It's not as if these displays haven't gotten plenty of attention, with Apple's 30-inch
Cinema Display
showing up in a category of its own in 2004, and Dell's
UltraSharp 3007WFP causing quite a bit
of excitement at CES this year, but CNET figured they'd face off these two displays just to show they still care. Hate
to spoil it for you, but Apple's offering does win by a slim margin, due to its more accurate and vivid color, along
with its better grayscale differentiation. But the $300 cheaper 3007WFP held its own, with more input options and
better text performance. We guess it all comes down to whether you're going to be scanning Excel spreadsheets or
scanning for headshots, but it looks like both displays have plenty to offer.
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Kunal @ Mar 25th 2006 10:31AM
I bought the DELL 30" about a month after it was released. At that point it was selling on the Dell Canada website for $1999 with a one year advanced exhcange warranty. I subsequently recieved a 30% off coupon in the mail from Dell and ended up paying C$ 1399 (US $1200). The Apple display costs C$2999. Although I agree that the Apple display is more pleasing aesthetically. There is no doubt that Dell is a better value. Additionally the Dell 30" goes for C$1499 at the end of every financial quarter. I don't know of anyone who could justify purchasing the Apple 30" with a price difference like that.
Jonathan F @ Mar 25th 2006 10:35AM
I would argue that if you're going to drop a lot of money on a 30" display, it had better be good-looking. The Dell isn't bad, but you can tell where they cut costs.
Also, if you're a visual artist (graphic designer/photographer/video editor), colour is everything. These people will find good colour on a 2560x1600 LCD very valuable.
Ken R @ Mar 25th 2006 10:38AM
Their text test was a bit unfair in my mind. Apple's display shouldn't need to anti-alias text because the Mac OS does that internally. I think the Apple display should win for showing the true output in round two, and not taking antialiasing into its own hands.
soundboy64 @ Mar 25th 2006 10:43AM
This is my two cents, do what you please with it... If you're buying a 30in display, you better do something a little more exciting that excel spreadsheets.... ha!
zorg @ Mar 25th 2006 11:00AM
I've had the Apple 30" display for about a year. I wish I could afford a second one. Someone else at my office has a pair working off the same system. The Apple 30" is the second or third most significant gadget I've ever purchased. (The first was my very first laptop.) I have been burned by Dell before, and am reluctant to try again.
Some Mars Orbiter photographs released this week (http://hiroc.lpl.arizona.edu/first_images/) show that the team is viewing on Apple 30" monitors, so it seems that, in contrast to Kunal's post, there are people who can justify the $100 price difference. By the way, $2,999? It isn't even that much at the Apple store! There, you can find it for $2,499. My academic price is $2,299 from Apple. Dell's price is $2,199 today. I applaud those very, very few who have success with coupons (I haven't).
Mutiny32 @ Mar 25th 2006 11:13AM
Correct me if I'm wrong, but, aren't they the same panel?
Tom @ Mar 25th 2006 11:16AM
Zorg. $2999 CANADIAN. If you read his post correctly, you would have realized that he is Canadian, and you should know things usually cost more up here, because our dollar is a little weaker than the US dollar.
Echo_ @ Mar 25th 2006 11:42AM
dell canada sold this monitor for US $1250 last week
Jarmayn @ Mar 25th 2006 11:55AM
Lol it would be nice to have one of those bad boys, but then again even a 15%uFFFD laptop screen is 2 big, and a 17%uFFFD desktop screen I think is 2 big, imagine 30 inches! Its gonna like ruin your eyes! But is the quality diminished since its so big with the refresh rate? Even tho the apple one is more expensive I%uFFFDd still choose that cuz it looks better, and Apple is just better than dell :)
MS @ Mar 25th 2006 12:22PM
I was thinking that the dell was going to be win since I have heard so much about it. I am amazed that after 2 years the Apple Display is able to still hold it own against a display that was released this year. Go Apple.
jakem @ Mar 25th 2006 12:34PM
#3. Dell have also worked with NVidia to give you more control over the monitor settings through the video driver so you could equally say that Dell should have won if the colour settings were tweaked. In fact, this should have been highlighted in the article as there is a potentially bigger market for these monitors for use with PCs than with Macs.
JSForbes @ Mar 25th 2006 12:42PM
Seems to me like Cnet was grasping at straws trying to determine the better product. They both look really really good to me.
TheSkinsFactory @ Mar 25th 2006 12:42PM
I'm sorry but i refuse to go by one person's opinion from C|Net. I've seen both in person and i have the Dell 30" and hands down its a better display. They both use the LG panel only Dell's uses the newer version of it. The Dell is brighter and has better contrast. There is also a lot more to digital graphics then photo and print. For web-based graphics and user interface design, the Dell IMHO is way better. So to say graphic artists are better off with the Apple is ridiculous.
zorg @ Mar 25th 2006 12:45PM
I visited www.dell.com JUST NOW, entered 3007WFP in the search box in the upper right corner, the very first hit returned a price of $2,199. I am so sick of Dell Loss Leader price scams by now, that I don't waste an hour looking for coupons that get rejected. I don't believe in the fairytale price of $1,250 USD.
On the other hand, I apologize for not noticing the Canadian/US thing since I live close to the border and usually am sensitive to that difference.
CBG @ Mar 25th 2006 1:25PM
Apple got pwned
Geqxon @ Mar 25th 2006 1:39PM
Jonathan F, I guess you mean that Dell cuts the cost at the absurd "design" margin that Apple is giving you?
I think the Dell design is way better, the border around the screen is way smaller / smaller looking.
Don't be fooled by the picture. If it was a 20" display, the border / display ratio would be okay. But for a 30" display, the border / display ratio is way to much. The Dell display hides this by making the border black, but with Apple, its all metal.
carol79 @ Mar 25th 2006 2:20PM
Dell has a history of using panels with high refreshes and low viewing angles.
floydcash @ Mar 25th 2006 2:24PM
Dell wins because it has a black border. Nothing screams contrast like a bright silver border.
Craig @ Mar 25th 2006 2:26PM
i'm thinking about upgrading to the 2407wfp from my 2405fpw (primarily for the hdcp support), but i can't get over how ugly the silver back is. anyone see this thing in person? is it really that bad?
Anon @ Mar 25th 2006 2:33PM
Apple won 3 out of 5 rounds and yet price isn't one of the rounds?
bias right there.
I really wonder how much money Apple pays C|Net. I personally know someone whose company pays C|Net all the time to get better reviews and more frontpage real estate...those "More Stories" that you see right beneath the five-tab flash.
Screen Deep @ Mar 25th 2006 2:46PM
Number #7: "Correct me if I'm wrong, but, aren't they the same panel?"
Well, yes, but that doesn't mean much. There is also
- Choice of glass
- Choice of lamps
- Choice of chipset
Effectively, turning the same panel into significantly different screens.
o rly @ Mar 25th 2006 2:48PM
wow, cnet likes an Apple product more? that's unheard of.
Better off hoping Anandtech does a review.
Fergus Hammond @ Mar 25th 2006 3:05PM
#13s comment is incorrect. Apple updated their 30" display in November (same part number though) and now its specs are the same as the Dell display. I've seen the old one and the new one and there's a noticable difference. I haven't yet seen the Dell display but I'm sure it's very nice. It's also very, very cheap: most companies would pay about $1700 US for one.
Cnet did get one thing wrong: they said that the Dell display has two DVI ports but according to Dell's Web site, it's only got one. I wish more displays had two DVI ports; I can only think of a couple that do.
Eli @ Mar 25th 2006 3:38PM
#24, there may have been a bit of a miscommunication there. It has a dual-link DVI port, not dual DVI ports.
If they actually said dual DVI that just continuies to prove everyone's point that Cnet doesn't know what they're talking about.
tim @ Mar 25th 2006 3:41PM
I was walking in to the Apple store yesterday with a vague intention of purchasing the 30" display. But when I saw it I actually mistook it for an Imac... that's how obtrusive the bezel is. I own a powerbook and a dell inspiron, I am not biased, but this display is just too "obvious", for lack of a better word. I played with it for half an hour and could not get beyond the distracting case. This is one situation where brushed aluminum is a nusiance and boring black plastic would be preferred. Just my personal take, no bashing intended.
Alex @ Mar 25th 2006 3:56PM
Every other day cnet does a "why not to buy an ipod" or "better nano alternatives" or something to that extent. So saying apple pays cnet for better reviews is actually quite dumb. They both perform great, but apple has a slight advantage i guess.
AnnDee @ Mar 25th 2006 4:55PM
#16
did you even read it?
Ken R @ Mar 25th 2006 5:46PM
this argument is totally pointless!
jbstingray @ Mar 25th 2006 5:57PM
Tim, it is Anodized, not Brushed aluminum.
Also, the Apple Cinema Display is well known for the bezel being less obrusive in dual monitor-type layouts because there is not a solid black line between the two. The bezels on the Dell and the Apple are comperable - seeing both, they are the same +/- a few mm's.
As obtrusive as an iMac? The bezel on an iMac (not to mention the chin) are HUGE in comparison, and white. You have NO IDEA what you are talking about.
The Dell is nice, but a 30" display is not for a person who is reading word doc's, they are creative professionals that need accuracy and precision in the colors, lines, and text they are working with.
Again, Dell just cheapens up the design, tosses in some features that make it 'better.' They are better for the run-of-the-mill user, but an owner of a 30" display wants the BEST, and Dell, as we all know, will never be best, just a great value.
Apple, on the other hand, is not know for always having the best value. Thank god for the iLife suite or Mac's would be really overpriced. The Cinema Displays are slightly more, but you get solid, aluminum construction, rather than a cheap plastic enclosure, and asthetics to die for.
Tim, before you make a post, read the review, and we aren't impressed by your supposed claims to buy an Apple 30" display, that you know nothing about in the first place.
K MAN @ Mar 25th 2006 6:08PM
TheSkinsFactory, CNET is right. I have both displays, and when I do a Pantone - Spider Calibration(pantone is the industry standard for color) on both displays, Apple's display matches the pantone color swatches better.
However, this doesn't mean that apple's display is a better value. I would certainly buy another Dell before paying twice as much for another apple, since the quality difference is less than significant.
Don Wilson @ Mar 25th 2006 6:23PM
Since I'm a web dev I would be more inclined to get the Dell 3007WFP.
PatrickQG @ Mar 25th 2006 6:25PM
We have one of the 30" Dells at work in purchasing (going to be used as a display hanging on a wall somewhere) and that bezel is as noticeable as the Apple one. Seriously... it's got a great silver bit along the top and bottom. If you're using one of them you just aren't going to notice it.
The Apple bezel really isn't that large. Mistaking it for an iMac. Yeah, right.
jbstingray @ Mar 25th 2006 6:49PM
Thank you, Patrick! I totally agree!
Also, TheSkinsFactory, they have the same contrast ratio, so the contrast couldn't be better on the Dell, it is something called Industry Standards.
creamedcow @ Mar 25th 2006 7:53PM
I think some of you need to learn what contrast is and when there can be too much of it. carol79, a black border provides way too much contrast than a medium gray one. It's fine for TVs where your eyes is generally fixed and one is seated afar, but up close, and while moving constantly to and from the display, the black border just hurts the eyes from too much contrast.
Hawkman @ Mar 25th 2006 9:21PM
Brushed metal for me! I find it less noticeable, possibly because I'm used to my PowerBook. Also, the Dell has a fat backside...
Of course, I'm not fussy, and if anyone would like to gift me either of these monitors, I will happily welcome it into my home, and read it bedtime stories.
iomatic @ Mar 25th 2006 9:27PM
18% gray, color fidelity... Oh forget it! Buy a Dell and be happy with it knowing its inferior components saved you some cash in the short term...
I give up.
:) Not really.
SOCOMRAIDER @ Mar 25th 2006 9:49PM
The LCD panels are basically the same. Like the report said, even if the panels are the same, it is the engineering that goes into it. You can also take into account the flexibility of the two. Which goes hands down to DELL. But for construction you have to go with Apple. The anodized aluminum looks better to me than black plastic, no matter how dense the plastic is. Plus to mention that the Apple one gives you not only more USB ports, but added FireWire ones as well.
But when it is all said and done, it comes down to what you want. More flexibility or better construction with better color reproduction out the box. Also maybe the warranty (including dead pixels, etc).
Plus not to forget, there are third party apps to control the Apple display's colors, etc. Since most of the Apple display is controlled by the computer and not the button interface on the front.
Aleks @ Mar 25th 2006 10:00PM
I wouldn't mind having a 30" in my setup:
http://static.flickr.com/18/89209213_3e28e3382f_o.jpg
Although, the 23" is doing good by me for over a year now.
mike @ Mar 25th 2006 10:05PM
I really wonder how much money Apple pays C|Net. I personally know someone whose company pays C|Net all the time to get better reviews and more frontpage real estate...those "More Stories" that you see right beneath the five-tab flash.
---
You know you're grasping at straws when you claim CNET is pro-Apple.
Ever heard of the iPod.. CNET publishes anti-iPod articles on a weekly basis...
play free games @ Mar 25th 2006 10:16PM
I've had a chance to use the Apple 30" for a few days at a friend's place and I have to say that it's such an immersive experience of computing. It's really hard to go back to smaller screens, especially a 17".
jbstingray sucks @ Mar 25th 2006 11:56PM
#29
Numbnuts, I know graphics, I know programming, and you know *nothing* about what I do on a computer or what my expertise is. Your assumption that I am not a "graphics professional" is your mistake.
I wasn't lying when I said the Apple monitor is a distraction to me and wasn't up my alley. Why would I lie? Are you upset that my opinion of Apple was negative? You obviously are a fanboy, so perhaps you should skedaddle over to thinksecret.com and leave the grownups alone.
DukeTogo @ Mar 26th 2006 12:45AM
On March 23rd Dell had a sale on the 3007WFP
$1499 (CANADIAN)
It has been this low before and I would suspect it will go that low again. I almost jumped at it but for some niggling issues I had...
Apple Store (Canada) has the 30" Cinema on for:
$2999 (regular)
$2799 (education)
Now I prefer the look of the Apple, and the slightly better colour sounds good. But that's a $1300 (!!!!) CDN price difference. Repeat after me, W... T... F
Even the *regular* Dell price of $2299 (CDN) is a DEEP discount compared to Apple!
Now if Apple (or anyone!) would guarantee me a perfect (no dead/stuck/bright/bunged-up pixels) monitor... ok *maybe* we could start talking.
-- ALL PRICES ABOVE ARE IN *CANADIAN* DOLLARS --
ashamed @ Mar 26th 2006 12:51AM
i'm not even going to give my opinion, because i don't have anything relevant to add. which is what most of the above commenters should have done. congrats, you have all made me ashamed to be a part of the engadget community.
shane @ Mar 26th 2006 2:08AM
I have 2 of the 30 inch Apple monitors at home and 2 of the 30 inch Dell monitors at work and I have to point out something that i have not read in any comments so far...The 30 Apple monitors run so hot that you need a fan blowing to keep the hot air from warming your face. The Dell monitors, which I believe are actually Samsung monitors rebranded, seem to stay as cool as their 24 inch Samsung monitors. Keep this in mind. Our company will not be buying any more Apple monitors.
L. M. Lloyd @ Mar 26th 2006 8:48AM
Wow, anywhere you go on the Internet, it is the same story, with Apple fanboys saying the same stuff.
Neither the Apple display, nor the Dell display are professional grade monitors! Neither of them are good enough to be used for accurate color work like pre-press, color grading, finishing, or anything where color needs to be accurate. They can't even display full YUV colorspace for accurate video work!
Will you Apple fans please quit acting like any product with an Apple logo is somehow specially designed for graphics? These monitors don't have LED backlighting, they are something like 60% of Photoshop gamut, and they have an awful black level. Either one would be fine if you are doing screen-based graphics, like web design, interface design, or game work, but they just aren't up to print, film, or professional video monitors.
Arguing about which of these monitors is most suited for color accurate graphics work, is like arguing about which combat boot is best for Olympic track and field events! Trying to say you bought one over the other because it was ever so slightly better at doing something it was not only never designed to do, but is really bad at doing, is just stupid.
If you Apple people need something to feel good about, for your extra money, focus on the fact that it uses really high-quality, exotic and rare materials like aluminum. Don't try to pass it off as some high-end professional graphics monitor though, because if that is why you bought it, you didn't do your research, and got ripped off.
Personally, I go with the Dells, because every Dell monitor I buy for systems that don't need to be color accurate, is a few hundred dollars I can save to buy professional monitors for the systems that do need to be color accurate.
Stefen @ Mar 26th 2006 10:59AM
Apple is always going to win over dell. I have also been burned by dell, more than once as a matter of fact. So i switched to apple, never had a problem with their products nor been burned. Besides, you have to agree, apples products are more appealing to they eye and just cool looking. Dell is way over-rated. In conclusion, dell =s**t products
eric @ Mar 26th 2006 2:59PM
#46 is correct, neither of these monitors should be used by serious graphic professionals.
Ihar `Philips` Filipau @ Mar 27th 2006 3:27AM
I have 2005fpw and all it's useable for is watching video and pictures. Backlight is leaky, pixel size seems to be different in different parts of matrix.
Yes, Dell packs more functions. But Dell's production sucks heavily. Honestly, until I bought two Dell displays I even didn't guessed what kind of problems TFT can have. (Samsung & Acer I had before worked perfectly.) (Just as Windows: demos and reviews are cool, but when you buy it and start using it - crap starts creeping from the places no reviewer would ever look at.)
If you planning to buy display for work - do it old fashioned way - like most professionals do: first and foremost you go to retail shops and trash them to death so they'll let you check/test every monitor they have. When you found worthy display, grab it with all your hands and proceed to check out. Do *NOT* let them have it back even for a second. When you are going to cash out $Nk - you better be sure what you are buying...
informer @ Mar 27th 2006 5:00AM
AnandTech tested the Dell 20" with the 20" ACD last time and I believe the Dell beat it. However that was not the most popular Dell monitor at the time, the honour went to the 24" version which AT has not tested. The 2405FPW will trounce the 24" ACD for its faster panel and better features at a much better price.
Nothing much has changed between Apple's 20, 23 and 30" ACDs so how is it that the Apple beats Dell this time? Something is definitely up and its not because the Dell is inferior. It is using a brand new and more reliable panel, its lighter, more cooling and most importantly designed for today's applications especially gaming. Play a game on the ACDs and you will see ghosting, heat and poor brightness on standard settings.
Apple do not make fast LCDs, but reasonably responsive monitors to satisfy desktop publishers and internet users. Gaming nor 3D was ever on the card for Mac users anyway. This should clue most people in on what Apple is all about.
So far there are plenty of people buying the 3007 for gaming and all have given excellent feedback on the monitor. Like a previous poster has mentioned, the Dell's panel is not the same as Apple, but comes from Samsung who makes the best panel on the market today. The CNET review was inaccurate and did not factor in enough to compare the 2 monitors properly.
Lukas @ Mar 27th 2006 4:46PM
The Firewire ports on the Apple are a deal clincher for me, whether it's for an iSight, iPod, DV camera, or external hard drive. If Apple abandons FireWire, then there's a reason not to get the Apple model.