10/GUI interface looks to redefine the touch-enabled desktop
By Donald Melanson 
posted Oct 15th 2009 2:58PM
posted Oct 15th 2009 2:58PM
Redefining the way we interact with computers is a pretty ambitious task as far as things go, but that's just what R. Clayton Miller is looking to do with his so-called 10/GUI project, and he may just be onto something. Miller begins with the notion that the traditional mouse-based interface lacks the "interaction bandwidth" afforded by multitouch interfaces, and that touch-enabled desktops (or laptops) are inherently problematic since they can't be used for prolonged periods of time -- even a flat surface will do a number on your neck if you use it all day. To solve that problem, Miller proposes separating the touch surface from the display and placing it below the keyboard in the form of a large, hybrid capacative / resistive touch panel. That's just the beginning, however, and Miller has also devised a whole new interface that makes use of all your fingers, and a new linear means of displaying windows that strikes a balance ease of use and the ability to manage numerous applications. Of course, there are some drawbacks -- you'd still likely pull out a mouse for Photoshop or a marathon Left 4 Dead session -- but we'd certainly be curious to see how this would play out in practice. Head on past the break for a full video overview.
[Via Slashdot]
[Via Slashdot]
I like where this is going!!
Then check out the Wacom Bamboo with Touch & Pen...
http://www.rgbfilter.com/?p=1909
Or the new microsoft mouse concepts...
http://www.engadget.com/2009/10/05/microsoft-research-shows-off-multitouch-mouse-prototypes/
10 bucks says MS will buy them.
It's a nice concept; I'd be up for it if it included a taskbar that allowed me to see what was open and teleport to it at a glance. If you have more than a dozen windows open, though, with out a task bar, I think things would get pretty messy.
See 7:50
I've thought that this would be the only real way to make multitouch work in a desktop environment. Sort of like how the Eee Keyboard panel would work
Looks nice but probably sucks to use. Being forced to have every app take up the full screen sounds pretty lame on large monitors. Additionally, did you see their hardware mockup? They've got a big touchpad below a big keyboard.. that sounds cumbersome to switch between.
Still, it's good to see these concepts floating around, because they might spur ideas that actually get implemented into future operating systems.
Instead of one large touchscreen below the keyboard, it would need two smaller ones on either side. That would solve the reach problem of the keyboard, and still allow both hands to be used ergonomically.
why not put a screen/virtual keyboard underneath that touchpad. its not like you can see the individual keys on your keyboard right now anyways, mr. fatfingers.
then just have another one of those operation "edge"s along the bottom to toggle the keyboard.
a little haptic feedback would be nice too, all around. perhaps a small vibrate like on current phones with virtual keyboards.
I like the thoughts but I don't like his focus on desktop computing. I think this would be much more applicable to a laptop environment where users are limited to a single screen. On my desktop I have no problems with window stacking because I have 3 monitors and I think that con10uum would feel very clunky with a multi-monitor setup.
If they could make the laptop's touchpads span the same width that the keyboad does, I think this could be quite useful.
Good video.
This is an amazing concept......I hope this works out.I always wondered how would people deal with the neck sprain from looking onto a flat/horizontal surface like an apple tablet or a crunchpad constantly.They will be too big and awkward to hold them with one hand and use touch controls with the other.
Wow... The concept seems so obvious, and it looks fantastic. I'm intrigued :)
It's good that there are people out there looking for ways to innovate the desktop experience but I don't think this will be it. It just doesn't seem much more productive than a mouse and keyboard
Cool concept, kinda reminds me of the xbox 360 blades. Seems like watching movies or playing games on it would be difficult though, unless it had a mechanism for making them full screen.
It's a Wacom with multitouch. Yeah? And?
No that would be the Courier UI (which I think its far better than a full 10 finger approach for a desktop).
fuck yeah! too bad digg beat you to it engadget!
And to bad reddit beat digg to it.
Yes Reddit was first, and like always, digg copies reddit 2 or 3 days later
Revolutionary. Ala iPhone.
Didn't bother reading. Just saw "Truth" and down-ranked.
@darbear5610
Judge a book by its cover much?
"Phil Schiller on Windows 7: 'No matter how you look at it, it's still Windows' {Engadget}
Oct 15th 2009 12:54PM
Windows 7. Overrated as much as android.
Like your average Joe blow will seriously fork out $150
to get windows 7 on their used laptop that's worth $350 at the most.
Am I right or r all u broke a$$ mofos running to drop up to $200 on an os fir your 5 year old clunker ??"
"HAVA media streamer for iPhone available now {Engadget}
Oct 15th 2009 12:48PM
I winder if $700 nokia n900 can do this?? NOT!!!
U mean my $49 iPhone can di this on a $30 month unlimited data plan,??"
"Recent iPhone 3GS shipments block jailbreaking, jailbreakers still in business {Engadget}
Oct 14th 2009 2:55PM
If u jailbreak a nokia 900 it voids the warranty. U would be forced to dish out another $700 fir another n900."
Read the whole book. Want a refund.
@denson_paul:
Read original posts much?
hmm, apple has a patent for a slightly better but similar touchboard does it not? the one with more or less the whole hand touching the board?
such concept as shown here doesnt look to confortable to use though :l
One problem with this. Typing would be awkward . They show a big touchbad thing below the keyboard.
If the panel had haptic feedback and another ridge at the bottom to switch to keyboard mode I would love it.
Is this thing another *nix, or a shell for windows?
Looks pretty much like QT, like KDE for instance. So Linux.
I agree that UI needs to change if touch is going to move forward in positive ways.
From watching the video it seems like his "sliding panels" concept is just like what Palm did with the Pre, basically he just ported it to the desktop with added tools since you have more space.
I do think that having more of a touch panel versus a touch screen will make more sense in home/office environment unless montiors start getting designed in a way that they can quickly and easily be moved/adjusted to work from standard use to more of a tablet on your desk kind of thing.
Touch is certainly intersting and excited to see what will come out the next few years.
maybe if the had a touch screen keyboard they could combine the touch pad and keyboard, you would med some form of feed back be it sound or heptic
Why put the keyboard on the hardware mockup. surely a lit up lettering on the touchpad when you touch the keyboard button on the touchpad or Global menu, otherwise i think this look SWEET!!! Would love to see it working and play with it to see how it works in reality..
It's 'continuum'.
I personally think this would be great for Photoshop to be switching tools and zooming with one hand while using the other as you would a standard mouse. Pretty much like two mice instead of one hand on the keyboard and one on the mouse.
Is this the future?
after only watching only 2mins of the Video it looks like this is the best case scenario for a all touch interface for a computer system.
looks like its going in the right Direction....
Nobody asked for koolaid Truth.
The system looks like it would have a learning curve but it could be very smart for gaming.
Wacom could go multitouch and basically have this going pretty easily. Granted the Wacom tablet tech is very different, but perhaps something could be worked out there. Add in MS's split touch keyboard concept and it ain't bad. This seems, like most multitouch concepts, to be the useful for designers, but less so for everyday users.
Wacom already has gone multi-touch; however, the current model seems to be limited to only two fingers. I don't know if that is a hardware limitation or software.
Here is the link to their pen + touch tablet page:
http://www.wacom.com/bamboo/bamboo_pen_touch.php
I've got the touch only model right now. I'm still waiting for Linux support though as it only comes with software/drivers for Windows and Mac. Shouldn't be too far off though.
Finally those huuuge buttons on linux/gnome will get useful for once
That was beautiful. I would love to operate my desktop like this. I just have two issues, I don't like the exact gestures they are using, allowing the user to define there own would make more sense, also, how well would this work in a multi-monitor environment (as they are becoming ever more popular)
I think this is going in the right direction also. I am thinking of TV shows where some smarmy geek dude/duddette is standing across the room from some giant monitor with a tablet in thier hand. Instead of using a mouse or searching the tablet, they just look at the screen and do hand gestures on the tablet surface.
Obviously someone has a good idea as the monitor must have some ability to watch the tablet-holders eye movements and be able to track them and correlate their movement to where the person is looking on the monitor. And THEN to interpret what the hand gestures on the tablet mean when associated with the item the eyes are resting on.
I hope that makes sense, and I don' t know why I am not using one right now.
so one huge capacitive surface? great. everyone'll surely pay the 300 dollars that'll cost...
Bamboo Touch is $69. Maybe in a 2-5 years touch pads will be as cheap as a mouse?
Call me a luddite, but I'll stick with my mouse thank you very much.
It is some sort of hugest multitouch trackpad.
meh
:-/
I'm sold.
Very good point. With a traditional mouse, no matter how many fingers you have, you are limited to a single pointer on the screen. I've wondered before if the computer keyboard will be the same in 20 years time as it is today - and tbh I can't see the keyboard lasting that long. This might change or might influence other organisations to work on alternatives to make the keyboard obsolete. I know Miller's plan is to have the touchpad in addition to the keyboard - but I see the touchpad replacing the keyboard - it makes sense. Miller or not, the mouse and the mouse pointer will soon be a thing of the past.
The New Mac Tablet should be able to do this, and when you are looking at it, it becomes a keyboard.
Also the 1 dimensional ui reminds me of the xbox 360 blades.
What if i want to use only one finger on each hand? What if I want to rest my palms on the touchpad. This things needs to be really wide and really short (vertical wise) with a high resolution so that you can rest your palms and get the full range of motion out of just moving your fingers up and down and sideways WITHOUT having to lift your palms from rest...
I already have an awesome multi-touch input device...
It's my keyboard.
I can see maybe for children or people who can't type, but who doesn't learn to type these days at a fairly early age?
Why so much hate for the keyboard?
Not for typing. It's for navigating around the desktop. Not a keyboard replacement, it's (ideally) a mouse replacement. Your keyboard only takes digital input. This will be analog, which is better for things like zooming.
keyboard is great for text entry. but not so great for fluidly and intuitively navigating a GUI.
I can copy-paste, undo-redo, alt-f4, windows-D and windows tab so fast, windows left, down, right and up... man i love windows 7, i think it's (for now) the perfect balance between touch and keyboard enabled.
What if there were some sort of video monitor for your hands so that your hands locations would actually show up on the screen (but transparent a la boxing video games)... just a thought.
Anyone else think that there's a resemblance to the Zune interface?
I don't think a steep learning curve is a big obstacle with this UI. There is a long history of people adopting machines with steep learning curves as long as it's a step forward.
Imagine explaining the keyboard interface to someone that has never used it. "So there are over a 100 keys in staggered rows, and you will eventually learn to hit them with all fingers without looking, it will take years to be proficient..."
or driving a manual car: "You have to let out a pedal with one foot while at the same time pressing on another pedal with your other foot, while turning a wheel with your left hand and sliding a knob into a proper gate with your right hand while looking at the road, you will eventually learn to do this without thinking..."
This user interface seems simple in comparison.
i'll take 2
How many hands do you have??
It's a big ass trackpad, with more figure recognition for the hardware part. And it would kind of suck if for people who are missing a couple of figures. I'm not, but I'm just saying it would.
What if the user is missing fingers? They will be extremely limited with what they can do.
I don't like the huge pad below the keyboard. I can deal with that configuration... on a laptop. My wrists go there, so it would seem like it would zoom in and out if my wrists adjust while typing. Maybe split it into 2 smaller pads (one for each hand) on both sides of the keyboard. Would make transitioning to the keyboard easier.
Cool vid tho! I like where it's going, although I would miss the hardware, and the "clicky" feedback. Kind of like using some software keyboard instead of actual keys.
I don't see why this is easier than traditional window management.. If you have 25 applications open and need to switch between them, you would need to zoom out so you can see all 25. On your traditional Windows taskbar, you can just click between apps, and Win7 improves on that by grouping them while not forcing you to click to open the group..
While (in a more reasonable example), being able to slide between 2 or 3 open apps seems slick, on Windows, you can just alt+tab between two, or directly click on the taskbar..
I thought the beginning of the video was terrific, I agree there is a problem with window management today, but I don't see how 10/GUI is the solution. If my opinion is worth anything, I think voice control would help, and gestures would help too (using the above mentioned pad, you memorize a certain hand/finger gesture to always pop back to your window) Woops, should've patented that idea :)
I was very skeptical...........
Apple, buy these guys, NOW.
That OS looks so dope. I guess that's why Tony Stark invented it.
I agree with the numerous points above calling for haptic feedback. Also in my opinion the bottom touch panel should have some form of video output even if it is rudimentary (not very high res). I just think that would be useful for looking down at a glance and finding were your hands are at. Overall i'd spend some cash on this just for the keyboard/touch panel, the specialized OS just seems like bonus. Finally if this thing gained support for some of the mainstream OS's (Windows, Mac OS, Linux) then i think it would take off faster than a dog from the vacuum cleaner.
I like how they rip-off Apple on the multi-touch glidepad and give them zero credit for th GUI. While Microsoft was going for multi-touch displays Apple smartly made the multi-touch glidepad. I wouldn't buy this product as I need a real keyboard in front of my hands.
Then I guess you like how Apple gives no credits to Jeff Han for his multi-touch work, too.
I like the idea of a separate touch surface area from the screen, but I think the developers sold themselves short with the example they chose. Windows 7 taskbar already organizes all open apps into a horizontal row that allows easy access. Who leaves a clutter of unmaximized windows on their desktop these days? I'm not a Mac user, but I suspect that switching between open apps is no big deal there either.
Here's hoping they put out another concept video with a more exciting and ambitious application.
It is slick, but feels like a solution without a problem. WIndows button + D gets me out of the window problem in Windows...four finger swipe on my MacBook does the same.
Plus, unless your in first class, that keyboard/touch panel layout would be impossible on an airplane--the deeper the base of your laptop, the less space available to open your screen to.
Awesome work,i like to see some support for natal/ps3 wand working along side it and Voice commands File Open *filename* and working multi display with your mobile,pc etc, etc! then we will have full minority report all i can say i think ( Ilove the mouse too) But i think time come to evolve! interesting times guys Interesting times! lets hope the credit crush does not delay it too much hey!
MS will implement this, but due to patent restrictions you'll need to use your feet and toes rather than your fingers.