3G iPhone coming early next year?

Steve's response to our question about the lack of 3G on the iPhone was kinda reasonable -- battery life is a major issue on current 3G chips -- but that doesn't mean the technology isn't improving rapidly. According to The Street, we could see an iPhone with a 3G capable chip by the first quarter of next year. Of course, Apple declined to comment -- they never talk about future products -- but we wouldn't be surprised if the company dumps a proper HSDPA / UMTS device onto the market around that time, and Steve Jobs did make it pretty clear that 3G battery life constraints should be lifted by "later next year," and that 2nd and 3rd gen iPhones are certainly in the works. We seriously hope they come sooner than later: EDGE + WiFi is a horrible compromise these days, what with 7.2Mbps mobile connections starting to pop up around Europe.

[Thanks, Adam P.]

[Patrick @ Sep 18th 2007 8:47AM]

Im still waiting to hear what steve/apple have to say about the dud ipod touch screens.

Then we can get back to where's our Aussie iphones...

[AJ @ Sep 18th 2007 8:49AM]

Ok, I'm far from the most technical person when it comes to phones, but didn't I hear (go word of mouth) that 3G could be added onto the iPhone through a software update? Or is it also hardware missing within the phone?

[Rich UK @ Sep 18th 2007 8:55AM]

Nope its a hardware difference I'm afraid!

[Frankenstein Black @ Sep 18th 2007 12:29PM]

Yes a hardware (i.e. RF chipset) is required. But how cool would it be if Apple offers an upgrade for existing iPohnes ("ship us your iPhone and we will upgrade the chipset") for a fee of course.

There is also no reason that a 3G iPhone can't have GSM/EDGE/UMTS/WiFi. Many existing phones have this now. Also the added 3G/UMTS consumption can be offset by a higher capacity (not physically bigger) Battery.

Hey Uncle Steve you let me know when that Bad Boy is ready (3G iPhone) and I will head over to Colorware and "do one up lovely". Twould be my first ever Apple product (except for QT Pro ;^)...
http://www.colorwarepc.com/products/select_iPhone.aspx

[Tony C @ Sep 18th 2007 2:53PM]

It's not as simple as swapping out chips in the iPhone. Unless the next iteration of 3G chipsets are 100% completely pin and electrically-compatible, it would require replacing an entire logic board. Dissecting a typical 3G phone like the Blackjack, the chips (seven in all there) are manufactured by different companies (Qualcomm in the BJ, Infineon for the iPhone) while the iPhone has only three dedicated to GSM/EDGE communications.

[ashton @ Sep 18th 2007 8:50AM]

and the point of this post is? we knew that already?

[Musketeer @ Sep 19th 2007 10:20AM]

Hmmm, wait a minute I already have this device (N95). But it doesn't have a touch interface. If someone added touch screen to this feature set, then I'd be the first in line to buy one!

I'm a touchscreen fan ever since I had 2 different touchscreen phones (Sony Ericssons) from 2003 to 2006. I miss being able to write my messages instead of tapping keys :(

Btw the iphone does have handwriting recognition, right?

[Jah @ Sep 18th 2007 8:50AM]

You should also have asked Jobs when will Apple add the following:

- 5pm camera
- DVD quality video recrding
- built-in GPS
- front facing camera
- ability to add 3rd party apps, especially we can listen to music in other formats
- Office apps or at least a proper To Do list app
- working MMS
- Push email client

[flamingmonkey @ Sep 18th 2007 9:08AM]

A 5pm camera, does that just operate for an hour a day?

[Alan Partridge @ Sep 18th 2007 9:29AM]

2MP would be fine if they didnt use a bargain basement sensor and crappy plastic lens. A good example is the 1.3MP camera attachment for the PSP which is better than most 3MP camera phones.

[Chrisphillers @ Sep 18th 2007 9:32AM]

You did realise that you just descibed the N95 8gb didnt you!??

[shaun @ Sep 18th 2007 10:26AM]

I agree, my samsung phone has a 3MP camera and it's a waste of time. In my experience the cybershot phones are best

[Craig @ Sep 18th 2007 10:42AM]

No, the 5pm camera has automatic encryption to safely document your "after work" activities.

[Sasha S. @ Sep 18th 2007 8:52AM]

I have been using iPhone in Netherlands for the past few weeks (via hacked SIM) and I have to say that battery life is more of a issue then low speed of EDGE. For people who are road-warriors this might be problem but for consumers - I do not think so.

9 out of 10 times Apple knows very good what majority of their clients find important and in this case it was choice between battery life and speed. They have chosen for battery life and I am glad that my music keeps playing. Just my €0.02

[jasondefaoite @ Sep 18th 2007 9:08AM]

I'm be curious to know what the power consumption difference is between a 3.5G chip vs WiFi. Yes, battery life lasting longer is a good thing, but don't believe the spin Jobs is putting on this.

[Razor @ Sep 18th 2007 11:26AM]

I don't understand why the phone has to be so thin. I could live with an iPhone doubled the thickness and battery life.

[Kirk Williams @ Sep 18th 2007 8:53AM]

I don't know why people complain about EDGE? I went from Sprint's crappy/slow network to AT&T and couldn't be happier.

[Rich UK @ Sep 18th 2007 9:03AM]

When you are used to HSDPA as alot of us are in Europe EDGE certainly a step backwards

[Razor @ Sep 18th 2007 1:35PM]

I found the iPod to be moderately faster than my Treo 650. I made sure the wifi was turned off on the iPhone just to make sure all things were fair. Having played with a Palm 755 I would put the iPhone somewhere between the 650 and 750.

[rtc11 @ Sep 18th 2007 8:58AM]

tell me again why Apple wouldn't just make an iphone where you could take out the battery and replace it if 3G was too much drain on your battery?

Oh and The Street article said something about GPS is possible too.

[Tony C @ Sep 18th 2007 9:13AM]

I don't think any of Apple's mobile products (not counting notebooks) have ever had replaceable batteries in them -- at least during the iPod era, anyway -- since the Newton, except for maybe those old Apple-emblazoned QuickTake (Kodak & Fuji) digital cameras, way back when...

[Tony C @ Sep 18th 2007 9:04AM]

Engadget's blogcast said that El Jobso specifically stated 3G might be available "late next year". Was that taken out of context or am I missing something? I guess technology being what it is, things could improve within the next few months to the point that HSDPA/UMTS would get that magical 5+ hours of talk time that he wants to make the iPhone a viable 3G device.

AJ: No, the last I heard is that the mobile chipset contained in the iPhone does not support 3G technologies.

Jah: Is that your pipe dream list there? =) 5 megapixels is a bit much to expect, and it's not the number of pixels, it's how well the camera uses them. Likewise with DVD-quality recording. How long do you think that 8GB of internal memory would last if you were to snap full-res photos and video all the time? Might as well ad "SD-Micro slot" to your list then. GPS would be sweet, but I don't want an ugly aerial or flip-out patch antenna on the backside of my iPhone. I agree with the 3rd party apps, but hasn't the hacking community done well enough already?

[Gor @ Sep 18th 2007 9:11AM]

does anyone else notice the goatse reference in this?

[Tony C @ Sep 18th 2007 9:16AM]

gor: WHAT?1?!?

[unuser @ Sep 18th 2007 9:49AM]

"it's how well the camera uses them"

no, it's the quality of the sensor/lens.

"How long do you think that 8GB of internal memory would last if you were to snap full-res photos and video all the time? Might as well ad "SD-Micro slot" to your list then."

Ah, the standard SD Card, just like the standard MMS.

"GPS would be sweet, but I don't want an ugly aerial or flip-out patch antenna on the backside of my iPhone."

lol, funny read from an ignorant iPhone user, spot the antenna on these: mypocketpcmobile.com/Portals/0/HTC/HTC%20P3300/htc_p3300_1.jpg
mypocketpcmobile.com/Portals/0/HTC/htcP3600Review/p3600_141x228.jpg
theunwired.net/media/news/htc_kaiser_leaked_press_photo.jpg
engadget.com/media/2007/03/e-ten-glofiish-x800-main.jpg

[Jah @ Sep 18th 2007 9:21AM]

Tony

I am just asking for what the Nokia N95 (now 1 year old) phone can do!

[Tony C @ Sep 18th 2007 9:39AM]

Let me know when the N95 gets a 3.5" multi-touch screen, 8GB of flash, 8 hours of talk time, OS X, iTunes support and still manages to fit all its other functions and features into the iPhone's slim chassis, since it's nearly twice at thick.

In the US the N95 also costs $749 which is a far cry from the iPhone's $299/$399 and has *just* become available without having to pay an additional arm and leg to buy and activate an unlocked device.

N95 Dimensions

* Weight: 120 g
* Length: 99 mm
* Width: 53 mm
* Thickness (max): 21 mm

iPhone Dimensions

* Weight: 135 grams
* Height: 115 mm
* Width: 61 mm
* Depth: 11.6 mm

[Gor @ Sep 18th 2007 9:51AM]

At first glance that yellow logo looked like some sort of goatse joke. Could be that I stayed up too late last night waiting for Team Fortress 2...

[Jah @ Sep 18th 2007 9:54AM]

Tony

the N95 8GB version has 8GB of flash and a battery life that is superb. Also it may not be touch screen but it is very clear in sunlight!

[Tony C @ Sep 18th 2007 10:50AM]

Gor: L O L ! OK, you meant the SIM card contact pads, I thought you meant my post. I do see what you mean though.

Jah: Yes, I saw the 8GB referenced on Nokia's website when I pulled the specs, but once again, it's not available in the states. If a standard N95 is $749, I don't want to know what I'd have to pay for an unlocked grey market 8GB version!

[Jon @ Sep 18th 2007 11:18AM]

Price quoted for N95 is sim-free device with no contract obligations. You are comparing er. Apples with Oranges.

[Tony C @ Sep 18th 2007 12:20PM]

John: No. You *do not* need to sign a multi-year contract with AT&T to get it up and running. You can buy an iPhone from the Apple Store and can activate it with a pre-paid plan, if you follow the correct procedures setting it up. You can even go so far as to unlock it to use another carrier's SIM card if you like. Its price tag is the same whether you buy a contract or not.

And please show me a US carrier that officially sells the Nokia N95 discounted from retail with a plan in their offerings.

[MattWPBS @ Sep 18th 2007 1:05PM]

Tony - N95's free on a £30per month contract in the UK with 606 minutes/606 texts on T-Mobile. £7.50 for unlimited data. Free calls/texts at weekends and evenings.

Tell me when the iPhone's at a sane price in mature mobile phone markets.

[Jon @ Sep 18th 2007 1:32PM]

Tony your fanboyism is clouding your judgement.

O2 18 month contract at £30 a month - free N95 with GPS, WiFi, HSDPA, 5Mp Camera

Only a fanboy will think the Iphone is value for money.

[SimonSharks @ Sep 18th 2007 9:11AM]

The problem is not 3G draining the battery but that large screen. It's an insult to charge £1,000 for a non-3G phone that uses a non-existent EDGE network. Hardly revolutionary Apple!

[Tony C @ Sep 18th 2007 9:23AM]

I beg to differ... AnandTech performed an admittedly unscientific test to compare EDGE to 3G and its effect on battery life, but it's noticeably visible results just the same.

http://www.anandtech.com/gadgets/showdoc.aspx?i=3036

And where does it say that Apple wants £1000 for the iPhone? £269 is the price tag pulled straight from the press conference/event.

No FUD please!

[MattWPBS @ Sep 18th 2007 1:09PM]

Tony - Total Cost of Ownership:
£269 up front.
£35 * 18 months = £639.
£899 minimum.

That's not starting on the fact that 200 mins/200 texts is a stupidly low number of free calls and texts.

[tanais @ Sep 18th 2007 9:11AM]

"5 megapixels is a bit much to expect, and it's not the number of pixels, it's how well the camera uses them"

...Neither of which has much going for it in the iPhone.

[Alex Rzem @ Sep 18th 2007 9:14AM]

The 3G iPhone should be coming out around the same time that it hit Australia. Why? Because down here, we don't have any EDGE networks. It's all GSM (on its way out), UMTS (also on its way out) and HSDPA (being rolled out super aggressively by all telcos). With the size and population distribution of Australia, no carrier would even consider adding EDGE when we have around 70 plus percent coverage with HSDPA. That means 14.4Mbit/s to our phones now and 40Mbit/s by the end of 2009.

[rollonet @ Sep 18th 2007 9:28AM]

Kevin 07

[Chrisphillers @ Sep 18th 2007 10:12AM]

lol, the UK and most of Europe have a huge coverage HSDPA - EDGE is such old hat here also, infact so old that o2 have been installing older gen EDGE to their network - sheer madness. So why did they release the iphone in the UK? I am assuming it is because of the huge profitability of mobile networks over here - so I am not too sure why you are painting the picture of some sort of a super advanced Australia compared to Europe!??

[amiga_tone @ Sep 18th 2007 4:49PM]

Chrissphillers:

No painting to paint! We don't always get the same tech as everyone else in the world at the same time. In fact there is only one carrier that supports edge (telstra) and although Alex said it will be on it's way out very soon - it will only be in place to support the older network - Telstra recently released it's new NextG network recently (it's version of 3G) and none of the other telcos who probably piggyback each other anyway support EDGE. That's right none of them.

So for Apple to actually get somewhere with the iPhone over here they are going to need to support 3G.

[shaliron @ Sep 18th 2007 9:24AM]

Well Apple's just copping out by not making a proper product for the European/Asian markets. All the other manufacturers (Nokia, SE, Samsung etc.) have dealt with the fact that 3G phones use more battery power, and that's by not making the slimmest phone with the biggest screens, but by making the size of the phone proportionate to the power use of the components.

So can't Apple just make the iPhone a tad thicker - and you can always turn off 3G if you don't need it. Simple.

[UnnDunn @ Sep 18th 2007 9:27AM]

And what happens when Apple DOESN'T announce a 3G iPhone early next year? Do we immediately speculate that they'll announce one next July? What if they don't then? Next November?

Enough with the speculation; the 3G iPhone will come when it comes.

[Chrisphillers @ Sep 18th 2007 9:36AM]

Tony C - Comparing Wifi use on the battery to 3G on the battery would come rather much in favour of 3G. So why no 3g? Especially HSDPA - considering it is available everywhere in the UK (and most European countries) and on unlimited plans. Far far better than Wifi.

[Tony C @ Sep 18th 2007 9:49AM]

Did you read the AnandTech article? (http://www.anandtech.com/gadgets/showdoc.aspx?i=3036) They tested EDGE, 3G and WiFi -- WiFi was most frugal with battery time except for streaming YouTube, which could have just reflected higher CPU usage. BTW, I think their talk time graph is labeled "iPhone (WiFi)" by mistake -- by context, it should be "iPhone (EDGE)".

[bearboy @ Sep 18th 2007 9:38AM]

This may be out of question...but it never hurts to ask I suppose. I just switched from a 3G capable phone to the IPhone. I mostly use WiFi, but my question is:

Q: Since 3G on the IPhone is not available, and will not be available (nor feasible) through a software/firmware upgrade, could it be possible for Apple to create an add-on of some sort...when they decide to offer 3G

[Tony C @ Sep 18th 2007 12:27PM]

No. AFAIK, the mobile phone chipset in the current iPhone does not support HSDPA/UMTS. Its network capabilities maxes out at EDGE data speeds.

[Chrisphillers @ Sep 18th 2007 9:40AM]

lol, the UK and most of Europe have a huge coverage HSDPA - EDGE is such old hat here also, infact so old that o2 have been installing older gen EDGE to their network - sheer madness. So why did they release the iphone in the UK? I am assuming it is because of the huge profitability of mobile networks over here - so I am not too sure why you are painting the picture of some sort of a super advanced Australia compared to Europe!??

[Lee Richards @ Sep 18th 2007 9:41AM]

"And where does it say that Apple wants £1000 for the iPhone? £269 is the price tag pulled straight from the press conference/event."

I think the OP is talking about the handset price and the enforced 18 month contract. Combined, you are paying £899 minimum.