Toshiba sez it wouldn't change a thing, still thinks HD DVD is better

We've always heard that there's no need in regretting, and apparently, Toshiba is following said mantra after the collapse of its beloved high-definition movie format. In an interview with TechRadar, Toshiba's deputy general manager of HD DVD Olivier Van Wynendaele stated that it "wouldn't change anything that it did," and continued on to say that "circumstances saw to it that [Toshiba] had to make the decision not to continue, but that doesn't mean [the company] did anything wrong." Just in case you couldn't already sense the inability to swallow one's pride, Mr. Van Wynendaele also proclaimed that its format was "a finished standard, unlike Blu-ray," and concluded by noting that HD DVD was still "better than Blu-ray." Maybe he really didn't get the memo?

[Image courtesy of Bexhuff, thanks David]

[Isaac @ Feb 19th 2008 6:52PM]

GO BENDER!

[E71 @ Feb 19th 2008 7:55PM]

Good, I hope those morons at Toshiba continue to sit in their basements and play the same old discs over and over again.

[CUBSWILLWIN @ Feb 19th 2008 8:28PM]

off topic anyone?

[Peter @ Feb 19th 2008 8:56PM]

Ignatius - Let's not forget the dumptruck full of money they gave Warner Bros. Sony bought this victory.

[Kinger @ Feb 19th 2008 9:16PM]

Hey, what does this have to doe with the arcade version of the 360. That's not fair. Leave us alone!

[jimmyink @ Feb 19th 2008 10:03PM]

BS Peter.

I'm sure if it was possible to "buy" victory, wouldn't microsoft have this one in the bag? You've obviously have no idea about the size of the industry.

[wraith808 @ Feb 19th 2008 10:34PM]

@jimmyink

If microsoft had wanted to buy victory and had stood at the forefront... sure. But they didn't.

[mattclarkie @ Feb 20th 2008 4:58AM]

HD-DVD spent more money buying 2 studios than Sony did buying a dozen. The main reason that Blu-ray was successful is because most of the major releases are either Sony, or joint Sony releases. If you have the blockbusters, you have the sales.

[phanbouy @ Feb 19th 2008 6:53PM]

hmm.. guess Toshiba hired Karl Rove

[Dante @ Feb 19th 2008 7:06PM]

More like Baghdad Bob.

[Nate @ Feb 19th 2008 6:53PM]

HD-DVD might be better but just because consumers bought into Blu-ray doesn't mean that it is a better format. There are a lot of stupid consumers out there. Late night infomercials wouldn't exist if consumers were smart. CONSUMERS ARE STUPID, thats why marketing works.

[Tony @ Feb 19th 2008 6:56PM]

Stop calling us stupid! Asshole!

[ben @ Feb 19th 2008 6:57PM]

Yeah, early adopters of complicated, new technology are stupid...

[lou @ Feb 19th 2008 7:09PM]

Personal opinion is that Blu Ray is better. But to call consumers stupid is a bid of a ridiculous statement to be making considering you yourself are a consumer whether your choosing a HD format or buying a carton of milk!
early adoptors are very important for any product, they are the guys whose opinions the tweaking of future models gets based on. Some of them got screwed over when they bought HD DVD, but in reality they knew the risk, probably are annoyed but will get over it.

[telepheedian @ Feb 19th 2008 7:11PM]

The blu-ray/hd-dvd situation turned out exactly like Betamax did.
HD-DVD=better format
Blu-Ray=more storage

[JohnTitor @ Feb 19th 2008 7:13PM]

I keep saying it, it's all cause of PS3, Toshiba should have changed a thing and that was to beg Microsoft to stuff a HD-DVD drive in its 360 Elite (they can still make games on DVD so it wouldn't hurt regular 360 users).
But all said and done both combined are like 2% of where regular DVD stands and still well bellow a thousand titles each.

[Chewy @ Feb 19th 2008 7:54PM]

While consumers are, for the most part, stupid - integration certainly was a large factor.

Few people want to have as many devices as they can. Most only want one device to do EVERYTHING. That is part of why BD won - it's integration with PS3. If the 360 had integrated HD-DVD, the tables _MIGHT_ have been turned.

To the other repliers: Consumers _are_ stupid. There is not one person who knows everything about anything. While you may know about technology, some of you probably don't know anything at all about (A FOR INSTANCE) flowers. Therefore, to a Botanist you are a stupid consumer, relying on the same people at Home Depot that we in the tech industry equate to the (generally) ignorant product-pushers at Best Buy. Stupid is a relative term, so the poster saying consumers are stupid is absolutely correct.

[Pawtucket @ Feb 19th 2008 10:33PM]

You're absolutely right. It's not that an individual consumer is "stupid" (although they might be, I am a consumer, and I'm stupid). But it's the concept(s) of marketing and group psychology.

We've been told that "Blue-Ray is better" so now it will sell more, receive more revenue and become advanced due to product revenues. But whether or not it is a better technology is not so clear. The decision has been made for us. As usual.

[Static @ Feb 19th 2008 8:17PM]

The formats and player standards are two different things. Blu ray has the higher bitrate and larger disc space. It is the best format period. HD-DVD had better player standards. But the thing about these two things is that the formats DO NOT change while the standard CAN and change and potential upgrade over the life of a format.

It is always best to look at something in the simplest means.

[Lux_Zadora @ Feb 19th 2008 8:24PM]

I am glad that blue-ray won, not
I am also glad that now i can enjoy movies in shitty mpeg 2 quality/codec, not
I am glad that my cheapest blue-ray player wont support web content, not
I am glad that if i ever wont to get the web content from blue-ray movie I will have to buy profile 2.0 blue ray player for about $1000.00+, not
I am glad that my blue-ray disk are not scratch resistant, not
I am glad that my blue ray player wont support Dolby Digital Plus, and lossless formats Dolby TrueHD and DTS HD , not
I am glad that now movie corp can rise prices on their blue ray movies, not
I am glad that I got tricked by sony to thinking blue-ray is better and I won't be getting any of those things mention above in my cheap blue ray player, all the things that I could had for $200.00 if HD-DVD had survived, not

R.I.P. HD-DVD I will always think you were better!

[CUBSWILLWIN @ Feb 19th 2008 8:29PM]

If you buy food and pay for your shelter, you're a consumer, no?

[why not the LS2LS7? @ Feb 20th 2008 1:08AM]

Who is modding Lux_Zadora up?

BluRay is the format with scratch protection.
PS3 supports Dolby TrueHD.
BluRay movies haven't been made with MPEG2 codec for about a year now. Sony even replaced for free a large number of discs that were made with the MPEG2 codec.

It's unbelievable the level of hate here. People are spreading incorrect info and getting modded up for doing it, apparently by people who just like the hate in the post.

[Cru Jones @ Feb 19th 2008 6:55PM]

It doesn't surprise me one bit that they won't admit any regret. The Japanese pride is unlike anything I have ever seen. It's just a good thing there weren't any samurai swords around when this announcement was made.

[ethana2 @ Feb 19th 2008 7:07PM]

Don't kid yourself. Their intelligence is unlike anything you've seen.

[Richard Lamsdale @ Feb 19th 2008 7:39PM]

Japanese pride? With a name like "Olivier Van Wynendaele" I'd say it's more like Dutch courage.

[webon @ Feb 19th 2008 8:04PM]

Hehe It sounds like Oliver Van Whiney

[RC @ Feb 19th 2008 6:59PM]

HD DVD was a finalized technology. It seemed like BD was in a perpetual stage of betas until 2.0 was set in stone. The thing that got me was when BD players spat out newer FOX movies because they required 2.0 players....... I knew for sure I wasn't going to touch BD anytime soon before it is finalized.

[Fitz @ Feb 19th 2008 7:11PM]

Seriously...at least HD-DVD wasn't planning on screwing every schmuck that bought a Profile 1.0 or 1.1 player as Sony has done. That's why HD-DVD had an ethernet port included in every player for firmware updates and was also backed by the DVD-Forum (some sense of an international standard)

No sympathy for any early adopters of Profile 1.0 and 1.1 Blu-ray players - you got what you paid for....a Sony product...with or w/out the logo.

[RN @ Feb 19th 2008 8:04PM]

I'm sick and tired of the fools that keep saying that profile 2.0 discs are not compatible with 1.0 or 1.1 players. Btw, the Fox discs referred to previously required firmware updates only because they implemented BD+. There are not 2.0 discs or players yet. (Yes, I know the PS3 will be 2.0, but that will be with future firmware.)

HD-DVD had its share of compatibility problems requiring firmware updates to existing players. Toshiba even publically admitted that only 30% of the players sold ever had Ethernet connected. So what about the other 70%, did they just accept the fact that certain discs would not work with their player?

It's ironic, because DVD was basically a Toshiba format that is still changing today. The first players did not support discs with DTS soundtracks or seamless branching. (Remeber when The Matrix came out originally and the number of problems it caused with many DVD players released for the previous 4 years?) Then there was progressive-scan and the HDMI up-converting and recording, etc. What about Mandatory Managed Copy? No HD-DVD player supports MMC. Why is ther no bitching about that?

Get over it, both formats as whole have equal capabilities except capacity. More capacity equals more content or higher quality content. (At least the BR version of Transformers will hopefully have lossless audio.) Anyone who believes neither format would evolve over time anyway is naive.

[J. Evans Turner @ Feb 19th 2008 8:23PM]

You are wrong. Fox's BD+ protected movies are supposed to work on all Blu-Ray players. BD+ capability was designed from the start, and even 1.0 and 1.1 profile players support it (though an update may be required). You out-right say that non-2.0-profile players would spit out Fox BD+ protected discs...that is a LIE.

[Fitz @ Feb 19th 2008 11:20PM]

SONY is still EVIL. Just as MS, Apple, Google and other proprietary technology brands.

Just be careful who you go to bed with...you may get BURNED (or the HIV)! Believe me, I've traveled to Tokyo and they are all SONY robots....scary...Sarah Conner Chronicles are a documentary.

Downloads are still the future...hold off long enough and bliss will be only a few clicks away....

[RC @ Feb 23rd 2008 10:52PM]

I know they require available updates. I was referring to that they weren't compatible out of the box.

[taoprophet420 @ Feb 19th 2008 7:01PM]

Just like with Betemax the better format lost out.

[Reader @ Feb 19th 2008 8:03PM]

Maybe it was just karma. Though most likely BluRay won't have as long a run as VHS.

[RC @ Feb 23rd 2008 10:55PM]

Now it's Blu vs standard DVD. As long as there are $40 players and $10 movies the average consumer is going to see no reason for Blu. Videophiles and those who want the top of the line will buy, but they aren't close to the majority of the population.

[madeforidiots @ Feb 19th 2008 7:03PM]

Ouch Toshiba.

Such a sore loser...

[Cal @ Feb 19th 2008 7:08PM]

Maybe they have something to be sore about?

Supposedly superior format, years of work, hundreds of millions of dollars down the drain . . .

[Tiptup300 @ Feb 19th 2008 8:19PM]

BUT ITS ONLY A GAME!!??!

[Intrepid @ Feb 20th 2008 4:31AM]

They have every right to say what they've said. First gen blu-ray players are already useless... thus the format is not finished.

[m @ Feb 19th 2008 7:05PM]

Funny... I said almost the exact same thing the last time I got dumped. Only without the high-definition part. Don't worry, Toshiba: you'll meet somebody else!

[ethana2 @ Feb 19th 2008 7:11PM]

It is very possible. There are more in this world than the average home user, and the dynamics are often quite different.

Plus, there's always a trick they could pull. For instance:
If they opened up the patents to HD-DVD, scrapped AACS, and adopted dirac and vorbis for media on it, they'd grab onto the open source community and never. let. go. I may not know what I'm talking about, but that could actually be enough to resurrect it.

[Chewedtoothpick @ Feb 19th 2008 7:05PM]

HD-DVD _IS/WAS_ a finalized standard unlike BD which is still undergoing changes and standardization. That is why not all BD players will play all BD Disks (sans the PS3.) The reason that Toshiba was so confident theirs was better is because it was. It was a much more consumer-friendly technology in ALL aspects, but it was poorly integrated and marketed.

Unfortunately quality has nothing to do anymore with the success of a product. Look at all the Chinese knockoffs. Look at Apple. It's nothing but Marketing because as another poster said, consumers are for the most part stupid.

It has been that way since the beginning of time, and will remain that way until the end of time. Even in nature, marketing is everything - look at animal mating dances and even flowers.

[why not the LS2LS7? @ Feb 19th 2008 8:15PM]

Actually, the problems with discs not playing are because of BD+, which was part of the standard all along. It wasn't an issue with changing standards, but with players that didn't implement the standard correctly.

This is always possible when you have multiple manufacturers of a device, but relatively easily avoided on the HD-DVD side because they only had one manufacturer. Of course, people tend to forget there was a required update for the 360 player because it locked up playing newly released HD-DVD discs.

Let this crap drop. It happened on both sides and it happened on DVD too (with the Matrix and Panasonic players).

[Rob @ Feb 19th 2008 7:08PM]

Sima-sen, Hara-kiri. Hai, Dozo.
Like I've always said, HD-DVD's Achilles hill was their marketing departments disastrous performance in promoting it.

[Qwijib0 @ Feb 19th 2008 7:28PM]

Agreed. The HD-DVD PRG was utterly worthless.

[sinai @ Feb 19th 2008 7:09PM]

so sony actually won a format war?

we are in the end times, my friends. all is doomed.

[Sauerkraut @ Feb 19th 2008 7:16PM]

don't worry they'll screw it up somehow

[Alex R @ Feb 25th 2008 11:38AM]

@ Sauerkraut
All we can do naw is hope...

[freemarketnomore @ Feb 19th 2008 7:09PM]

The only thing Toshiba didn't do right is they failed to allocate $620 million dollars to spend on fox and wb.

[Richard Lai @ Feb 19th 2008 7:09PM]

Meh, HD download FTW! Seriously, why do we still have to get up from the couch to put the disc into the machine??