suprised if features like WiFi on Zune access [...] come along very soon. But atleast it has the possibility to do these things in the future."
I base decisions for consumer electronics purchases on what it can do NOW; not what it might do in the future. How else can you legitimately compare product value? Zune 1.0 is a (admittedly noisy) non-starter until it actually DELIVERs on some of its much ballyhooed potential.
So out of the gate, the WiFi is poopier than the GREMLIN?
AWE. Poopoo.
Just wait until someone cracks it open and figures out how to put linux on it! Then we'll probably see Wifi internet quicker than Microsoft can put it in.
Personally, I think the Zune is nice, a bit bulky though, but overall, there are still devices that beat the Zune in terms of price, functionality, and features, but none have Wifi either.
"You can send and receive image files for "unlimited viewing." (Oh, so copyrighted images aren't worth DRMing?)"
Exactly the problem with DRM. You can see pictures of the Mona Lisa on a daily basis in your local library and never have to pay a surcharge to view it. If you want to see the real thing, you can go to the museum and see it in person.
The same works for Music (though on a shorter timeline). If you want to see the band in person, you can go to the concert. You should be able to listen to the song privately as many times as you like. DRM makes this harder than it needs to be.
I live on my own and don't often come into contact with others so the sharing with other Zunes not very useful. Ryan is correct in that it would be great to download tracks and equally useful would be the ability to sync with PC without cables etc.
I'll stick with the iPod for the time being and anyway, I quite like iTunes.
In a few days after launch it will be hacked and be a great multicapable device.
I was looking forward to the wireless, but this is stupid, why not allow it to sync wirelessly at least?
Battery. Wifi probably drains the battery enough. Well, no wireless sync or anythng about non-DRMd music makesme rethink my choice. I might just go with the gigabeat afterall.
Darn, I wanted to get a Zune when it came out thinking that the wireless features would include the FEATURES it cannot do. I will wait until Spring 2007 to purchase a Zune, if and only if things change. I guess I will have my IPOD for another couple of months.
I will wait and see what the hacks are like.
But one thing that does make me wonder...
What about more indie music that can not be purchased through the Zune Marketplace?
This is just another post written by someone who doesn't know all of Microsoft's plans... just because a feature wont be available from day one, doesn't mean that it wont come. It's probably being held back for technical or legal reasons.
No credit for "future features a/k/a vaporware" ... by the time MSFT gets around to enabling this feature on a broader basis:
1. Hardware will have moved forward enough that you'll want to replace the player anyway with something thinner/more featured.
2. Apple will have released at least one more generation of iPods, as will Sandisk, etc.
FYI, for the Xbox360 comments above, the Xbox360 does not have wifi built in.
It's sad enough they had to downprice the thing to compete only to later add that they're only 'promising' new functionality on the horizon.
I personally think they should make a whitepaper of what the Zune is 'intended' to do, once it's 'feature-complete'. The thing looks nice, and I won't sync to Zune Marketsh** since I buy my own CDs, but not being able to sync to the PC on the fly, it's kinda boomer.
Well this seems very useful
I believe wifi will be a staple in many DAPs as years go by, the question is who will do it right? My money is on Apple who knows a thing or two about satisfying the consumers.
What I would like:
Don't care about sending songs to others (or vise versa), that only limits the number of shared songs, as this Zune demonstrates. Allow me to search for other wifi players and listen to their shared playlist as much as I want, as long as they are in range. Think iTunes on a campus setting shared over a network.
Podcast has grown so fast it's insane for MS not to support it. I would love to be able to get the latest news (cnn, bbc, etc) sync wirelessly on my DAP as it becomes available.
Battery is of major concern here with wifi, so all this is moot if battery technology is not up to par.
M$oft missed a huge opportunity here by not allowing syncing/downloading remotely. Consider daily podcasts. I download the Wall St. Journal daily edition from audible, through ITunes and into my IPod everyday to listen to while I commute. Everyday it is a pain to hook the Ipod up in the morning and have it sync. Every time I do it I think of how nice it would be if the iPod just woke up in the morning, checked to see if any new podcasts were available and downloaded them in the background wirelessly without my intervention.
Think also of streaming YouTube to this thing . . . that would be another killer app.
In a way, Apple is lucky. If MSoft had introduced some of these simple uses of the WiFi Apple might be in trouble. As it is, I dont think they have anything to worry about.
A. Same price as iPod
B. More features
'Nuff said.
"A. Same price as iPod
B. More features
'Nuff said."
A PDA has more features than both, so at what point do you draw the line for being much bulkier? The fact is, the 30gb iPod, if you saw it next to that Zune, would be insane. The 30gb iPod is probably half as thick.
Instead of making assinine statemtents like: "The 30gb iPod is probably half as think' why don't you look it up?
.43 inches for iPod
.58 inches for the Zune
STOP.....STOP....STOP WASTING YOUR MONEY, MP3 players are D E A D. PPC-6700 and Orb, DONE. You can stream all your music from your home PC to your phone (2 Terrabytes anyone?) Plus anything else you can do with a PC minus ripping a physical CD or DVD on the spot for $320.
Microsoft used to allow WiFi syncing with their Pocket PC PDAs. However they ditched this feature about a year ago for "security reasons". I guess the deal is the same with the Zune.
Downloading music straight from the internet via WiFi could be a killer feature though, especially for those that travel on business a lot and the subscription-based sales model.
"A. Same price as iPod
B. More features
'Nuff said."
The iPod has much better battery life, is thinner, provides gapless playback (unknown whether Zune will) and has support for a loseless codec (another Zune unknown).
Same price, *different* features.
Richard:
The 30GB iPod plays for up to 14 hours of audio and 4 hours of video.
The 30GB Zune plays for up to 12 hours of audio and 3.5 hours of video.
You're right...that is 'much more' :{
A. Same price as iPod
B. More features
C. But Less Battery (12 hours), less with wifi on
D. Thick, no click wheel, no podcast in marketplace
C. Offset
Nuff Said
Wow. Way to fuck up this launch. Can't do the very things that I'd intended to wirelessly? No Internet? No wifi PC sync? Sooo wifi is in there for what exactly? To share with other Zunes? Uhh Yeah. See ya next year when your all hacked and useful if it even survives.
"Instead of making assinine statemtents like: "The 30gb iPod is probably half as think' why don't you look it up?
.43 inches for iPod
.58 inches for the Zune"
35% thinner might not be 50%, but it's still a pretty big difference.
And people, PLEASE... it's "guerilla" marketing.
Ok, this is what I predict.. tell me if you guys agree:
Zune is released.
(~3 days later)
Zune firmware cracked- can now trade songs without any DRM involved.
(~1 week later)
Zune firmware update 1.1 allows wifi PC syncing... but also breaks the recent firmware crack..
this will be similar to PSP hacks / Firmware updates.
You know, I feel bad for Microsoft in a way. People invest all their hopes and dreams into what features it will or won't have, and when their pie-in-the-sky dreams don't come true, they pout and get disappointed. Lots of people will be disappointed by the Zune this time around, but I'm sure in 2.0 (and better yet 3.0) they will take these complaints into consideration. Apple, on the other hand, releases features when they are more fully-baked, and doesn't prerelease so it doesn't court these kind of expectations. However the furious Apple rumor mill has almost the same effect.
In the end, I think you'll find that a lot of the frustrations people have with MP3 players is caused by the hoops they have to jump through for the record labels. And Microsoft isn't going to change that anytime soon.
I agree with the ORB and PPC-6700 option. That is currently what I use. Also considering on getting a slingbox for the tv stream.
"The 30GB iPod plays for up to 14 hours of audio and 4 hours of video.
The 30GB Zune plays for up to 12 hours of audio and 3.5 hours of video.
You're right...that is 'much more' :{"
Hmmm when you take into consideration how thick the Zune is and how thin the iPod is, that is a huge difference. MS couldnt get 20 hours out of that brick?
To the guy who says you would only buy an iPod for for 'cool' factor or that you hate MS. That is an incredibly stupid argument.
What if I like Apple? What if I like the iPod? What if my computer is a Mac which limits the number of players I can use? My iPods do everything I need them to. Which for me is playing music. I don't need wireless, I don't need to watch videos. The current iPod is a great size. I would hope Apple would introduce a larger video-centric model.
Which will probably be:
Widescreen
Thinner than the Zune
Have more capacity than the Zune
It will probably do this wireless thing right
Anyhow, to suggest that people only buy iPods to be cool is ridiculous. So now what, people buy Zunes to be anti-cool, or is it really just a new conformist movement cloaked in a anti-conformist motive?
i can see it now.
the Zune as the Ultimate Ice Breaker
"Hey Baby, wanna 'interface'?"