Perpetual motion machine... isn't

Finally -- the laws of physics have been smashed to itty-bitty, succulent bits, like a thin piece of glass obliterated by a cartoon anvil -- all in some dude's low-lit basement. According to the video which you can watch after the break, a mysterious entity known as Alsetalokin has laser-gunned the forces of the universe to death with a perpetual motion device which he's demonstrated on an obscure internet website called YouTube. Like Fox Mulder, we want to believe, but just like the fate of Steorn's Orbo, this is looking like another quickly-debunked fiasco. After a few hours of this clip doing the rounds, the hive-mind of the information superhighway began to pick it apart, piece by piece. The noise swelled so loudly that the original poster has actually changed his angle on the story, but that won't stop you from seeing the eye-shattering, star-bending magic of this magnet-driven motor.

[Via Digg]

[Biff Superman @ Jan 5th 2008 10:24PM]

I'd hit it

[luke @ Jan 5th 2008 10:43PM]

i want it to be real.....

theoretically: magnets can deft gravity infinitely, and therefore are capable of providing easilly tapped power if switched on and off quickly.

rationally: im no scientist, but this machine could potentially create energy. however, that energy may come from yet unknown sources. (endothermic in some way maybe?)

realistically: there could easily be a motor hidden inside the rotating section operated by batteries

[luke @ Jan 5th 2008 10:51PM]

all of a sudden, engadget surprises me. at the actual video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIvZJ9xGutI the first line the author says is "WHERE IS WRITTEN THAT THIS IS A PERPETUUM MOBILE, YOU IGNORANT DIGG LUNATICS?"

why would respectable engadget reference digg, and not the actual first hand video? it shocks me somewhere inside.

[LesbianHam @ Jan 5th 2008 11:13PM]

I've not watched the video myself (yet) but it's perfectly possible that the author has edited the description in response to the response he's got from the intarweb's communities

[Matt @ Jan 6th 2008 6:45AM]

According to the laws of physics: energy(/matter) cannot be created or destroyed. Any power 'extracted' from an electromagnet as you describe would be equal or more likely less than the power input to the electromagnet by electricity. You cannot have something for nothing. Furthermore, magnetism cannot defy gravity infinitely, it's just magnetism is a stronger force than gravity.

[Aaron @ Jan 6th 2008 7:09AM]

I do believe the title of the video has MPMM in it...

Magnetic Perpetual Motion Machine

"WHERE IS WRITTEN THAT THIS IS A PERPETUUM MOBILE, YOU IGNORANT DIGG LUNATICS?"


I think someone needs to check what things are before posting video's on peoples behalf or making commments on such things

[oshawapilot @ Jan 5th 2008 10:47PM]

Ok, so it's not a perpetual motion machine after the fact.

But, will it blend?

[Alexander @ Jan 5th 2008 10:52PM]

Fact: Magnets are attracted to one another.

That's all that any of these devices prove. Friction will always make these devices stop. There's no stopping the forces of friction.

Now, these devices may work in micro-gravity where there is very little friction... But I think if that were possible, NASA wouldn't be going to such lengths to get solar panels installed on the ISS.

[Ian @ Jan 5th 2008 11:53PM]

fact: magnets are repelled by each other

u lie! u lie! WHY O WHY MUST U LIE

[Ian @ Jan 5th 2008 11:53PM]

fact: magnets are repelled by each other

u lie! u lie! WHY O WHY MUST U LIE

[Matt @ Jan 6th 2008 6:47AM]

These devices would move perpetually in 0g, however, extracting the energy would take the energy out of the device. In 0g, these devices could be thought of as a kinetic energy 'battery'. You can input energy into them, then remove the same amount of energy later.

[Eric @ Jan 5th 2008 10:55PM]

WHAT THE EFFF!! DAVID BLAINE YOU DEMON!!!!

[aguiluz @ Jan 5th 2008 11:05PM]

An electric motor you will find in a regular toy has an electromagnet inside it.

So, you might think that replacing the electromagnets with permanent mags will work.

Nope, the electromagnet changes poles every few moments.

Seriously, if this is real, we will have solved our power problem.

I want to see how he built it though. I hate to know there is a motor with just a reed switch in it.

[Matt @ Jan 6th 2008 6:51AM]

Only electromagnets powered by alternating current will change poles. Direct current would keep the poles the same. The reason these devices do not provide free energy with electromagnets is that the energy input to the device through electricity would be the same as the energy extracted from the device as kinetic energy.

[luke @ Jan 6th 2008 11:14AM]

as for switching poles...that could explain why these magnests are half black-half white....(duh)

perpetual motion is only possible when friction is 100% non-existant. even so, there is a difference etween perpetual motion and an infinite energy source. PMMs dont have to produce over 100% effeciency, and can therefore not violate thermodynamics laws. it isthe friction that brings them to a halt.

[MisterEd @ Jan 5th 2008 11:43PM]

Nice reporting - on what some 15 year old kid from digg said. Read the *original* source of where this came from; this article and digg are only repeating what kids are saying, if anyone read the original source they'd know that:

#1, the author of the video showed a couple of people then promptly removed it from public view

#2, no claim has ever been made

#3, the project isn't even finished

#4, in the end the anomaly in the video will probably have a logical explanation, not a hysterical one

I'd suggest everyone ignores this video because it shows nothing - if there's anything to report I'm sure the people responsible will ensure it's reported properly to the appropriate people. Or, of course, feel free to make a replication of the thing in the video.

[Abuzar @ Jan 5th 2008 11:57PM]

None of you are funny! Say something Funny!

[richardf @ Jan 6th 2008 12:16AM]

I for one welcome our new clock-work overlords. At least until they have run down. Do you think I want to be the one to wind Mr. Roboto up? It's like crank starting a car. I'll get my arm ripped off!

[evolvealready @ Jan 6th 2008 12:36AM]

Al and OC never claimed OU, they are skeptics. You on the other hand, are hacks.

[Mark @ Jan 6th 2008 1:09AM]

The pseudonym "Nikola Tesla" spelled backwards? Sounds like he wants to perform some wireless power transmission then.

[Arthur Nonamiss @ Jan 7th 2008 12:45PM]

Quote:
The pseudonym "Nikola Tesla" spelled backwards? Sounds like he wants to perform some wireless power transmission then.

Don't you mean wireless power reception?

::rimshot::

[bob @ Jan 6th 2008 1:25AM]

It was built by members of the steron forum.
All you need to know and more http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:OC_MPMM_Magnet_Motor

[robert @ Jan 6th 2008 1:26AM]

okay.
"WHERE IS WRITTEN THAT THIS IS A PERPETUUM MOBILE, YOU IGNORANT DIGG LUNATICS?"
OC must be Over Confident, right?
well frm the title of the video and the explanation, i would imagine that
MPMM could mean Magnetic Perpetual Motion Machine?
Are they upset that someone called it a "perpetuum mobile"?
And, posting a video, letting it get really popular, then removing it. The whole thing screams of viral video, attention seekers etc.
Low Lit Basement says it all. Why would you make a device like this, then film it in these conditions. The camera is okay and it would only take 10 seconds to fix the conditions.

[Mke @ Jan 6th 2008 1:45AM]

Overconfident is the guy's username on the Steorn forum. Overconfident is the dude who created this.

[ErikLindemann @ Jan 6th 2008 1:30AM]

I love it when people claim to make something like this. Don't pay attention to what modern physics has taught you, this machine operates outside of what we know to be real.

[Arthur Nonamiss @ Jan 7th 2008 12:48PM]

If Newton and Einstein had that same attitude, where would we be now?

[Mike @ Jan 6th 2008 1:33AM]

Magnets cannot provide power. Read a textbook on electromagnetism.

Magnetic fields can change the direction of a charged particle, but they cannot change the particle's kinetic energy. Power is the derivative energy, and since the energy cannot change, and is therefore constant, its derivative is zero, hence no power is produced.

[Brian f @ Jan 6th 2008 4:16AM]

thank you for not typing "and hence"
and by the way my sister has a perpetual motion device at home, it's Lexi the Min-Pin

[Kektek @ Jan 6th 2008 1:34AM]

Wait, why didn't this actually link to any of the debunking?

[crazydog115 @ Jan 6th 2008 4:01AM]

Kektek, that's what I was thinking!

I'm not too science-y myself, so I would like to read some explanations of what that REALLY is.

[Mr. S. @ Jan 6th 2008 4:59AM]

This really could be for real... But its not perpetual.

IF this was made to work in a vacuum, and IF instead of bearings it used magnetic bearings, there would still be a slow loss of power over time as the magnets lose their strength. This would take a long time, but it does occur in electric motors. So, this thing could run for a very long time with no addition movement, but not be perpetual.

[Matt @ Jan 6th 2008 7:05AM]

A quite simple way to debunk this is to look at the laws of physics. Energy/matter cannot be created or destroyed. Magnets have no magical properties which allow them to defy this law. It's difficult to explain why, but imagine you have a nail and a magnet. The nail is lifted by the magnet, converting magnetic energy to kinetic energy. However, to continue extracting this energy, the nail must be moved away from the magnet, which uses equal or more energy than is output by the magnets attraction of the nail. This is also true when you have the magnets mounted on a wheel, as in this device.

[Aleks Clark @ Jan 6th 2008 8:43AM]

eh, I don't thing you could get a small battery and motor that could provide that kind of acceleration and speed on that much mass, and even then, the magnet interaction in the video is pretty convincing. Also, if I was out to fool some people on the internet, I probably wouldn't bother with saying "oh, it takes a few tries to get it in sync, and also, for some reason it stops every few hours" (I'm guessing manufacturing problems to do with rotational sync). And of course, the fact that they are being very forthcoming with all the details of construction, down to magnet model numbers and mockups, is encouraging.

Fact is, that thing accelerates. Unless I've seen some solid debunking, I'm building one for myself as soon as I get out of theatre. Even if it degausses the magnets, it's still pretty damned cool. Anyone think we can get net energy out of magnets? I'm not sure how much energy is consumed in the manufacture of strong magnets. Personally, if I was the builder, I would have slapped together a rig with some legos to see how much drag could be put on the wheel, and maybe hooked up a small dc motor and an LED.

On an end note, I'd like a brighter video where he's got it going at full speed and shows back and front of the device while it's going...

[gbdsbh2o @ Jan 6th 2008 11:40AM]

1) how long do these people think 'perpetual' is?

2) how come no one ever tries to dis-prove or overcome the Law of Gravity? Or the Law that objects in motion continue in motion unless acted on by an outside force? Or that sunlight can be broken into it's constituent colors by a prism?

[bicycle @ Jan 6th 2008 1:54PM]

when will we be honest and power our own lives . and stop paying " them " to power us

[Unbangyourmom @ Jan 7th 2008 6:14PM]

doesn't need debunking. If you were to even try to do anything with the magic spinning wheel, it would stop and you would go nowhere.

[mrsean2k @ Jan 8th 2008 5:44AM]

No, no, no, *please* do minimal research.

Alsetalokin has *never* claimed OU for this device at any point, and has specifically cautioned against people reading that into the video. He has stated that, in his opinion, there is absolutely no chance that this is a PMM.

The shallowest research into postings on the public Steorn forum will confirm this, and his general skepticism of the Steorn claim. Bizarrely, other observers are excitedly claiming it as proof, but this is being immediately and unambiguously rebuffed. This in no way alters the fact that the device appears to exhibit interesting (but non-miraculous) behaviour.

Please amend your article to reflect things more fairly.

[mr lomax @ Jan 8th 2008 5:50AM]

This is fucking pathetic. I haven't seen a single person believe this is a perpetuum mobile, yet everyone feel they are mister smarty pants and point to physics 101 as if that proves anything by itself. Proper debunking would explain the obvious non-intuitive acceleration, and so far there is not very much data. People who claim they debunked this on basis of a video are patethic, so is the author who believed comments on digg represented an authority.

Personally I think it is cool, because this is built on basis of the idea of OC, and in turn realized (partially) by AL, thus implying that OC's idea has some weird properties. And of all the machines I've seen this is one of the few that at least behaves odd (and just isn't an obvious flywheel).

[steven @ Apr 1st 2008 11:49AM]

Perpetual Motion is possibles Conservation of Energy states energy cant be created or destroyed and this itself proves that perpertual motion is possible. if only u can get all the energy back from a closed system which MUST be possible