MDI's AirCar hits the streets, no one is safe. Especially not the air. Or the cars.
By Paul Miller 
posted August 23rd 2008 10:02AM
posted August 23rd 2008 10:02AM
*We're kidding. Cats are awesome.
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posted August 23rd 2008 10:02AM
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Correction: propelling Airsoft pellets at unsuspecting neighborhood kids.
At least you can refuel by grabbing some chili cheese fries....
You still need to use some sort of energy to compress the air in the first place. I'd like to see a comparison of how much electricity it takes to power a compressor long enough to fill this up vs. a tesla or such.
But unlike a tesla, there is no loss of energy converting from AC to DC, and then storing the energy in batteries. Even then, the batteries have the "ability" to slowly loose that energy. However, compressed air sits around for as long as a proper seal can be formed.
Plus, it's easy to make compressed air, as all that has to be run is a pump. No refining, no converting. Just compressing.
No there's just a loss of energy converting from electricity to air or gasoline/diesel to air. And 50 whole miles! Oooh! Travel in one direction then try to find a "fuel" source.
This ideal was stillborn before they built the car.
I don't know about where you live but all the gas stations around me have air pumps. Just make sure you have a glove box filled with quarters.
A fuel source? Really? What about the tire/ air pumps at every major gas station?
That should be a no-brainer. Fill up for 75 cents.
Not stillborn, simply unheard of. That doesn't mean that it is unfeasible.
"there is no loss of energy converting from AC to DC"
Unless you have an extremely well insulated pressure tank, and use the air immediately after it's compressed, you are going to lose a ton of energy through heat loss.
@Mike10010100
There are still the losses from the "air engine" to consider. I highly doubt it will be more efficient than than a AC electric motor, which is 90+%. You can see my answer to Apreche below and it actually has the same consumption as a Tesla Roadster. Keep in mind these "cars" are basically fiberglass and weight close to nothing (which is why the comments on how the car is unsafe). A standard home pump will take 4 hours to charge the car up for 50 miles, though if you have a industrial pump it should be faster. The 4 hours is the same as for electric cars.
@Apreche
And this car still uses $2.50 USD of French electricity to charge up. French prices are 15.63 cents USD per kWh. This means a consumption of 16kWh/50miles = 32kWh/100mi. If you look at the Tesla Roadster it has a consumption of 32-33kWh/100mi city/highway (this includes all charging and battery losses, it is on the sticker of the car). So the efficiency is basically the same after considering all the losses. Except you have to consider the Tesla Roadster is a crash tested aluminum/carbon fiber car @ 2700lbs, has 250hp on tap, and it can go 0-60 in 4 seconds. The MDI MiniCAT (shown in the picture), on the other hand, is fiberglass, weighs 1200lbs charged up (apparently the 50 mile charge of air weighs 500lbs, so the weight is actually more than li-ion batteries!), and judging by their other cars, 25hp of power. Yet it has the same consumption.
(link to Tesla sticker)
http://gallery.me.com/mark.templeton/100092/Sticker-20Right/web.jpg
(link to source for $2.50 usd of french electricity)
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6138972/
(link to 15.63 cents USD french price)
http://www.thisfrenchlife.com/thisfrenchlife/2004/11/electricity_tar.html
(about the MiniCAT)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_Development_International
@ happy_penguin:
Every gas station has a fuel source, it's what you pump up your stupid tires with. Hell 50 Cents to by a tank load, man this is the stuff of dreams. when you consider that most people only commute about 40 miles per day anyway. then while everyone else is moaning about the price of gas. You'll breath a sigh of relief knowing that your compressed air hose is not busy and the compressed air can be done with solar, wind or wave generators and not carbon fuel sources. Duh, do you read at all?
Actually, from what I read and saw regarding this car, once you fill the tank with compressed air, the motion of the wheels (from the compressed air) powers an air compressor built into the car, so you're perpetually refilling the tank once you've filled it.
I'm not sure how much air it replaces, versus how much it uses, but there *is* an air-powered air compressor in the car.
And what do you mean "50 whole miles!" -- How many miles do you drive in a day? Most people don't commute more than 20 miles in a given day, so this would be perfect for them. Drive to work, drive home, plug it in and power the air compressor to refill for your commute tomorrow. The electricity needed to fill an air tank has got to be comparable to what it takes to charge my e-bike's batteries-- That is, about 50¢ worth for around 30 miles of travel.
Find me some gasoline that costs 50¢ a gallon, and you might have a point.
@soopergooman
You should read all the comments before you post. Look above you. You will NOT be charging this thing with a standard gas station air pump.
Unless you have a 100 pound bag of quarters and plenty of time...
It's going to take A LOT of energy to compress the air to something like 4500 psi. Yes, that's right, 4500 psi !! That's some serious pressure and will require a serious pump.
Yes, but how well does it run on smug?
It's the pressure that's important here, smog, air, any gas would work :)
Besides, the little particles in smog will be filtered out before the compression in a compressor
tomheivers has failed to recognise this hillarious south park reference. utterly.
*fart* *Snnifffffffff* ahhh, yeah this is probably way more inefficient than my hybrid. *fart* *SFFFFFFFFF* Mmm.
Correction: propelling Airsoft pellets at the neighborhood children.
*but seriously. we shoot cats. :P
Correction: Propelling cats at the neighborhood children.
Correction: ....
If anyone took that time to read up on the aircar you would know it takes a small amount of electricity to compress the air but the major problem is the car is VERY light and cannot carry load. Great for personal transport but crap for collecting the kids and getting your shopping.
Jeeze, how heavy are your kids??
You collect kids? Whatever I guess some people just gotta catch 'em all...
Is that a goatee or a trach hole on your avatar?
MDI is a sham. Go look at their web site. They have been "in business" for many years yet have not released one car for review. Look at most of the published articles and who published them. Won't bore you with the science but when you look at all the cascading conversion inefficiencies there is no way the system will deliver the speed and range claimed. It is far more efficient to take electricity, charge a battery and turn a motor. Not that long ago NPR did a story on them (by some addle-brained female) and a MDI spokes person suggested that they could put a compressor one of the wheels to recapture energy such that it could continue without any additional energy (perpetual motion). For those that are worried about safety you wouldn't believe what a FRP air tank looks like after it is ruptured. If it were in a car it would be a race on which would happen first: the widows would blow out or your eardrums would meet in the middle. For those that want more info Wiki is a good start.
" For those that are worried about safety you wouldn't believe what a FRP air tank looks like after it is ruptured."
That might be a fair concern, but in all seriousnous you are driving a in a death trap everyday and still think it is a exceptable risk. The same concerns can be made about Li-ion batteries known to explode in certain conditions. Unless you want to go back to riding horses(which frankly have their own risks), there'll always be a risk in motorized vehicles. No matter what propulsion you choose.
Basically only lithium cobalt (AKA laptop batteries) has the danger of exploding, but to my knowledge almost no automaker is using it in cars (Tesla Motors is the exception, but they have various electrical & thermal safety systems, as well as a giant aluminum box around the batteries to prevent explosions). Automakers have switched to more stable chemistries, for example the Volt using LiFePO4 batteries (the other reason is that these also have better cycle life). This kinds of cells don't explode or catch on fire even when punctured (look up a123).
I remember seeing a video of Alain Prost driving it around. Lol An ex-F1 driver going around in a put-puting car. Pretty funny. I believe it will qualify as a permitless car ie it won't go over 60kmh thus no drivers license is requiered(same as scooters)
Not so great for personal transport: Your face and/or that of your loved ones make up the crumple zone.
Have they pulled the same trick that the Gee-Wiz did and called this a motorised quadracycle to get around safety laws?
I'm offended that Engadget would even propose the idea of shooting such adorable cats.
Oh, my avatar? Eh, he wasn't adorable enough.
It doesn't look like it's hit the streets. More like it's hit the . . . inside of a mall.
Will it run Crysis? Also: IPhone.
...purple monkey dishwasher.
chicken 802.11n envelope transistor. Also :Zune
with the FIRST! shards of doom blended into crysis
While still a good idea 50 miles isnt that much... Can most people go to work and come back with 50 miles? How fast does it go?
@Kevo: Hahaha I can only see the neighborhood children's face when he sees a cat flying in his direction.... Awesome correction :D
Awesome! A 3 minute air charge and you are off for 50 miles. yazza!
A small diesel or gas motor would provide power for the air compressor onboard using maybe 1/2 gallon a day,if not already part of this setup.Obviously,I know nothing of this vehicle,it may already be part of the system.
Propelling airsoft at your roommates....
Does it come with a foot pump so that you can "recharge" after 50 miles?
Cat---apults ?
Why wasn't this car accepted in other countries? Or did the company just go to France because of how supportive they are of alternative fuels?
Anyone know what US gov has said about the car?
Here is an idea:
Take the compressed air concept, put it to airplanes and have them recharge their tank during flight. The fact that planes have a consistent 400 mile an hour stream of air passing by them so they can fill a tank of compressed air fast.
Then you can have a plane with no need to land. Perhaps it would be more useful for satellites, if they have air around them..
There is soooo much wrong with your comment I don't know where to start.
Mainly, the faster air is moving, the LOWER it's pressure, which is exactly how airplanes wings work to keep them aloft in the first place.
So how exactly would a plane travelling at 400MPH be able to fill up a compressed air tank without the use of a standard compressor that would require the use of standard fuels/electricity to power it, dummy?
Do you think that if superman held a air tank opena nd flew through the air that it would fill up with highly compressed air, moron?
Alright, I'm done and I apologize.
Actually, an aircraft traveling at speed does have many high-pressure zones. The air slows down as it is compresses at the leading edges of the craft. That's why the concord had to be specially constructed to withstand thermal expansion of the airframe (and why the shuttle needs heat shielding).
This compression is in fact taken advantage of in ramjet engines (afterburners are a type of ramjet). They have no moving parts and rely on the incoming air stream to pressurize itself to the point that fuel will spontaneously ignite when injected into the flow.
@AustinEpp
C'mon, man ... don't you know your science? Satellites are out in space, and there's no air there.
Plus, there's no such thing as perpetual energy, there's always a loss somewhere.
Really, this is a great thing! Batteries big enough to run a car will be far too expensive for normal people. I can actually imagine this thing being cheap enough to actually work!
Here is keeping my fingers crossed.
@AustinEpp
This is humor right?
Sort of like putting a wind turbine on top your electric car..
Energy isn't free.