No region codes for HD DVD?

The "DVD Forum Japan Conference 2005" is being held in Japan today, and because of the time difference, it's already over. The primary topic of the meeting was, as expected, HD DVD. Plenty of information is emerging from the conference, such as the steps towards finalizing standards that we won't bother you with (though they did announce "HD DVD-RR," a sort of HD DVD version of DVD-RAM). But one statement from Toshiba Digital Media Networks' Hisashi Yamada was particularly intriguing: "We've gotten a variety of opinions about region controls. Even in the Steering Committee, they are extremely unpopular; we decided to not put them in. HD DVD probably won't contain any region playback controls." Of course there's still that "probably" in there, but it's nice to see someone up there realizes how ridiculous DVD region codes really are.

[Gowans007 @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

Thats Awesome!

They are truley stupid and now with the Austrilian courts ruling Modding is legal due to playing games, DVD from other regions maybe this is a sign of teh next step!

[Apc3161 @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

I'm pro Blu-Ray...So I hope this encourages the Blu-Ray team to follow suit

[Maicca @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

DVD region codes were a tool of the media production companies- if I buy a movie in Europe and bring it back to the US, why shouldn't I be able to play it? It *is* my property, I bought it legally. It was all about being able to control the prices of DVDs in different sections of the world. After all, if you could (while living in Australia) buy an American DVD for half the price of a local one.............why not?

[DanielTS @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

I'm pro no region coding format!

[Mathias Pettersson @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

Maicca, it's not your property according to the media company. You buy the right to use it, under their terms.

[ty @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

I wonder whos on the steering committee...it cant be media companies since region coding lets them control their content (HD content at that). That is, region coding shouldnt be a problem at all for the media companies since they can code their releases as region-free. It would not be a good move for HDDVD to entirely remove region coding. Its a problem for manufacteurs and consumers perhaps, but, not media companies.

[DanielTS @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

Hitachi,IBM, Industrial and Technology Research Institute, Intel, LG, Matsushita, Microsoft, Mitsubishi, NEC, Pionner, Philips, Samsung, Sanyo, Sharp, Sony, Thomson, Time Warner, Toshiba, JVC, Disney
http://www.dvdforum.org/about-steering.htm

[Jeff @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

Whooooah, dudes and dudettes. I've been total Blu-Ray fanboy up to this point but if HD-DVD has no region controls I'm switching alliances, no question about it. This is pretty major.

Of course, this is the kind of thing that can easily get taken out of context when somebody's talking about one specific implementation (like, for example, a test kit or something). But hopefully, he really was talking about the mass-market players/recorders.

[Aegis @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

NOT BLOODY LIKELY!

No region codes is BS to build up hybe for the HD-DVD camp, since they are looking mighty poor with the lost of exclusivity from Paramont. Region codes are for Studios, not consumers or manufacters.

It's a tool to protect prices and release dates, being that some movies are released first in the US and then later in other regions (ie Asia) for much different prices. Studios rely on them. Without region codes I doubt we'll see many movies being released on HD-DVD.

Studios even forced UMDs to have region codes, even when Sony themselves didn't put region codes on their games.

[DanielTS @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

The current DVD region coding concept is archaic, because the Internet (movie promotion�) is worldwide and the e-business (Amazon.com ...) is worldwide.

A lot of people enjoy original version movies; others can only watch dubbed or subbed versions.
They are different customers.
In other words, the studios won�t lose any money if they adopt the launch business model of the book industry: the English version of the Harry Potter book series has a worldwide launch, and the other language versions arrive some months later.

Original version die-hards currently use region-modified DVD players.
If the region coding lasts with new high def discs, it will encourage ("legal") hacking!!

[Robert Aitchison @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

Certianly no argument that region coding is ridiculous, but I think the motivations may not be so altruistic.

Often times when people modify their DVD player to remove regional restrictions the Macrovision encoding gets removed as well as an unintentional (or not) side effect. Removing regional restrictions removes a legitimate reason to modify your DVD player.

Of course modifying your DVD player specifically to remove Macrovision encoding so you can make backup copies of your DVDs is also a legitimate, legal reason but that's something the copyright cartel is working to change.

#9 (Aegis) The studios will push hard for whichever format they like better but if consumers end up choosing the other one in large numbers they will be forced to support that standard. Regardless of how they act they need consumers more than consumers need them.

[RB @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

And we have a winner...

[Aegis @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

#11 (Robert Artchison),

in reply to"
"The studios will push hard for whichever format they like better but if consumers end up choosing the other one in large numbers they will be forced to support that standard. Regardless of how they act they need consumers more than consumers need them."

Well that's the conumdrum, studios will choose the format the consumers buy, but consumers won't invest in a system that there isn't any content for.

Region-coding isn't a big issue for the 95%+ of the consumer being that the avg consumer doesn't bother to buy movies outside of their region. Region-coding is more important to the studio than it is the average consumer, HD-DVD not having region coding is just PR FUD.

Besides, as shown with current generation DVDs, region-coding is easy to get around, just buy a chinese or taiwanese brand that lets you change the region code. Problem solved.

[010111 @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

is there no longer a PAL / NTSC differential in the HD formats? i haven't seen anything yes or no... though i remember seeing PAL specs for the DVX200 listing a "25p" and having PAL-esque SD dimensions.

[Nobuyuki Idei @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

This would be the final nail in the coffin for HD DVD. Studios will now actually _prefer_ to put out content on Blu-Ray.

[simmons @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

#13 (010111) -

There is indeed still a difference between "PAL" and "NTSC" DVDs. (This is a separate thing from region coding, of course.) However, it's my understanding that some players can translate the PAL resolution and frame rate into NTSC output. And of course, the PAL/NTSC thing isn't a big deal if you're playing a disc on your computer.

A friend of mine has a Oppo player (with the region codes disabled) hooked up to a projector. I watch my region-2 PAL discs over there. :)

[shidoshi @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

See, I was totally on the side of Blu-Ray for a long time... but now with the talk of the ability to do controlled copies, and no region encoding, HD-DVD is trying to hard to make me love it.

I really hope Blu-Ray also brings about the end of regional encoding; that way, no matter which format wins, we win when it comes to playing discs from any region.

[Andreas @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

If there was a dude in an important steering committee that suddenly said "We will now introduce region lockings on audio CD's" the world would not accept it, it would be ridiculous.
If a music CD is released in India and not in Sweden well, then the swede into indian music buys it on the journey and plays it at home.
The same should be true for movies. Imagine how many japanese films that won't be released in USA, or Brazilian movies in Europe? African movies in Australia? Why should there be a lock?

Just loosen up, steering committee. Relax and release it all free. I'm sure in the end it'll benefit the whole business.

The only protest I can see would be from the studios that release films. They could always chose to release films region free.

[Archie @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

This is good news but region codes are obsolete anyway. Current DVDs still have them, but the codes have no significance. The hardware players and computers are modified to play all regions, often with simple remote control hack. I trust the same will happen, if Blu-Ray or HD-DVD players will have region controls.

The situation in my home country, Estonia, shows the absurdity of region locks: "officially" it seems still to be in region 5 with the former Soviet countries, but it's a European Union member country and most of DVDs sold here are region 2.

[DanielTS @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

If the region coding is easy to circumvent, it is inefficient and a region free policy is harmless for the studios: consumers win, studios win (no need to invest in an inefficient tool).

But the new high def content protection mechanisms are much more robust than the current DVD CSS, it won�t be easy to break them: consumers won�t buy useless discs.
http://www.cryptography.com/technology/spdc/white_papers.html


Region coding is rather an incentive for hacking: it isn�t a win-win context.

Why not adopt the two-stage launch business model of the book industry: a worldwide launch of the English version of a Harry Potter book and a localized version launch some time later? JK Rowling is rich, very rich! A win-win strategy!

[Mike Dimmick @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

I think the main reason is that hardware manufacturers aren't generally bothering to enforce region coding on DVD any more. In February, I bought a Sony DVD player from Amazon.co.uk which had the region lock disabled out-of-the-box. The box was factory sealed - it didn't look like this was something carried out by Amazon, but by Sony UK themselves.

Unsurprisingly all of the bestselling DVD players at Amazon UK are listed as either 'multi-region' or 'multi-region capable'.

JK Rowling is not a great example as in fact she has different publishers in the UK (Bloomsbury), the US (Scholastic), Canada (Raincoast Books). I think Bloomsbury is also the publisher for Australia and New Zealand, but distribution is contracted out to a local company. The co-ordinated release of the books on the same day is to prevent grey-market imports which would otherwise be enormous!

The grey-import market exists simply because film releases are not co-ordinated across territories. There's no real reason not to do so. Not doing so simply encourages 'screener' downloads. Peter Jackson proved it was possible - all three of the LOTR films were released to cinemas on the same day in the UK and US and within a week across a large part of the rest of the world. IIRC the DVD releases were also co-ordinated.

The PAL/NTSC issue very nearly goes away in the next generation since HDTV in Europe and the US will both be 720p (although PAL-50 countries will use 720/50p and existing 60Hz countries 720/60p). And I suspect that HD sets will be capable of both frame rates.

[Bill Jackson @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

With movies, simple language will control things. Release it in the language of any country at whatever price you like and with zero subtitles.
I will not buy a cheap copy of Star wars in Thai or Korean.
I think this is their plan going forward since costs to make masters have fallen greatly

[Paul Revel @ Dec 19th 2005 2:28AM]

I've been fighting for years to see the back of region coding and this looks like a step in the right direction. However, most manufacturers make it easy for us to hack their machines using handset controller dvd codes. They are obviously aware of the benefits of region free machines regarding sales. Strange how these codes always seem to leak out isn't it?
http://www.dvdexploder.com