iTunes 7.4.1 already released -- free ringtone workaround is NOT ok

Just thought we'd let the droves of paranoid upgraders know in on a small bit of good bad news. Yes, Apple did already release a new version of iTunes tonight, 7.4.1, and we tested to see if said update "fixes" the ringtone-renaming hack (if you really want to call it a hack) that lets users supply their own ringtones sans Apple's $0.99 fee. Breathe not so easy: it may be legal (probably), but the hack did not continue to work just fine for us. More below.

Update: So yes, our previous ringtones carried over and we were able to add new renamed ringtones to iTunes -- but our readers are right in that 7.4.1 DOES block the renamed ringtone workaround moving forward. Our initial syncs went unblocked, but only until we tried to add new ringtone files. Once you actually attempt to sync new renamed ringtone files, well, then you're in for a heap o' pain (see above).

[Thanks to everyone who sent this in]

[waiownsyou @ Sep 7th 2007 11:38PM]

I was hoping for this to come out soon. I had this weird installation bug on 7.4 on my Vista system and everytime I would turn on iTunes now, it would tell me the installation was damaged and but it started up just fine. I tried repairing it with the installation file, but that did diddly squat. I hope that's what this fixes.

[imacmatt09 @ Sep 7th 2007 11:43PM]

"...on my Vista system..."

Well that's your problem :)

[waiownsyou @ Sep 7th 2007 11:44PM]

imacmatt09:
Stop being a Mac fanboy and stop complaining about stuff you haven't even tried. There's nothing wrong with Vista except a few driver incompatibilities.

Anywho, that installation bug is still there. Damn it. 7.3 was fine... WHY APPLE? WHY?!

[imacmatt09 @ Sep 7th 2007 11:59PM]

To tell you the truth I have used it many times. Used it as my main OS for a few months then got tired of the RAM usage (512 MB to boot). XP is better than Vista by far and Mac OS X is better than them both. I have no problem with XP though I think its a pretty good OS but still like OS X better. But I just can't stand vista and its usage of system resources, that user account control thing, incompatibility and other things. XP and OS X = Good, Vista = Bad. Oh yeah linux is good too!

[David @ Sep 8th 2007 12:09AM]

Are you installing the updates from iTunes? Mine errors also in iTunes. Use the Apple Software Update program, it works for me.

[Ignatius @ Sep 8th 2007 12:21AM]

Vista sucks, I hate Apple.

Thing is though... XP is awesome compared to OS X and Vista.

[bondsbw @ Sep 8th 2007 12:24AM]

waiownsyou

Ok, I'm going to follow the off-topic here, but yes, Vista sucks. I'm a Windows/.NET programmer with a work laptop that runs Vista, a work desktop and home desktop that both run XP, and a Macbook at home (and I use several Windows 2000/2003 servers). I use Vista practically every day, but it feels like it tries to find ways to piss me off.

"Nothing wrong with Vista except a few driver incompatibilities" makes me think that YOU don't use Vista on a regular basis. Or, you're one of the many that Microsoft has brainwashed into thinking that it's ok if the computer gets in your way.

Or, maybe it actually is working great for you. That's the biggest problem with Vista... the experience is SO inconsistent, that it's practically impossible to debug software because you don't know if a problem that never shows up on XP is a real bug in a program, or a quirk of Vista that might not happen on another machine with the same configuration. At least Windows Me was decently consistent with its crashes.

Wow, I hate getting off into a rant, especially an off-topic one... but I'm starting to get tired of people defending that $300 downgrade+WindowBlinds. (And I've actually run the WindowBlinds Aero theme on XP... feels much snappier than Vista and all its flare.)

[John Doe @ Sep 8th 2007 12:27AM]

Umm waiownsyou. I hate to break this to you but there is more then just a few driver issues with Vista. I've been running it since I got my free copy from MS. Its buggy as hell. (Though the last couple reliability updates did cure at least 3 issues I had.) It doesn't work right with half my games even when you enable compatibility mode. I've had serious issues with MS's firewall and several alls most notably SAP and then there is drivers. A fracking joke. There is nothing fanboish about telling the truth. Vista was a paid Beta software. I have no doubt that all these issues will be fixed in time just as Apple 10.0 became monumentally better with 10.1, 10.2, etc. But for now its still buggy. Period.

[waiownsyou @ Sep 8th 2007 12:51AM]

Maybe Vista is buggy for you all because you're all apparently getting free Vista from somewhere. I had to fork over full price for Vista Ultimate.

And I don't know why you all complain about bugs, I haven't seen any except for annoying driver problems. Beyond that, this computer is smooth as a bird. Thing is, though, you need to have high hardware requirements, which I apparently have (2 GB RAM, dual core, 7900 GT, etc.).

You guys should NOT have 512MB systems and bitch that an operating system that comes out in 2007 is running too slow. It's not slow, you're behind. It's like running Windows 98 on a Win 95 system. It's annoying as hell.

And as a follow-up, I'm running the 64-bit of Vista, so I don't know if that's why I have no problems with this operating system. 32-bit = asking for trouble.

[dj-kenpo @ Sep 8th 2007 2:04AM]

that's great and all waiownsyou , but the point is, in the end, with all your 2gb of ram etc, my clunker spare computer, a p3 1.2ghz running xp, probably loads ms office and firefox faster than your ohh so powerful vista rig. beyond problems, it's just slow, if you're not a power user then I guess it doesn't matter, it'll load your pr0n images just fine, but if you were doing photoshop, maya, or anything professional, you'd notice your system is crap.

as a programmer, I'll tell you, there's no excuse in my book for bad code. you go over old work, find ways to make it smaller/faster/tighter. not the opposite.

as for your comment in re: to the free copies, people got free copies for testing it, they;re the same copy you have, not some other magic one.

[jg @ Sep 8th 2007 2:33AM]

To continue the Vista topic, I find all the Vista detractors to be High-larious.

Mostly because this was the exact, and you can quote me on this, the EXACT same spiel we got when XP first came out. XP is worthless. You're paying for nothing but a fancy theme.

Don't get me wrong, I use Vista, and I downgraded back to XP after a bit. It's frustrating yes, but when you compare a 5+ year old OS to a 1+ year OS...gee...lemme guess...the 1 year one has more bugs?

Fact is, on a machine with decent specs, Vista is nicer to use when it's working. Things that aren't working now, won't stay that way. Have patience and don't write something off because it doesn't blow your mind. That's the same as supermodel syndrome as I call it (when all you see is supermodels, you feel like getting yourself anything less is a let down).

Do yourselves a favor, and instead of saying how much Vista sucks, be one of the people letting MS know how to make it better. If Vista gets better...you don't lose...it's better for you.

[Shaun Braley @ Sep 8th 2007 5:34AM]

I don't remember many negative comments about XP when it came out. I think the general consensus with XP was that finally moving away from DOS to an NT-based OS was a significant upgrade to Windows and brought real improvements in both stability and security. I think Windows XP is probably the finest OS Microsoft ever made. Windows 98 was great but still just a glorified DOS shell. And DOS isn't even an MS product!

That from an Apple convert.

[nikster @ Sep 8th 2007 9:03AM]

bondsbw: Exactly! I was trying Vista Ultimate on my 2GB RAM machine. My main issue with it is not how slow it is - I am sure that will be fixed soon. My main issue is how much it intentionally gets in the way. For every dialog in XP, Vista has two. Things that take 2 steps in XP take 5 in Vista. I dont want an OS that asks me what to do at every corner - I want to never, ever see or hear anything from or about the OS. I want to do my work, undisturbed. Thats where Vista fails.

It's not the same as when XP came out. It's the same as when Windows ME came out. Like ME, Vista is a serious donwgrade from a perfectly OK predecessor.

[treetrunk @ Sep 8th 2007 11:43AM]

Oh, stop whining. I've been using Vista since it came out and it's fine. It's not perfect, but neither were XP or OS X when they were new. The only driver trouble I've had on my 3 year-old laptop is that my never-used infra-red port doesn't work.

Having got used to Vista, XP just seems crude by comparison, and OS X's window management just irritates me - there's no proper taskbar, no proper maximise button, documents don't sit "inside" their application like they (logically) do on Windows, and as such everything ends up in a mess requiring a sloppy workaround like exposé. I've never understood the fuss about OS X- it might look pretty, but is functionally crap.

[Johan S @ Sep 7th 2007 11:43PM]

If I am not able to use a song I supposedly "purchased" as a ringtone, do I really own the song or not? What other things can they legally prevent me from doing with music I own? Dancing to it? Perhaps a $1.99 extra if I intend to use the music to dance?

[Alex @ Sep 8th 2007 12:10AM]

You don't own any songs you purchase, not even on CD. The publisher has to explicitly allow Apple to sell you the song as a ringtone. If the publisher doesn't allow it, Apple cannot let you make a ringtone from it.

[sean lancaster @ Sep 8th 2007 2:09AM]

you're falling into the trap i hate. if i buy a CD, then i can play the songs on that CD on my iPod or on my home stereo or in my car, etc. this is all legal.

now, you're buying into the notion that suddenly i buy a tune to play on my iPhone as well as all the devices above is fine . . . but making that same tune play when someone calls is no longer the same thing??? why is a ringtone different because of when it plays? if this hack was so easy (merely changing the extension) then it's just the song already on my iPhone that the RIAA to collect for twice. this ringtone business is a joke.

[James Lewis @ Sep 8th 2007 2:26PM]

You do not own the song. You purchased a license to the song. That license does not allow using portions of the song as a ringtone. For that, you must purchase another license from the content owner (through apple).

This a very old argument/misunderstanding with media. You don't "own" the content you just paid for, you only own a license to that content.

[mitchell @ Sep 8th 2007 9:04PM]

The root of the problem is... rintones are sounds, and we are being double charged for a sound we already have already paid a license for.

Are you telling me that if I set my alarm clock to play "Woop, there it is!" in the morning... I'm breaking copyright? That's essentially what a ringtone is. A scheduled sound.

[Cleverboy @ Sep 12th 2007 5:37AM]

Ringtone any song you want, using iTunes 7.4 or higher. Everyone needs to read this and NOT continue using the "renaming" trick or unecessary jailbreaking (if you ONLY want a ringtone).
iPhone Ringtones - What Did iTunes 7.4.1 really do?
http://www.digg.com/apple/iPhone_Ringtones_What_Did_iTunes_7_4_1_really_do

[Nick Spohnholtz @ Sep 7th 2007 11:44PM]

doesn't work for me.

gives me a popup saying the file type is unsupported for the iPhone.

[justin Cox @ Sep 7th 2007 11:47PM]

Same here. Oh well, it was fun for a few hours.

[Pep @ Sep 8th 2007 12:01AM]

Same here. It appears and everything but at syncing time it tells me that it couldn't sync it because this format is unsupported by the iPhone. I tried both renaming an MP3 file (in that case it doesn't even appear in iTunes) and also an AAC file, where it appears but then it says unsupported by the iPhone.

Oh well. I will keep uploading them with iBricker :-)

[Ryan Block @ Sep 8th 2007 12:51AM]

Yep, you guys are right, it was syncing with a file that was already there -- it wouldn't sync with a new file I added, so this good news just turned bad. Thanks for your help in sorting this out everyone!

[Wct @ Sep 8th 2007 2:21PM]

I'll never understand how people can be so foolish as to idolize Apple. Their products have been questionable at best, and the prices since their inception have been higher than the market should bear. They design products whose batteries can't be replaced, for example, and lead the rest of the industry in that direction. Now we all suffer. They are petty about what they allow their products to do. They want to gouge their customers and make them pay for everything that is free on the rest of the market. Why are people so dumb loyal? There are products on the market that work as good and many that work better. They seem to want to line their pockets with severe greed while leaving their loyal customers in a money hole. Their designs are limited so as to destroy any competition at your expense. Monopolyism!! The rest of the world says "look at our products and see how we designed them to do what you want. We make them versatile for you our loyal customers." While Apple says "pay me for everything! Nothing is free here. And if it is free now, it won't be in the future." If I were one of their loyal customers, I'd say "I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore!!!" as I ran at supersonic speed to Apples competitors.

[Arjy @ Sep 7th 2007 11:46PM]

The "hack" works for me, but I'm being told that my version of iTunes is up do date, which contradicts what engadget is telling me D:

[sal @ Sep 7th 2007 11:48PM]

If anyone is an Itoner user they got a version 1.0.1 that works fine with the new version of itunes just finished trying it.

[Alex @ Sep 7th 2007 11:51PM]

Intel Mac
I got the popup, I can provide a screenshot if you want it to confirm the error. So yah, they fixed it.

[George @ Sep 7th 2007 11:55PM]

awesome

[manfesto @ Sep 7th 2007 11:57PM]

No dice - I got an error message after updating to 7.4.1 that my ten new ringtones can't be played back.

Sorry Engadget, your readers just aren't as lucky as you :-|

[Kei @ Sep 7th 2007 11:58PM]

anyone have a copy of 7.4.0 ? :P

[Amish @ Sep 8th 2007 12:12AM]

http://appldnld.apple.com.edgesuite.net/content.info.apple.com/iTunes7/Win/061-3604.20070905.Cyi94/iTunesSetup.exe

[Aleks @ Sep 7th 2007 11:58PM]

Engadget -

Can you please warn your readers NOT to upgrade to 7.4.1... it certainly breaks adding .m4r files to the library!

[Ryan Block @ Sep 8th 2007 12:53AM]

Yep, added comments above, figured out why we were getting a false positive! Thanks for your help in sorting this out!

[mitchell @ Sep 8th 2007 9:18PM]

The trick about that is... eventually, Apple can force you to upgrade. I wouldn't be surprised if 7.4.2 (or some other version) isn't required after the next iPhone upgrade.

I've read the "well, just don't upgrade" note before, but eventually, there will be a feature you need, and you will have to say goodbye to your functionality. I remember when you could stream your iTunes music over the internet. I loved it... I could look at my iTunes library over the internet and stream it to my work computer... that got killed. Sure, I held out for a while, but eventually, there was a killer feature or OS upgrade that simply forced an upgrade.

[J @ Sep 8th 2007 12:01AM]

Sounds lke I'm not upgrading to 7.4.1 then.

[PizzashaX @ Sep 8th 2007 12:02AM]

Awesome, too bad I dont have an iPhone.

[Tim @ Sep 8th 2007 12:02AM]

Any ideas on how to clear out my ringtone list now that they don't work? Deleted the files under user/music/itunes/ringtones but the list still says that they are there?

Tried a restore, didn't work.

[David @ Sep 8th 2007 12:23AM]

Don't know if this is the best or only way to do it. iTunes keeps copies of the library in a folder "Previous iTunes Libraries" in the iTunes folder. I renamed and copied the "iTunes Library" file to that folder and copied the file with a date/time stamp before I changed things to the iTunes folder. Be sure to remove any date/time info from the name. Must be "iTunes Library". Start iTunes and all is well.

[Tim @ Sep 8th 2007 12:42AM]

Well that worked, but it also killed all my play lists, etc. Any other ideas?

[todd @ Sep 8th 2007 2:50PM]

The problem is not the iphone but in iTunes. You will have to delete your 'iTunes Library' data file and .xml file. and rebuilt your index of songs. or Hopefully you have a backup of this file somewhere. This file is your index of your itunes the entire itunes library and that is whats keeping the ghosted ringtone that you cant get rid of.

[Tim @ Sep 8th 2007 3:03PM]

Any way to modify that file in a pref edditor. I tried using property list editor, but it could not open up the iTunes library file, only the XML file. I am assuming that the ringtone ghosts are stored in the iTunes library file

[Alexander @ Sep 8th 2007 12:08AM]

Ipod Touch

[Steve Simitzis @ Sep 8th 2007 12:12AM]

So maybe what this means is that the ringtone files have to have a specific bitrate or other specs that Ryan Block just happens to have set.

Perhaps you can post the file specs of your ringtones for others to try out? 7.4.1 also blocks me from syncing them over.

[Garen Arargil @ Sep 8th 2007 12:27AM]

Can someone please tell me how to change the file format from AAC to m4r???!!!

[Amish @ Sep 8th 2007 12:33AM]

Just rename the AAC file extension from .m4a to .m4r.

Overall steps.
1. Convert mp3 to aac by right clicking in itunes-> convert to aac
2. Right click the newly created aac file ->open in explorer
3. Make a copy
4. Rename it exactly same except the extension of .m4r
5. Double Click file.
6. Ringtone tab should appear under iPhone.

[Garen Arargil @ Sep 8th 2007 12:43AM]

so i just type in say ringtone.m4r when i rename it,or do i actually have to convert something?

[Sean @ Sep 8th 2007 12:30AM]

It humors me so to see every attempt to 'hack' the iPhone knocked down with the cold, brushed aluminum-alloy fist of Apple as soon as the attempt goes viral.

[Baloney Fist @ Sep 8th 2007 12:43AM]

I haven't seen Apple act this amateurish since Scully was running things.

[thatdidnthurt @ Sep 8th 2007 12:43AM]

I find it funny that M$ gets all these monopoly claims when I see this kind of crap from Apple. I run Vista Ultimate 64 bit and rarely have any issues with anything I run on it. Before you all go off on me, I also have a Macbook Pro, which I prefer for most things and I run Ubuntu in VM on the Macbook and dual partition on the Windows machine.

The reason I think this is funny is because my 2.5 year old Windows Mobile 5 phone runs any damn song I want as a ringer. Is it a big brick? yeah. Do I hate it? Most of the time - but randomly enough M$ could care less whether I use my own song as a ringtone. What kind of crap is that anyway?!?! If I buy a song and put that song on my music playing phone, why shouldn't I be able to point the ringer at my song?

The only thing I am worried about is the phone providers. They are forcing phone manufacturers to alter (cripple) their base software so they can sell you more services. This is one of the main reasons Verizon will lose me as a customer. The thing that sucks is you have to pay an arm and a leg to get the phone the manufacturer intended - all features in tact.