Psystar Open Computer notes, benchmarks and video
By Nilay Patel 
posted Apr 30th 2008 4:57PM
posted Apr 30th 2008 4:57PM
- It's running 10.5.2, build 9C31, which is behind the latest Apple build of 9C7010.
- The mobo is a Gigabyte GA-G31M-S2L with an Intel G31 Express chipset. We're not sure which model of Core 2 Duo is in there as of yet.
- The graphics card appears to be an NVIDIA GeForce 8600GT, but it doesn't show up in ASP, so we have to confirm. Psystar's store says it's supposed to be a 256MB card, but we have 512MB -- strange.
- It's LOUD. Crazy loud. OS X doesn't seem to interface with the fan controller, so it runs at full tilt all the time. It doesn't really come across on the video, but it's loud enough so that it's hard to talk on the phone when the machine is running. There's no way we could deal with this thing on a daily basis.
- The DHCP lease drops every fifteen minutes or so and you have to manually renew it in prefs.
- Apple System Profiler doesn't know how to read the configurations of several systems, notably memory and audio. The Audio screen just says there's no built-in audio, while the Memory page returns an error.
- That said, audio works just fine, showing up in prefs as HD Audio Output, and obviously the memory works fine.
- We plugged in a couple cameras, an iPod, and an iPhone, everything worked as expected.
- There's no iMovie or iPhoto out of the box, since iLife doesn't come with Leopard -- you'll have to buy it separately.
- Time Machine seemed to recognize an external HD, but we didn't have time to fully test it out.
- The included copy of Leopard was out of the shrinkwrap, but there's no way to install it -- it shows up in Startup Disk but it won't restart, and it's not recognized at boot.
- Front Row works fine.
- You can grab the entire System Profiler file here, if you're so inclined -- just make sure and share with the group if you notice anything crazy, okay?
As far as benchmarks, it doesn't exactly blow Apple's gear away, but it definitely holds its own -- and the GeForce card just destroys the integrated graphics in the MacBook / Mac mini. Check it out:
- All machines tested with Xbench 1.3.
- All machines tested were using Leopard.
- You can check the bold Xbench scores to compare the cumulative results for each test.
| MBP (2.5GHz Penryn) | MacBook (2.2GHz Core 2 Duo) | iMac (2.4GHz Core 2 Duo, previous gen.) | iMac (3.06GHz Core 2 Duo) | Psystar Open Computer (2.2GHz Core 2 Duo) |
|
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| CPU | 169.23 | 126.66 | 138.58 | 188.54 | 138.89 |
| GCD Loop | 15.33 Mops/s | 13.43 Mops/s | 14.91 Mops/s | 18.90 Mops/s | 13.70 Mops/sec |
| Floating Point Basic | 3.37 Gflop/s | 2.95 Gflop/s | 3.23 Gflop/s | 4.12 Gflop/s | 2.98 Gflop/s |
| vecLib FFT | 3.93 Gflop/s | 3.36 Gflop/s | 3.66 Gflop/s | 4.65 Gflop/s | 3.39 Gflop/s |
| Floating Point Library | 36.64 Mops/s | 17.80 Mops/s | 19.43 Mops/s | 44.76 Mops/s | 24.08 Mops/s |
| Thread Test | 275.13 | 186.4 | 208.77 | 314.45 | 195.42 |
| Computation | 6.93 Mops/s | 3.58 Mops/s | 3.56 Mops/s | 8.50 Mops/s | 3.73 Mops/s |
| Lock Contention | 9.90 Mlocks/s | 8.48 Mlocks/s | 11.06 Mlocks/s | 10.81 Mlocks/s | 8.97 Mlocks/s |
| MBP (2.5GHz Penryn) | MacBook (2.2GHz Core 2 Duo) | iMac (2.4GHz) | iMac (3.06GHz Core 2 Duo) | Psystar Open Computer (2.2GHz Core 2 Duo) |
|
| Memory Test | 168.11 | 150.23 | 150.82 | 211.78 | 146.46 |
| System | 183.01 | 158.95 | 151.56 | 247.04 | 142.68 |
| Allocate | 922.99 Kalloc/s | 856.78 Kalloc/s | 657.80 Kalloc/s | 374.06 Malloc/s | 559.35 Kalloc/s |
| Fill | 7424.09 MB/se | 6480.99 MB/s | 6606.88 MB/s | 9667.21 MB/s | 6585.52 MB/s |
| Copy | 3522.10 MB/s | 2914.92 MB/s | 3014.12 MB/s | 4651.03 MB/s | 2918.53 MB/s |
| Stream | 155.45 | 142.41 | 150.08 | 185.33 | 150.44 |
| Copy | 3059.86 MB/s | 2799.64 MB/s | 2926.68 MB/s | 3653.38 MB/s | 2853.57 MB/s |
| Scale | 3008.89 MB/s | 2797.66 MB/s | 3022.24 MB/s | 3652.08 MB/s | 2888.89 MB/s |
| Add | 3525.00 MB/s | 3196.17 MB/s | 3364.41 MB/s | 4165.23 MB/s | 3484.55 MB/s |
| Triad | 3523.21 MB/s | 3211.97 MB/s | 3328.48 MB/s | 4147.22 MB/s | 3514.66 MB/s |
| MBP (2.5GHz Penryn) | MacBook (2.2GHz Core 2 Duo) | iMac (2.4GHz) | iMac (3.06GHz Core 2 Duo) | Psystar Open Computer (2.2GHz Core 2 Duo) |
|
| Quartz Graphics Test | 198.29 | 154.32 | 193.4 | 228.36 | 213.88 |
| Line | 12.43 Klines/s | 9.69 Klines/s | 11.64 Klines/s | 15.27 Klines/s | 11.00 Klines/s |
| Rectangle | 70.01 Krects/s | 51.66 Krects/s | 70.02 Krects/s | 252.7 Krects/s | 67.11 Krects/s |
| Circle | 15.29 Kcircles/s | 11.54 Kcircles/s | 15.29 Kcircles/s | 16.46 Kcircles/s | 14.73 Kcircles/s |
| Bezier | 4.92 Kbeziers/s | 3.79 Kbeziers/s | 4.51 Kbeziers/s | 5.64 Kbeziers/s | 4.32 Kbeziers/s |
| Text | 12.17 Kchars/s | 10.39 Kchars/s | 12.66 Kchars/s | 15.06 Kchars/s | 41.75 Kchars/s |
| OpenGL Graphics Test | 165.99 | 23.36 | 152.66 | 201.68 | 143.78 |
| Spinning Squares | 210.57 frames/s | 29.64 frames/s | 193.65 frames/s | 255.84 frames/s | 182.39 frames/s |
| User Interface Test | 326.63 | 244.28 | 335.18 | 443.26 | 324.71 |
| Elements | 1.50 Krefresh/s | 1.12 Krefresh/s | 1.54 Krefresh/s | 2.03 Krefresh/s | 1.49 Krefresh/s |
| MBP (2.5GHz Penryn) | MacBook (2.2GHz Core 2 Duo) | iMac (2.4GHz) | iMac (3.06GHz Core 2 Duo) | Psystar Open Computer (2.2GHz Core 2 Duo) |
|
| Disk Test | 33.08 | 39.64 | 80.72 | 78.47 | 70.94 |
| Sequential | 60.60 | 66.07 | 115.15 | 106.39 | 137.51 |
| Uncached Write | 52.17 MB/s [4K blocks] | 53.34 MB/s [4K blocks] | 72.17 MB/s [4K blocks] | 84.32 MB/sec [4K blocks] | 92.61 MB/sec [4K blocks] |
| Uncached Write | 47.88 MB/s [256K blocks] | 47.63 MB/s [256K blocks] | 66.51 MB/s [256K blocks] | 77.36 MB/sec [256K blocks] | 82.91 MB/sec [256K blocks] |
| Uncached Read | 9.89 MB/s [4K blocks] | 10.83 MB/s [4K blocks] | 27.81 MB/s [4K blocks] | 17.43 MB/sec [4K blocks] | 29.79 MB/sec [4K blocks] |
| Uncached Read | 39.17 MB/s [256K blocks] | 49.62 MB/s [256K blocks] | 69.83 MB/s [256K blocks] | 80.85 MB/sec [256K blocks] | 86.51 MB/sec [256K blocks] |
| Random | 22.75 | 28.31 | 62.13 | 62.16 | 47.80 |
| Uncached Write | 0.81 MB/s [4K blocks] | 1.03 MB/s [4K blocks] | 2.67 MB/s [4K blocks] | 2.51 MB/sec [4K blocks] | 1.87 MB/sec [4K blocks] |
| Uncached Write | 18.56 MB/s [256K blocks] | 22.73 MB/s [256K blocks] | 48.45 MB/s [256K blocks] | 62.96 MB/sec [256K blocks] | 34.00 MB/sec [256K blocks] |
| Uncached Read | 0.41 MB/s [4K blocks] | 0.48 MB/s [4K blocks] | 0.63 MB/s [4K blocks] | 0.66 MB/sec [4K blocks] | 0.64 MB/sec [4K blocks] |
| Uncached Read | 18.44 MB/s [256K blocks] | 19.31 MB/s [256K blocks] | 27.08 MB/s [256K blocks] | 28.77 MB/sec [256K blocks] | 28.12 MB/sec [256K blocks] |
Ahh! auto play video!!!
Loud autoplay video.....
Excuse my ignorance but what does Dylan mean by his comment? (no video auto-played for me)
Oh and I'd love to say this is great, but I'd recommend simply buying an iMac instead if you want to ensure a hassle-free experience with guaranteed support, guaranteed integration and built-in audio etc.
Sometimes the lazier, more expensive option is actually a better one. Certainly is in this case in my opinion. And if you can't afford the iMac, save.
Can't the fan be adjusted in the bios? Seems like the CPU is running warm or at least above the 'low' threshold, so just adjust the threshold to be higher. Should have been done from the makers but oh well...
@Neoprimal:
Your right. The OS has nothing to do with fan speed control (in the BIOS based systems at least), nor should they, because the BIOS is perfectly capable of monitoring temps and controlling fan speeds.
Its obvious that Psystar didnt do any modifications to the system, literally dropped in all the parts like any of your corner stores, and loaded a disk image onto your hard drive. That noise could be solved by enabling a simple QFan setting on the MB.
or...
They could have cut sound output by 80% just by using a Scythe Ninja, along with some low rpm fans, which would have added about 50 bucks to the cost of this system.
In which case, screw Psystar. You would end up with a much better system for the same amount of money if you build it yourself, and possibly get it quieter than an iMac.
... or just
BUY A QUIET FAN
go ahead, splurge that extra $5-10
I suggest Vantec or Arctic Silver 12cm fans. A+, low noise. If you're going more "high end" spring for a fan with adjustable settings (ala the Antec Sonata II/III case)
Low noise.
NOW I WANT ONE!!! I thought this psystar ppl weren't legit but now this is really sweet. it should be lower prices tho
Download one of the several OSX86 builds and put it on an existing machine!
I just installed it on my Dell m1330 and I'm pretty sure it's going to stay on there.
I've done it, but if I want more than one it's a lot of work.
Khris i have the same dell laptop, and am having OSx86 install issues...what drivers did you install to get it to run??
its noisy and doesnt work properly, yet you still want it? spend the extra and get a real one
They could still NOT be legit.
Only two reports of OpenMacs being recieved so far (as far as we know)... They could easily be one offs.
With the first report, that could easily be faked by the Psystar people.
With this one, it could be one they've made specially for Engadget so that people think "hey, this seems pretty good and legit. Now I'll buy one" and the Psystar people get more money before doing a runner with everyone's cash.
Unless you work for Engadget or another company that won't lose out too much if you get scammed, I wouldn't buy one... This whole thing is fishy.
bald_gye, i also have the same hardware. give leo4allv2 a go. select vanilla kernel for install, and then if you have boot problems, give it a -f command at start up.. :)
I kinda just realized that what I said was really stupid :)
just spend the little extra money and get a mac mini.
this thing just isnt worth it.
these have much better specs than a mac mini though.
but you cant update it. thats a problem.
and refreshing the DHCP every 15 minutes doesnt sound like much fun.
and having that fan blowing out my ears doesnt sound fun either.
Maybe you can't upDATE it (although I'm sure you can with help online), but at least you can upGRADE it. 8-|
A legit Mac has it's benefits. But I personally am very hungry for an OSx86 type machine. Bang for the Buck, personal involvement with the build, ability to reconfigure hardware, personal gratification; these are some of what I'm hoping to achieve with my own personally built OSX/non-Apple machine. Is the Mac Mini even a worthy comparison? It's more like an internet/media appliance. I might consider it for some sort of Media PC in the living room (no fans/small size), but never for a serious computer. My opinion, I wonder who Psystar's intended customer base is? Anyone who is interested in what I described above will probably just build their own box. Anyone who would be satisfied with a Mac Mini ...will probably just get a Mini.
...Apple may disway me from my OSx86 desires if they decide to sell a mid-level tower. And the ability to perform basic upgrades myself would also be nice. But who am I to ask SJ to release some of his control, just a simple minded replaceable customer. I mean nothing to him.
Just spend about the same and get a faster PC with a video card that has an adjustable fan. A lot of cheap budget video cards like the 8600 dont have fans that throttle down, its probably not OS X's fault in this case, I have a 7600gt that was on 100% speed all the time in Windows or OSX, I had to unplug the damn fan and put a case fan ontop of the video card because it was so insanely loud (its an EVGA 7600gt, gotta give them props for such a horrible product).
OSx86 is fantastic if you have the right hardware. People who have no idea what they are talking about like to put it down but the reality is that it has very little problems and is every bit as capable and stable as OS X on a real mac.
I'm hardcore x86 user and hardcore self system builder. Tried some of the osX86 on my own hardware, but from my point to compare it to real mac is that you wont be able to build a quality comparable system for the less money as to buy a mac. Mac has a simple and tested theory , they sell HW that they know, so they don't have any issues with drivers and other things that windows users suffer from. If Microsoft would build and sell HW like Apple is then windows is pretty stable OS with no flaws. Apple just by doing this makes it very easy for the end user, thats why ppl who tried and worked with apple love it. If you consider to buy a high quality components for x86 system and you go wild with your budget you can use any OS that will run just like a dream with no problems at all, thats all because of the quality drivers the quality HS comes with.
@dreamscape86, That's a *pretty* big assumption since you can't even update the software. Is that upgraded hardware going to be compatible? We'll let you find out (the hard way)...
Why not just put OSX on a real PC if you want OSX? Instead of this cheap pos
Thank you. I can't believe how long it takes that piece of crap to POST. That's what, like 10 seconds before it shows the ram test screen? Any decent modern computer should have an image on the screen in less than three seconds. My two-year-old Dell is almost instantaneous.
Also, what's with software update supposedly not working? Only new release (i.e. 10.5.2. to 10.5.3 ) updates break my hackintosh. Everything else including Security Updates works just fine.
That, combined with the fan noise is unacceptable. These things should've been weeded out in the first prototypes. Most of it, I suspect, would be solved by using a different motherboard.
Agreed. I had a hackintosh running on my custom-built computer for a while and it worked fine - posted a lot faster than the Psystar. The only hitch was that I couldn't get the full power of my Quadro display card (GeForce seems the way the go). All to say, if you do a bit of research you do much better than the Psystar.
It looks as though the monitor (looks like a small HD TV actually) took time to sense the input the computer was using and switch to it. I have an MSI mobo, and the screen that shows up first on the video is the same screen that shows up AFTER the post screen with the mem, CPU and drives on my computer. I don't think the computer was taking terribly long, just the monitor taking awhile to sense input and display an image.
"The DHCP lease drops every fifteen minutes or so and you have to manually renew it in prefs."
That alone seems like a dealbreaker to me.
I guess if you have your computer hooked directly up to your cable modem. But if you use a router there is no real reason to use DHCP anyway.
I had the same problem with my own personal Hackintosh build. I eventually fixed the problem by updating the kext for the SATA controller on my motherboard (an Abit IP-35E using ICH9 controller).
Check out this link to obtain the updated kext:
http://forum.insanelymac.com/index.php?showtopic=88335
You may also want to try some of the solutions found in this thread
http://forum.insanelymac.com/index.php?showtopic=73347&pid=654954&st=120&#entry654954
Fortunately, a lot of problems have been discussed and even resolved at insanelymac.com. Since there is no support from Apple, you will have to rely on community support. Fortunately, there is tons of support out there from a large community.
@shawnmos: One could also say that if you use a router there's no reason to use static addresses, anyway.
um, solving Ethernet issues by updating SATA drivers... that sounds so Windows.
nothing against hackintosh, but on an out of the box machine...
I don't get this at all. Has anyone else ever had this problem with a Hackintosh install ever? Mine certainly doesn't do this.
And the first time you update iTunes or try to install 10.5.x you're going to crash the whole thing. This is such a Mickey Mouse setup it's pathetic. Why wouldn't you just do this yourself at home - they don't seem to have done anything new other than installing OS X before hand. The instructions and guides have been online for a long time.
The plethora or problems you're going to run into with this very hacked setup makes it really impractical.
Haha - mickey mouse.
Mickey is offended...
Yeah I mean if Pystar appeared even half competent at what they do, i wouldnt hate them so much. But I guess thats what you get from people who are clearly just scammers and Im starting to hate engadget and gizmodo for even giving them a second of free press
A normal Hackintosh pc can be better then this. I feel disappointed.
Now, when your hair is wet, you can just plop your OpenComputer over, turn it on, and you'll be blown away with how great the quality of the fan is!
My prediction: Apple does nothing with their legal team to stop this. Instead, they push out OS X software and firmware updates that render this whole setup impossible.
If I was one of the people who were working on the OSx86 project I would be very upset. This Psystar company just effectively closed the door on the whole "Hackintosh" community. I am sure that before Apple was find with some hobbyists messing around.
But now a company is making money off of it, diluting their brand and reputation. People will equate poor performing "Open Computers" with a fault of the OS manufacturer. Just as people equate poor mainstream PC performance with Windows.
As a member of the OSX86 community, I sincerely hope you are wrong.
That being said, I think your analysis of the situation is fairly accurate.
Also, to avert the comments beforehand, let me clarify. Because the OS is the interface of the computer, when there are problems or inconsistencies or errors (i.e. the DHCP error he mentioned in the article, or otherwise) people will equate it with the OS, not with the hardware. They'll identify Microsoft with problems on their Windows PCs and Apple with problems on their "Open Computers" running this hacked OS.
I keep hearing people say that since Psystar did this, it was inevitable for Apple to release a firmware to brick the whole thing, but I think people forget that the OSX86 project has been around since the first intel macs, and Apple must have always known, I mean its pretty common knowledge in the tech community, so why would they all of a sudden brick all of them if the never did before?
You brick it for two reasons. First, OSX86 is a project that people do for kicks, it is not a commercial venture. Your company's entire business model isn't on the line because a couple (even a lot) of hackers mess with their system in their basement.
Second, Apple nearly went out of business (were it not for a GIANT "loan" from Microsoft) because they allowed people to release Mac Clones. They generally had cheaper hardware and a lower quality user experience. This translated to fewer people (the cost-conscious) purchasing Apple from Apple, and others (first-timers) not wanting to try Apple because of all the issues they had.
Apple worked hard to re-define itself as a premium computing experience - not as a simple OS vendor. They make their hardware and software unique to accomplish this goal. Letting another company profit from this with no control over their quality or user experience, and making only the retail price on OSX for each machine sold is corporate suicide. Apple isn't having problems meeting consumer demand, why would they willingly let a company destroy the image they spent billions generating over the last decade through ads, products, the press?
No benefit, extremely high cost. That's why Apple will kill this company in one way or another.
@ MeatyPi
"This Psystar company just effectively closed the door on the whole "Hackintosh" community. I am sure that before Apple was fine with some hobbyists messing around.
But now a company is making money off of it, diluting their brand and reputation. People will equate poor performing "Open Computers" with a fault of the OS manufacturer."
I find the second part to be a pretty strong reason why Apple might now start to re-evaluate their position on the hackintosh movement.
@Brad
I was with you until you regurgitated that big myth that Microsoft "saved" Apple. That is NOT true. At the time that Microsoft agreed to make a $150 million dollar investment (which was sold five years later) in Apple stock, Apple had $1.2 billion dollars in cash, but Steve Jobs needed Microsoft to restart efforts to complete a new version of Office for Mac, which had languished for three years. In turn, Bill Gates wanted Apple to use Internet Explorer as their default browser and to settle several billion dollar patent disputes involving Windows and Quicktime.
Look and Feel Lawsuit: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Computer%2C_Inc._v._Microsoft_Corp.
"In 1997, five years after the lawsuit was decided, all lingering infringement questions against Microsoft regarding the Lisa and Macintosh GUI, as well as Apple's "QuickTime piracy" lawsuit against Microsoft, were settled when Apple agreed to make Internet Explorer the default browser over Netscape, and Microsoft agreed to continue developing Office and other software for the Mac for the next 5 years, and purchased $150 million of non-voting Apple stock."
Canyon Code Theft Lawsuit: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Francisco_Canyon_Company
"Later testimony in the U.S. D.O.J. Microsoft anti-turst trial revealed that, at the time, Apple was threatening Microsoft with a multi-billion dollar lawsuit over the allegedly stolen code, and in return Bill Gates was threatening with the cancellation of Office for the Mac. In August 1997, Apple and Microsoft announced a settlement deal. Apple would drop all current lawsuits, including all lingering issues from the "Look & Feel" lawsuit and the "QuickTime source code" lawsuit, and agree to make Internet Explorer the default browser on the Macintosh unless the user explicitly chose the bundled Netscape browser. In return, Microsoft agreed to continue developing Office, Internet Explorer, and various developer tools and software for the Mac for the next 5 years, and purchase $150 million of non-voting Apple stock. The companies also agreed to mutual collaboration on Java technologies, and to cross-license all existing patents, and patents obtained during the five-year deal, with one another."
Also see: http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0CGN/is_1999_Jan_26/ai_53999515
The other big myth about Apple is that Apple "stole" the GUI from Xerox, when in fact they licensed it, but that's for another discussion. I blame the film "Pirates of Silicon Valley" for the popularity of most of these distortions.
Apple's attempt to stop OSx86 will be just as effective as Microsoft's attempt to stop piracy.
If you're looking at it from a lower cost option, consider the Pystar machine does NOT come with iLife. That's another, what, $80?
Then factor in the ever-running fan and DHCP issues and God knows what other problems will pop up with continued use.
Get yourself a used G5 iMac for less than $700 and be happy.
http://www.powermax.com/parts/show/c-u63765
Oh, and now Pystar's Web page won't load again. That's great customer service/support! I guess you get what you pay for.
Agreed this Psystar computer loses it's price advantage with every day. For one thing, people keep talking about upgrades... okay... what upgrades are you going to give to this Psystar machine? OS X is compatible with only the hardware components that come on existing Macs. It's not like you can throw in some random qual SLI setup in there or a random audio card - it wont work. You can upgrade the memory, but not the hard drive - because they'd have to reinstall the OS.
This myth about upgrading Macs is just that. You can add anything you want either with FW 400 or 800 or expresscard, or swap out memory or hard drives yourself. The video card is the only thing, and who is using Macs for hardcore gaming anyway?
Actually, you could install a new HDD, you would just have to use SuperDuper or Carbon Copy Cloner, clone the patched OS X install over to the replacement drive, and then start up off the new drive.
Yes, you'd have to have both drives installed and working, but it's a lot better than having to send it off to Psystar.
haha, pretty sure anyone who buys this computer is smart enough to download a version of iLife 08 from bittorent
I wouldn't trust Carbon Copy Cloner to work on a hack, will the EFI boot partition still be there and even if it is what is actually going to read it since there is no actual EFI!
It's totally not expecting to be booted from an ancient BIOS :)
OSx86 is for people who want a midrange upgradeable tower. A G5 iMac doesnt exacly fit that bill at all, not to mention how incredibly SLOW a G5 imac is compared to any core 2 duo machine on earth.
The video most likely shows up at 512mb because it's sharing the memory from the bios. But the way it looks from your tests .. i agree with Elijah ..
It's most likely displaying the 512MB due to the hacked drivers used to get the video card working. Also due to the changes in the kernel and hacked smbios file, the system profile is not going to be completely correct.
I just can't wait for some idiot to call apple tech support.
becuase you know it actually will happen. alot.
Yea and I cant wait to see what they say.
engadget should do it and tape the conversation. and then post it. that WOULD be funny.
Actually it's been done by someone in the OSX86 community, as a joke. He keeps trying to explain that he's running OSX on a Compaq and the people keep telling him it's impossible.
You know what if I get time tomorrow expect a tape call to Apple with me complaining Software Update and my Leopard CD doesn't work :)
I'll keep you posted :)
This doesn't exactly sound like a good buying choice. So, it's really loud, runs an older build of OS X, doesn't work with system update and has other issues such as DHCP dropping every 15 mins.
This sounds like a winner. It's nice that they tried, but selling a machine with a ton of bugs isn't exactly going to get people interested in Mac clones.
I'm kind of surprised you even received your machine.
I thought it was worth it but after hearing the fan and seeing that you have to mess with the OS when you get it, nuh uh, hackintosh seems right for me.
It is rather micky mouse and from the mentioned problems is pretty obvious they didn't have time to fix the quirks or retool so that some things would work. Such things happens when all of a sudden no one thinks your legit and your forced to rush things out asap. What did you expect, exactly?
...no one thinks my legit _what_ exactly? leave my legit out of this
my point was they kept changing their address and i read an artical on this website that said, "our advice: don't buy one for now" (which i agree with 100% btw).
This article says they got the first review unit. You figure it out. 1+1=2.
WHOOOOOOOOSH!
1+1 = 2?
Holy crap. How'd you do that?
i also like he turned into a plural version of himself, 'jeffs'. both of him can't spell or take a hint
I have the same DHCP lease problem with my hackintosh on my Asus P5k-e , it just started recently, i think it has something to do with a recent update. Every 30 min to an hour my computer forgets its ip address, and then ends up with a wins ip (169. whatever) It has worked fine for 6 months not sure what has caused it as of recent. In the bios, turning on "wake on lan" seems to help, keeps the card on at the bios level before the os boots
The computer seems fine to me at the $700 price. The video is horrible. The shaking camera makes PsyStar's promo video look professional.
There are some discrepancies between the notes under the video and the video itself.
Why is there no benchmark for a Mac Mini here? This computer is not competing with anyone's laptop and it's not competing in price with anyone's iMac.
Finally, if the internet connection is really as broken as you report, that's unacceptable. I strongly suspect it's not. Waiting anxiously for confirmation on this front.
I was thinking the same thing about the mac mini, I mean the article mentions how it wrecks the graphics on it, but its not on the benchmark list. I think engadget should probably compare it to more closely spec'd machines, because obviously everything except the MB should blow it out of the water.
I LOVE how they included a vacuum cleaner! that's AWESOME! Clean my carpets and code my iPhone at the same time! true multitasking. Thanks PYSTAR!
Well I am no fan of Apple computers, I prefer to be able to build and configure my own hardware etc. and the price is a big deterrent for me.
I like using Linux/Windows, but for the price I may look into getting one of these so I can mess around more with OSX.
I would like to know if the DHCP issue can be solved by setting a static IP? Otherwise its still pretty cool.
Of course it's cool, the fan is so loud you can't hear somebody talking right next to you. I'd be pretty surprised if it was hot.
And Alan, if you don't mind me pointing this out, you say you prefer to build and configure your own hardware, then you go on to say you may look into getting one of these.
Um, really? You don't see how the second statement negates the first one? A prebuilt computer is a prebuilt computer, whether you get it from Psysuck or Apple. If you want to spend $700 to mess around with OS X... why don't you just get a Mac Mini? Guaranteed not to make your ears bleed, and you can keep it updated because it doesn't violate Apple's EULA for OS X. Imagine that.
All I was saying is that while I do prefer to build my own machines, for the price compared to an Apple computer its may be worth it.
It may be worthwhile to pay 550$ for a copy of an OS and a pre-built machine guaranteed to run it then to try assembling such a machine myself.
Which by the way would violate the EULA anyway as a custom machine built by myself is not an "Apple branded computer".
Also I said I was going to "look into it" not that I had ordered one, so how did my second comment negate the first one?
Because if you stayed true to your first statement you wouldn't be looking into it at all. The Psystar machine is guaranteed to run OS X badly, with a lot of the functions inaccessible or not working, and you won't be able to update OS X. Did you even read the article or look at the benchmarks?
An actual Mac is guaranteed to run OS X as it was designed to run, something no other company, software or hardware, can say. For somebody who is perfectly willing to drop $550 on a psystar mickey mouse ball and twine hack Mac that only sort of works just so you can play around with OS X, it seems ignorant on your part to not even consider getting an actual Mac for $600.
An actual Mac that is fully supported by Apple, does not sound like a lear jet taking off, will work with system updates and is capable of showing you how OS X works in the context in which it was built. Are you really going to degrade your potential OS X experience to the tune of 50 bucks just on principle? It's like cutting off your nose to spite your face.
By getting a Psystar machine, you're creating a decidedly non-genuine user experience in order to experience OS X. How does that make any sense, especially when the price difference between the fake Mac and a real one is what most people would call negligible?
Please take your pissing match elsewhere. I'm sure you can go back and forth over email to your hearts' content.
Its rather funny, but most of the concerns you listed there do not concern me. As far as Engadget has shown the only issue is with renewing your DHCP lease. That would not be an issue as you could just use a static IP.
If I can save myself 150$ and buy a "hackintosh" that works for me. I would never use Apple's tech support as it defeats the purpose of learning about the machine if I can't research my issues. Also I said I was going to look into it so I still do not see the validity of your point.
I have used all systems and developed software on all platforms (Unix, Linux, Windows, Apple (OSX)). I am no fanboy and if Apple puts out a cheap (sub 600$) platform I may look into it.
Regardless noise isn't an issue when my main rig has at least 10 fans in it and I have two servers next to me in a rack (a 4u and a Pedestal).
Still it is interesting to see what Apple will do about Psystar.
Hi Brad,
I am glad you decided to declare a short discussion in the comments of an article a pissing match. Would you like to join in? Make it a three way pissing match? I am glad you could inject you own two cents just like myself and Zak.
I will remember that according to you a pissing match is when two people put 4 comments up replying to each others points. I thought the limit was larger as I see a lot of "pissing matches" according to Brad on Engadget.
Alan, I think you're splitting hairs. First of all it's a $50 difference, not $150. Second, you say cheap is sub-$600 - the Mac Mini is $599. You don't really have a leg to stand on with the cost argument, because a $50 difference when buying a computer is generally negligible.
Your arguments just smell like Apple avoidance is all. And I mean you can avoid Apple all you want, but don't try to pass it off as a cost thing, or a "these obvious flaws, EULA violations, myriad issues, and only semi-functional OS X installment really don't bother me" thing. If all you really wanted to do was play around, the obvious choice would be a Mac Mini for nearly the same price as the Psystar box, since the Mini is fully supported and not hacked. And it's also a Core2Duo. It even has Firewire. And it can run Boot Camp flawlessly, just like any other Mac - but not the Psystar box.
And I'm not talking about Apple support, I'm talking about things like how on the Psystar box the system profiler can't read all the information, it has to fake being a different model, it's a hack. And not a very good one.
Definitely a mickey mouse version of OSx86 - the issues mentioned (DHCP, fan noise) are the most common ones you'll find in the support forums over there. Which means that you'll never be able to update this thing without breaking OSX. What a complete waste of time and money.
I am sooo tempted to buy one of these, but I'll wait to see how software update and other stufff works...
Plus maybe wait a few months to see if they are sued to hell by Apple, and my "support" goes to hell with them, or if Apple starts a cat and mouse game of software updates that brick it.
Man, get a stand for your camera.
That's probably the most off topic sentence I've read this month...
Woot anyway!
i thought it was her mom running for prez?
i keed
44 comments and no one's pointed out the shitty bench scores for the psyops yet?
wait.......did you count all the posts?
as if this thing is going to work 3 months down the track, you will be stuck with 10.5.2 - updates will most probably cause more problems etc..
as if an imac is expensive anyways.. in Australia, I purchased a 24" imac 2.4ghz with 4gb ram for a mere $2600. Sure this thing is cheaper, but it aint worth the time when it starts to give you problems..
if you cant afford a mac, you probably don't need one.. go buy a dell and play computer games.
in Soviet Russia, I purchased a Big Mac for a month's salary
So is this fan louder than the 360 fan?
Couldn't tell
What's so funny about .MAC? i Love it!
what's so funny about the name Biggus Dickus?
That's Major Biggus Dickus to you!
I would never buy one of these. Just out of interest I looked at the source code of PsyStars website and in their meta tags they actually include: hackintosh, insanelymac, osxfree86project, osx8
lol
I run OSx86 on my Dell laptop, and really - the only thing it cost me was $14 to swap out my Intel card with a Broadcom.
With that being said, I would never fork out hard earned cash towards a computer that could be utilized to an Apple desktop/laptop; when OSX is what I wanted.
This Psystar computer is going to have problems, those at the OSx86 community know that it isn't a long-term solution. For me, it'll allow me to run Mac programs without having to go through the hassle of selling a great laptop for the time being.
In the end, if you want a Mac -- just end up spending a little bit more money and buy a damn Macintosh.
I wish Apple would open up their OSX operating system, but in all reality I don't see that happening for a long, LONG time.
"With that being said, I would never fork out hard earned cash towards a computer that could be utilized to an Apple desktop/laptop; when OSX is what I wanted."
zuh?
Ha, what I mean is: I wouldn't spend money on something that could be utilized on the real thing, an authentic Mac. IF, running OSX was my main priority.
I have:
a. two college degrees
b. no idea what you're trying to say
With that mobo you can lower and control fan speed in the bios...
Heh. I just installed OSx86 on my old rig for shits and giggles, and it seems to run about this well. Sure, the GMA865/P4 Prescott combo isn't a powerhouse, but at least the internets/fans work like they're supposed to.
Seriously, Psystar, thanks. You may have just killed OSx86 and ruined the fun of nerds worldwide.
Mmmmh they didn't use nvinject, that probably why the graphics card shows up a nvidia geforce.