Nintendo thwarting Wii modders with epoxy-locked chips; Wii Backup Loader abandoned

A double shot of bad news for the Wii hacking set today -- not only do new Wiis appear to have a modchip-proof layer of epoxy around the DVD-ROM IC chips, Waninkoko has abandoned the Wii Backup-Loader project. The modchip news isn't all that surprising -- Ninty's been fighting a losing battle against chip devs for a while now, and gluing things down with epoxy is a logical solution -- but Waninkoko quitting is a bit of a shock, since we just caught wind of the Wii Backup-Loader a few days ago. Apparently he's not happy that it was leaked this morning, so he's dropping it, but surely an outpouring of affection in comments will change his mind.

[Thanks, Linh T]

Read - New Wiis have epoxy-locked DVD-ROM chips
Read - Waninkoko abandons Wii Backup-Loader

[CAHLITO @ Sep 19th 2008 12:07PM]

Aww shucks. Then again, it doesnt really matter seeing how I NEVER used my Wii in the first place. Wii sucks. I regret buying it, and I cant wait for X-Mas 08 so I can sell that shit on Ebay

[Trev @ Sep 19th 2008 12:13PM]

same gonna see if i convice my bro its worth swapping for his ps3 lol

[From My Cube @ Sep 19th 2008 12:18PM]

I voted you up even though youll probably summed to Lowest Rank...I bought mine in April...played the hell out of wii sports and then....its done nothing but sit there... I just dont no if this is a great thing that it appears on the front to be...


its a novelty, people buy it in droves becasue it is fun for a little bit...but look at the attachment rant for the Wii

[Ray-- @ Sep 19th 2008 12:33PM]

i was in the same boat as you guys... then i got Mario Kart.... man that game is a blast... especially online. saved my wii from ebay really.

[jimmy @ Sep 19th 2008 12:41PM]

hmm perhaps i can get more than $250 for my modded d2b paperweight on ebay now

[pezhore @ Sep 19th 2008 12:44PM]

I think the common misconception is that the Wii is supposed to be anything but a party console. The single player stuff is ok, but really its not the graphics or the games that makes the Wii... its the interaction with others playing and the unique interface. If you bought the Wii as an alternative to an Xbox 360 or a *shudder* PS3, then I think you should have done more research into the Wii's target demographic.

[Michael Chastain @ Sep 19th 2008 1:25PM]

"but look at the attachment rant for the Wii"

The attach rate that's higher than the PS3 and increasing faster than either the PS3 or 360? The Wii sold more software in its first 19 months than any console in history. It's a myth that the Wii doesn't sell software.

Yes, we know the Wii is not a big hit with hardcore gamers. That doesn't mean it sucks, it's just got a different target market.

[eddy @ Sep 19th 2008 1:40PM]

I seem to have to say this in every Wii-related thread on here, just to balance out the anti-Wii vitriol, but...

I use my Wii every day. Whether I'm using Wii Fit (which I use, without fail, every weekday morning before work) or playing games, I'm still using it whenever I get a chance. I can't be the only person who actually enjoys their Wii AND plays it frequently.

[thefebus @ Sep 19th 2008 1:52PM]

I never thought I'd see the day where I heard a person who bought a Wii say that it sucks.

[MichaelD @ Sep 19th 2008 3:03PM]

Wii is great for casual gamers and party gaming. But that's certainly not all it's good for.

One, there's more to a game's visual effect than graphics. I can play N64 games like Ocarina of Time and still feel the visual effect even with rudimentary graphics. In the same way, even though Wii's graphics are nothing compared to 360 and PS3, you've got beautiful games like Twilight Princess. Obviously, 360 and PS3 have this too, but I'm just saying that Wii's lesser graphics are not crippling.

Two, Nintendo has a great legacy of games. Nostalgia is a big deal for people who grew up on NES. And the Wii pays tribute to its older games very well, something Xbox (which is too new) and Playstation (which doesn't really have any exclusive flagship characters) can't do.

Three, the motion sensing is, IMO, simply a good way to make a controller. Even if it's not virtual reality per se, shaking the wiimote is actually more natural than pushing a button sometimes.

I may sound like a little kid pushing these games, but sometimes beating someone up with Kirby in Brawl can be just as enjoyable as getting a headshot in COD. Video games are made for fun, which Nintendo specializes in. Granted, most "hardcore gamers", as the term is used would not enjoy a system like Wii. But that doesn't mean it's all married couples and little kids who like Wii.

[Ozzman_79 @ Sep 19th 2008 4:39PM]

I love all these guys that say the Wii sucks and how they never use it, yet they still have them and haven't sold them. Do you normally keep stuff that sucks and you don't use sitting around your house? He's an amazing idea, if you don't like it and don't use it. SELL IT. Plenty of people out there are clamouring to find them. You can probably make a killing selling it. I have my Wii and 13 games and play it quite regularily, as does my girlfriend, my brother, some of my co-workers and many of my friends. As for the comments about attach rates, obviously some people don't read the monthly sales figures released by NPD every month because they clearly state, for the US at least, the Wii has a higher attach rate then the PS3.

[Heinz @ Sep 19th 2008 4:54PM]

Dude, everyone has tons of stuff laying around that we don't use and don't have time to sell.
I play with my wii whenever my wife's' parents come over, or her cousins, and guess what? That is the target market, spoiled kids and old people. Its not a next generation console, its a gamecube with next generation input devices. It like the Nintendo 3.5. Don't get me wrong sometime I gotta play tennis.

[BigD145 @ Sep 19th 2008 12:08PM]

Does this mean you can't send in a defective Wii to Nintendo for repairs?

[Greg @ Sep 19th 2008 12:13PM]

Yup, that's exactly what this means. Nintendo won't warranty a Wii anymore because they voided the warranty by blocking modding attempts. Clearly.

[BigD145 @ Sep 19th 2008 1:34PM]

Hey, I just don't see them making repairs on that particular chip anytime soon. Nintendo will have to suck up the costs of replacing the entire board.

[Pete @ Sep 19th 2008 3:48PM]

It is far more likely that they have a solvent specific to that epoxy if they ever have to replace chips on the board. Then again, it may just be cost effective for them to recycle the board and replace it rather than replacing single one-off chips on the board (I'd say this is very likely).

[Trev @ Sep 19th 2008 12:13PM]

lol like most devs he seams to have the cry baby mentalitly "someone else released it first wah!!!". maybe his own fault for testing it with someone not trust worthy... tbh prolly good that its been abandoned otherwise every wii/ds homebrew site i go to would be flooded with iso requests :(

[Jake Tobak @ Sep 19th 2008 1:02PM]

Yah, I hate people like that. Really immature, makes me want to beat some sense into him :P
Stop being a ***** and finish your ******* code.
They do this cause they want attention and to feel powerful. They stop coding and people beg them to keep working on it and then they tell them how much they love them and how kewl they are, well I don't do that, you're just being a *****.
SUCK IT UP AND GET TO WORK!

[drb @ Sep 20th 2008 1:10AM]

Jake: "Really immature" ... "SUCK IT UP AND GET TO WORK!"

yes, because maturity is acting like Waninkoko owes you something. because maturity is being cool and using *'s to replace curse words name calling. and because maturity is judging his/her motives for abandoning this project. i wonder what you'd do if your work was unfairly released from some sleazeball you trusted and had to deal with the consequences.

[Matthew Nawrocki @ Sep 19th 2008 12:14PM]

Damn... no Wii Backup Loader? I wonder if we could obtain source code or reverse engineer the software?

[Anarkie @ Sep 19th 2008 4:05PM]

Are you reading? IT'S BEEN LEAKED. This means you simply go to the scene sights and find a copy for download.

Waninkoko is simply pissed that one of his beta testers (Beta, as in final test stage) has released imperfect code, which he probably wanted to perfect before releasing. This I understand, and for all the turd sandwiches out there (Not you Matthew, you seem grateful for a chance at this code) calling him a baby or saying he took too long...get real. Code your own work and tell he how it goes.

[Vidikron @ Sep 19th 2008 4:16PM]

@Anarkie

Whether a person can code or not is pretty much irrelevant to the fact he is in fact acting like a spoiled brat over a leak. What's the point of just quitting because it was leaked early? What did he lose? And isn't a bit hypocritical to be crying over a leaked piece of software that itself was destined to be used to pirate retail software by the vast majority of its users?

[telepheedian @ Sep 19th 2008 12:14PM]

Props to Waninkoko for stopping work on the loader, although I get the feeling somebody's going to continue it.

[dataminer49er @ Sep 19th 2008 12:16PM]

Better living through epoxy.

[rock99rock @ Sep 19th 2008 12:17PM]

Dont back out dude. Your name is still associated with the hack. Keep to it and keep supporting it.

"I just wanna say good luck, we're all counting on you."

[AtOurGates @ Sep 19th 2008 12:17PM]

"Modchip-Proof" is probably a bit strong. "Dremel Requiring" might be a better descriptor. Hell, the little parts are already so tiny that you're better off taking your wii to a "professional" than trying to install anything yourself, and I'll be that the good professionals will soon be able to work around the epoxy situation.

[Joe H @ Sep 19th 2008 12:21PM]

The main this will do is not stop it entirely, but make it more difficult. As I understand it, there was a clip-on modchip released, that all you had to do was open up the Wii and push it onto that chip, so now that's impossible.

[7on @ Sep 19th 2008 12:27PM]

Yeah, thar be nay way t' avast th' modders - but make th' only way t' mod a Wii very expensive be one way Nintendo can keep modded Wiis ou' o' th' general public.
Ya scurvy dog!

[kal326 @ Sep 19th 2008 3:38PM]

Our you could just look for an older Wii to mod, like mine ;-). Good job Nintendo, thanks for raising the resale value of my, now much easier to mod then new, Wii.

[Jason Litka @ Sep 19th 2008 12:23PM]

I don't have a Wii, so I don't really know what this is all about, but assuming that modding a Wii involves that chip, can't you just remove the epoxy? I mean, you should be able to heat or soften it with chemicals and then just peel it off.

[jefffaucher @ Sep 19th 2008 12:37PM]

Epoxy will not soften when heated, it is not a "plastic" material, it is a thermoset.

[Jason Litka @ Sep 19th 2008 12:51PM]

Then there's more than one kind of "epoxy" as the stuff I've worked with will soften when a heat gun is used or when acetone (or oven cleaner) is brushed on top.

[Steven522 @ Sep 19th 2008 12:25PM]

Maybe if the hackers/modders put all that effort into developing an open-source console platform we would have something really nice.

[Joe @ Sep 19th 2008 12:29PM]

have they tried the heat gun technique used in the xbox 360 technique, where they heated the epoxy and it peeled off with a pen knife, or did i miss something and this is a totally different epoxy.

just a suggestion..

[Chad @ Sep 19th 2008 12:55PM]

Even if they created the greatest, most advanced, cutting edge open source console they would find it near impossible to get an ISV to develop on it. Programs like word processors and spreadsheets once they reach a certain maturity can be used repeatedly to do the tasks they were created to do but except for a few notable exceptions game software gets "stale". Game houses usually can't charge for support of their product due to the backlash it would cause whereas other types of software routinely charge for support contracts. Without some form of DRM most game houses would just say no.

[John @ Sep 19th 2008 1:01PM]

open source console, like, say a computer?

[Steven522 @ Sep 19th 2008 2:53PM]

Actually, for what the modders are attempting to do for homebrew and "backup" discs, an open source console would be nothing but homebrew and the "backup" disc play would fall under the emulation category. So again, if they would only direct all that energy...

[chefgon_ign @ Sep 19th 2008 12:27PM]

Can anything good possibly come of a Backup Loader anyway? I mean, if you're modding in order to play homebrew, that's one thing. If you're just blatantly stealing games, then that isn't really an endevor worth supporting in the first place.

Unless I am misunderstanding the point of the Backup Loader. Is there anything legitimate that can be done with it?

[ydoesithurtweniwii @ Sep 19th 2008 12:35PM]

playing backups is legitimate if you bought the original and made a backup to play instead of the original. someone would do this if they have kids who play a lot of wii and throw the discs around - so it's really simply protecting your investment. of course nintendo would rather you buy a new copy if your kids scratch up the old one but that's crazy talk.

[Pfanne @ Sep 19th 2008 12:44PM]

why would i need a modchip if i steal games?

[humps @ Sep 19th 2008 12:52PM]

Thank you, precisely the point. It is one thing to report a hacking attempt being leaked or abandon. Suggesting some warmth in the comments will bring that project back is clearly not on! Say what you will, that so called backup loader is clearly for illegal copies/downloads.

The irony is, the guy was not happy _probably_ (my own speculation) because he was going to get a buyer for his work and now it was leaked! He was gonna be paid for his software that lets people to steal other's software!

[I'm paid at work because decent people PAY for the software I wrote]

[ydoesithurtweniwii @ Sep 19th 2008 3:41PM]

@humps
well, being 'clearly for illegal copies/downloads' doesn't mean there aren't legitimate uses. Smoking, for example, is clearly bad for you yet there are a few arguable benefits that keep it from being illegal or banned.

and how is it clearly for downloads? how you get the backup is moot.

[pezhore @ Sep 19th 2008 12:29PM]

This seems a bit unprecedented... pouring epoxy all over your drive board can't be good for cooling/other stuff. Has anyone seen this kind of broad stroke attempt to stop piracy anywhere else?

[Christian Walters @ Sep 19th 2008 12:46PM]

Yup, the newer Xbox 360 consoles have the same thing.

[Michael R @ Sep 26th 2008 11:45AM]

Epoxy was added to General Instruments (Motorola) videocipher decoders in an attempt to stop satellite TV piracy. Their epoxy attempt didn't stop piracy, It only slowed it down very slightly.

[Platinum_Skeet @ Sep 19th 2008 12:30PM]

I just feel bad for the guy that worked hard on this just to be leaked by a team member before the final testing was complete. Same thing happened in the PSP community when Pandora's battery was made...

[Brett @ Sep 19th 2008 12:32PM]

ROFL, blah blah, the usual homebrew drama from the hackers. Honestly, are they *all* hormonal 12-year-olds, or do they just like to act like it?

[ydoesithurtweniwii @ Sep 19th 2008 12:43PM]

actually I think he's being very smart by distancing himself from the project before too much attention is paid to it - ninty isn't going to be happy about it and might try to pursue the creators.

[Brett @ Sep 19th 2008 12:56PM]

Except that Nintendo was already well aware this project was being worked on. Otherwise he wouldn't have bothered with the grandiose announcement and screenshots.

No, this is the usual homebrew temper tantrum. Someone gave away a beta, and so now he's taking his ball and going home.

And for the record, a) I'm a homebrew developer myself, and b) I strongly discourage piracy. I'm just reacting to yet another instance of a whiny homebrew primadonna.

[ydoesithurtweniwii @ Sep 19th 2008 3:16PM]

i might agree with you except this latest development was a breakthrough which effectively 'ups the ante' on the damage it can do to software sales.